Do Japanese Women Eat Sushi, Do French Women Eat Soft Cheese/Pate

[Visitor8]

I haven't read all of the posts yet but feel really compelled to reply to what I have read!

Listeria poisoning in pregnancy exists - it isn't some trick of the authorities to make eating choices difficult for pregnant women.

It is not a fallacy - having witnessed deaths of babies inutero from listeria and having contact with 2 other women who have lost their beloved babies thru this bacteria - let me assure you of this reality.

It is YOUR choice what you eat when you are pregnant. A likely outcome if you contract Listeria is the death of your baby inutero. So, be informed, make an decision based on the knowledge that we have.

Is it likely that you will contract listeria if you do not follow the guidelines? It's not likely but you are more likely to than someone who does eat "safely".

Listeria is found frequently in soft serve ice cream (even Maccas), soft cheeses like brie, fetta and camembert, rice that has been cooked, stored and cooled. Pre made salads. 6 out of 10 fridges randomly tested on an current affair show (cannot remember which one) had listeria present in the salads & other foods contained in the fridges.

Should you be paranoid? NO! As I have said before if you are sensible it's highly unlikely you will contract listeria. Wash salads well before preparing. Do not store uncooked rice in your fridge for later use. Wash your hands well etc etc.

Your body your choice but for those that think these are "rules" and restrictions put upon you by the pregnancy police - politely I ask you to think again. There were unexplained still births through the millenia - now all stillborn babies and their Mamas are tested for listeria as it's a known cause.

It's great if you have a "healthy and developmentally normal" child and ate "at risk" foods. Again clearly you most likely did not come in contact with listeria contamination during pregnancy if you had a live baby. The most likely outcome of Listeria contamination is foetal death - not developmental delays...

There are many women who have lost babies due to listeria and other reasons that now have a way to be avoided.

Is avoidance of certain foods for 9 months really such a drama??? I have been pregnant 12 times and frankly saw it as just what I did to give my baby the best chance - not a ball and chain.

Listeria loves a cool environment - refrigeration DOES NOT kill listeria. Heat does. Pasteurization heats the food & would kill the listeria at the point of pasteruization (if it were contaminated) but then the listeria bacteria can grow in the food once it is cooled in refrigeration.. Listeria favours foods with a certain ph.

I don't understand why some people think that eating things of the 'Don't Eat' list is ok?
Sure, you might have a bit of brie, or a piece of cold meat and nothing happen to the baby.... does that also make it ok to have a cigarette? Or to pop an ecstacy tablet? Or to have a shot of alcohol?
Yeah I know they might be seen as extremes but the information is out there for a reason isn't it? You do these things and the chances are something truly terrible could happen to your unborn child. Their not their for you to follow when you choose, they're there to save you the heartbreak of losing a child, through something you could have easily avoided.
I would hate to think that I lost my child over something so little as eating the wrong thing.
Sorry if I have upset or offended anyone, that was not my intention.

:yeahthat:

I am pretty shocked that people are saying that it is just a 'blanket rule'. I think if you lost a baby, or knew someone who did that you wouldn't be saying that.
i used to eat all the wrong things, I was young and dumb and didn't understand what Listeria was.
It can be passed through soil. It isn't killed by the cold. ONE bit of deli meat can cause it, so no it's not everything in moderation.
This pregnancy I didn't eat ANYTHING off the no eat list, and it was EASY... I mean I wouldn't think anyting was hard if it meant my baby wouldn't be put at risk. I would live off rice and water.
My friend found out the baby died from Listeria because she had a blood test and her baby had a spinal fluid test thing and both came back as positive.
You can have listeria and just think it's a tummy ache, or gastro.
Do what you will, but I don't think abstaining from some risky foods is hard when it's your babies life you are talking about.

[angelicdragon]

I think Christmas is going to be hard because the older generation don't seem to think it is important. My MIL does all cold meats for the family meal even though I have told her I can't eat them or the coleslaw. Normally I eat coleslaw, smoked salmon and had ham and tomatoe sandwiches every day but I go without while pg.
One of the small catered Christmas functions we went to the Chef came out and was astounded I knocked back both entrees.. one was deli meats and the other was cold seafood platter. I told him pg women can't eat things like that and why and he was moset put out. He seemd to think because he had put it on the plate it would be ok but where did it come from before he got it all out the packet?
It's not like a lifetime sentence it is only 40 wks of watching what you eat for a healthy baby. You eat other foods that are good for baby so what is so hard about avoiding bad foods.

I think the reason other than eating coleslaw (which back then I didn't know about) for why the Drs thought our stillbirth was Listeria was coz when I got to the hospital that evening I was continuous vomiting for no reason.

[ss_storm]

Very true angelicdragon! Even my DF is like that...he thinks I'm just being "paranoid"..no matter how many times I tell him I would just prefer not to take the risk of something happening that could have been prevented! Then goes on to tell me his mum smoked & drank throughout all 3 of her pregnancies yet all three kids "turned out fine"
Again, I have informed myself of the risks and simply prefer to cut those foods out of my diet for the time being, I can live without, and I would much rather a healthy baby at the end of it all, than sacrificing that chance for a slice of deli ham or a bit of cheese...

[paradise lost]

It is increasingly painful to read this thread.

I have lost two babies. Did it make me more worried about food? No. Sorry. It didn't. I do not believe i killed my babies inadvertently (though if listeria can lie dormant for 70 days NO WOMAN of childbearing age should be eating the "danger" foods) through what i did or thought or ate, but if i DID i believe in higher things than my own fallability. Those babies, heartbreaking as it is, were never going to be my in-arms children. They came to me for a reason, but they were never going to stay, and no amount of restriction or indulgence would have changed it - if it wasn't one thing it would have been another. I don't believe in Fate we can't change, but i also don't believe we can know why our lives look how they do - for ME (i'm not telling anyone else they should feel this way) SOME babies die. Some of them will be my babies. They die for a reason like everyone else. I might not be able to see or understand the reason, it might cause me horrible pain to be separated from my children-who-didn't-come, but i believe that for SOME reason, i am supposed to be, for now.

Some people go through senseless agony and loss to get one baby and others merrily shoot up and snort and mainline their way to a brood of 10 shockingly healthy babies (all removed by child services). There are greater forces at work than food bacterias and vitamin supplements. That's not "Truth" - other women who lost babies might NOT believe that and might feel they WOULD have their baby if they eaten or behaved differently, and i'm not judging them. Everyone has to live with their own feelings following a loss.

It is not fair to say "if you lost a baby you'd be careful". None of us, whatever our suffering, is in a position to tell another how to react to their own pain. I don't know why my first two children died, but the fact that i ate the sushi i craved when i was pregnant with my third doesn't mean i loved or wanted any of my babies less than a woman who decided not to eat what she craved.

Bx

[tutmae]

Very very well said, Hoobley.

[Junglemum]

Listeria does not distinguish between pateruized and unpasteurized food.

But isn't pasturisation a heat treating process there by making products from pasturized milk less likely to contain listeria? (Btw i agree with the rest of your posts FC! Just wondering about this. )

[Phteven]

Pastuerization kills germ that are already there but it doesn't stop new ones from growing.

[Kaydee]

the fact that i ate the sushi i craved when i was pregnant with my third doesn't mean i loved or wanted any of my babies less than a woman who decided not to eat what she craved.

Well said.

I don't understand why some people think that eating things of the 'Don't Eat' list is ok?
Sure, you might have a bit of brie, or a piece of cold meat and nothing happen to the baby.... does that also make it ok to have a cigarette? Or to pop an ecstacy tablet? Or to have a shot of alcohol?...
Sorry if I have upset or offended anyone, that was not my intention.

Lisa I don't think it is fair to compare cheese to ecstacy or cold meat to smoking....

this thread has really gone off topic hasn't it? I'm sure it wasn't meant to start a debate that isn't necessary. I'm sure we are all aware of the dangers and know the facts, but it ultimately is up to the individual what they decide to eat.