School leaving age is being raised

[Glamourcide]

*fuming* just wrote a huge post and then hit the wrong button. Dammit dammit dammit.


Lulu, perhaps I should have clarified a bit better than I did. By 'bumming around', I meant more along the lines that kids who leave school with no set career goals should study or be doing part-or full-time work, not career-driven but just at Big W or McDonald's, in order to take a break from the classroom and get some real-life experience in order to determine what direction they wish their lives to go in. I don't think I'm unusual in that I was unable to get any form of assistance from C'Link until I turned 21 if I lived with them, and their income is around $50k, so pretty 'average' as far as I'm aware... if I wanted to leave school and 'bum around', I either had to work or my parents had to support me, so it's not like there are a million teenagers sitting on the dole in their mum's living room at the age of 16, kwim? Yeah, I know some are, but their parents also have a choice, too - if they don't want to support their child, they can help them get work or boot them out on their bums - if they're mature enough to leave school they're mature enough to make those kinds of decisions.

As Dansta said, not 100% of people intend on going to university, not 100% of people are going to drop out, hit the dole queue and stay on it until they're grandparents, and not 100% of teenagers are clear on what they want to do with their lives when school finishes. If leaving formal education to take up paid work helps them decide, then surely that's better for everyone than to force them to sit in a stuffy classroom doing things they're completely uninterested in?

FWIW, I did do a program where I did 4 days at school, one at TAFE and twice a year I did two weeks of work experience. Nowhere did I learn anything about my rights as an employee, so I don't know if these programs have changed to include that kind of stuff but in my experience, they didn't, and so I was no better off being 'educated' than I would have been if I'd dropped out of school and worked at KFC from the time I was 15. I knew nothing about award wages or what lunch breaks etc I was entitled to as a worker.

I just think it's a really poorly-thought-out scheme. Fair enough, we want kids to stay engaged and get as much learning as possible before we unleash them into the big wide world. But why not just leave the age as it is, put more funding into alternative learning programs, and judge each school-leaver on a case-by-case basis in order to provide them with the right support? What is the difference between a 15-year-old school-leaver with no support, and a 17-year-old school-leaver with no support? I was offered an apprenticeship when I was in year 11, and my parents hit the roof at the thought of me not getting my year 12 certificate. So I passed up the opportunity, finished grade 12 and it's gotten me absolutely NOWHERE. It hasn't done a damn thing for me. I've worked casual jobs, in retail and hospitality, but I'm absolutely no closer to an actual career than I would have been had I dropped out in grade 10 and got a job at Macca's. I just think it's a really dumb idea to say that every 17-year-old with a high scool certificate goes on to big, bright things straight away - they don't.

Or is this whole idea a way for the government to stop providing support for 'premature' school-leavers? Meaning that if you transition from school to TAFE or an apprenticeship etc at the age of 15/16, the government and school will help you out with that, but when you graduate high school you're on your own with no help from anybody? So the government could well be making this legislation in order to shirk their responsibility to younger school-leavers...

[Lulu]

*fuming for you losing the post!

The only thing I disagree with is the part time thing.

I worked with my father (Occupational Psychologist) for 13 years, before that he was in Navy Recruitment so I get where you are coming from completely and I think it's a terrible idea myself.

No, not everyone is suited to a school environment - many, many teens thrive in paid employment and it's ridiculous to force them to stay there. Especially with programs like VCAL.

The worst thing Jeff Kennett did in Vic was to close down all the technical schools and build houses on them. Stupid, stupid stupid.

[Dansta]

No, not everyone is suited to a school environment - many, many teens thrive in paid employment and it's ridiculous to force them to stay there. Especially with programs like VCAL.

The worst thing Jeff Kennett did in Vic was to close down all the technical schools and build houses on them. Stupid, stupid stupid.

Vcal - from what i know from others doing has kept them in school and im not 100% sure but back in '06 there was talk of bringing in a VCAL/VCE thing. - just not getting an ENTER score.

Ohh and it was Kennett that shut the tec schools down - my bad i thought it was howard

Glamourcide has a point, that there is very little differance between a 15y/o leaving school with no support to a 17 y/o doing the same. i personally feel that if highschools did have a better branch system into tafes it may help as well as better ties to job recruitment agencies the early leavers may have a better chance of finding a job/career path that fits them better. I guess another thing (that once again i found) when i was in year 10 and wanting to do a trade (at an all girls private school) i felt very much pressured into VCE/Uni ect. so maybe a change in views of private schools needs to change, that while yes Uni is good - for those who want to go but tafe is also a good option for those who wish to work more with their hands (as such) I think a change in views with some parents needs to change, like Glamourcide my mother (more so then my father) freaked out at the idea of me doing VCAL as she assumed i'd drop out of school - she also thought i was taking the 'easy' way out as well, little did she know what i'd end up putting myself though. I also know that a few people who i know left school in year 10 and 11 most of them have a job, i think one is a 'bludger' but most left knowing they wanted to work also one of them has a hard time reading/writing but is amazing with numbers so hes working in a factory now, but he loves his job and he left school at 16, i think and he's now 29 and doing really well for himself. i think if he'd have been made to stay at school he wouldnt be doing as well as what he is now becuase failing at VCE would have been fairly hard for him to cope with, which i can understand i always used to say if i did my VCE i'd get "sympathy points"

[skeetaboat]

What is the difference between a 15-year-old school-leaver with no support, and a 17-year-old school-leaver with no support?

There's a heck of a lot in terms of maturity, confidence, ability, understanding of how life works, street knowledge, responsibility. (Not that either age group should be unsupported).

I think it's a great idea, provided that there are plenty of options that fit the variety of needs. VCAL has been a great move for the youngsters who aren't geared towards reading textbooks and sitting in a traditional classroom. Kids who come out of VCAL in my experience are quite a lot more worldy and well equipped for the workplace and to stand on their own two feet, than a 15 year old who leaves school in year 10.