Seen quite a bit of stuff coming out today.....
* why is the blackbox not emitting a signal
* flight paths changed on the radar website
* not wreckage anywhere (though if a plane was shot down, how does this aid that theory?)
So what do we think?
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Seen quite a bit of stuff coming out today.....
* why is the blackbox not emitting a signal
* flight paths changed on the radar website
* not wreckage anywhere (though if a plane was shot down, how does this aid that theory?)
So what do we think?
I don't have a conspiracy theory, I'm just very sad about the whole thing. I feel so much for the passengers families, they must feel so lost. I read that they've been able to ring mobiles so they were begging officials to track the signals before the batteries go flat.
There were also two infants on the flight :( Whenever something like this happens I can't help but put myself in their shoes, what would I do if I was on a plane that was crashing with my babies? I hate that it makes me think like that, it's too awful :(
One word: Lost. :lol:
Seriously though, I think this whole thing is absolutely fascinating and TBH, I'm kinda looking forward to the Air Crash Investigations show they do on it. I have no real theory about it really. The plane could be anywhere. Re the black boxes, they would be transmitting, but you have to be near the plane to be able to detect it I would have thought. I do hope that because they haven't found anything yet, that there is a tiny, tiny chance of them being found OK.
I agree, I was talking about it with DH - about how it is possible to lose something the size of a plane, he was saying he had watched some show about aeroplanes disappearing in the Bermuda Triangle, and apparently there is to do with a fault line in the earths crust where some gas bubbles up and causes all debris and whole planes to sink rapidly and be drawn into the fault line itself, and therefore never ever be discovered. Is called the Methane Bubbling effect apparently and on a site I was looking at it also said:
"And if some really large bubbles of methane gas were to rise in the atmosphere and then get sucked into the engines of a jet, they could make a nasty explosion"
So Methane Bubbles causing the plane to crash and then sinking/disappearing the debris - is my theory. (Would think the area round there must have a few fault lines, underground volcanoes etc?)
It's always the damn pitot tubes...:
I am finding the whole thing very interesting, from an academic POV. I choose not to think about it emotionally, otherwise I would never get on a plane again, or put my daughter on one unaccompanied to visit her father.
It took them 2 years to find the Air France plane that went down near Brazil.
The ocean is a big place and a plane isn't very large :(
The thing with the passports freaks me out. You would think that with the ease of running checks on passport number through interpol that ll passports would be run through.
TBH I think it's probably just a co-incidence that the fake passport guys happened to be on a plane that crashed. I hope they can identify them so their families don't spend forever wondering where they are :(
I was reading up on it today and the consensus is that black boxes should be scrapped. There was a plane that went down in the sea three years ago near France and it took them two years to recover the black box and by then, it was so damaged that they couldn't get anything from it. They have the technology to go live with pilots for each flight and that's what they should be doing.
I feel so sad about it and am trying to not get too involved in it. I keep hoping that somehow the plane with passengers safe will turn up. DH said that with the phones that are ringing, surely one has the find my iPhone app on it to track it! I just hope authorities are in fact doing everything they can and following every suggestion to track this plane down.
Apparently the tickets purchased for the stolen passports were pretty random, the guy buying them searched for the cheapest airfare and so it doesn't appear as though that particular flight was targeted for any reason. It doesn't seem very terrorising to me either - it is for the passengers and their families and friends, but it's not a big terrorism reach.
watching the news tonight, there was mention that the tickets related to those passports had been linked to individuals from (a country with a name that is escaping me at this point) - but that the men were trying to get to germany to seek refuge. i have no idea how they came to that conclusion (i had DD talking at me) - i am guessing something to do with identifying them through security footage or something, perhaps someone has come forward... i honestly don't know - but it does seem to fit with the search for the cheapest flight that was mentioned in a previous comment
i am trying to stay distanced from it all of it - it's heartbreaking for the families not knowing what is going on - i can't imagine that feeling
Wormhole. It's the only plausible option. We're about to enter the next phase of civilisation.
A small part of my conscious mind thinks it possible. It kicks off a world of imagination though.
BG - I think at least one guy from Iran travelling on a stolen passport has been cleared of terrorist links, most likely an asylum seeker.
I've been interested, but trying not to be emotional about it also. My girls are supposed to fly with a cheap airline here in June, & that's the last thing I want to think about.
I know people are thinking a mid air explosion, but surely they'd have found some debris by now. Some are thinking a ditch landing (went down into the water), but that doesn't explain the ringing phones... if there is truth to that story... I'm thinking if there are phones ringing, that its on land somewhere. In that case there will possibly be survivors if they can find it... But if they're on land why was communication lost. The only way I think it could've just disappeared off radar was the explosion theory.
Its frustrating me that there is nothing at all at this stage, it most be so hard for the families...
With the phones ringing, I read today that a technical person said it is normal when calling internationally for a phone to do a "fake" ring while the service provider searches for the phone.
Personally I think they're at the bottom of the ocean somewhere. They may have done a smooth landing on the water, well as smooth as it gets, and went down as a whole. Although a lot of plane piece are light and probably would have broken off anyway.
I would like to believe if they are on land at least one of 239 (or however many there was) would have got a call out by now if they were all alive.
I believe they are all gone. I don't hold out much hope for these sorts of things. Emotionally it breaks my heart, but academically I just can't know enough about it. Human nature I guess.
Yes with the Methane bubbles a contributing factor - is no one interested in Methane Bubbles as the culprit? :-):
I find it interesting that 'we' have become totally fine with the risks involved in car transportation, but yet still are pretty wary of airplanes especially around events like this. After events like this people always worry about airplane travel, but after lots of car accidents (e.g. many fatalities over long weekend) we don't all start worrying about car travel. The statistics for air travel are much better.
"Some interesting statistics about air travel:
Fatality rate (commerical flight): 4.3 deaths per 1,000,000 flight hours
Odds of being killed in a single flight: 1 in 13.57 millon
Survival rate of crashes involving fatalities: 24%
Likelihood of dying in a car accident vs plane: 62 times more likely
Likelihood of dying in motorbike accident vs plane: 2178 times more likely"
I think that has something to do with a misplaced belief/hope/desperation/rationale that we are more in control in the car. We are already on the ground.
In a plane, 20,000 feet in the air, once that catastrophe happens, you are either in the middle of an ocean, or a fireball in the side of mountain... We are so totally without means of effecting our fate that it becomes much more scary a situation.
Of course, as you said, the reality of the probability is much different, but the mind is more powerful.
It is very sad and very fascinating all at the same time. I actually know someone who was close friends with 2 of the Aussies on the flight....I am doubtful of a hijack scenario as surely a number of people would have gotten a text off to someone at the very least. Whatever happened had to have been very unexpected and very quick.
I am very doubtful of them still being alive somewhere also, (though I want them to be), it just doesn't make any sense that a rather large plane could land somewhere and not be noticed - it's just so unlikely.
I think like that French flight years ago, they will find the plane eventually somewhere deep in the ocean.
I don't subscribe to the various theories of various countries shooting the plane down....but then I don't think politically.....
I think they're looking in the wrong place. The search zones have been formulated based in the receipt of tracking data from the plane. There are assumptions about that data that have been made to extrapolate likely locations, but it's not clear whether the accuracy of the data has been adequately scrutinized.
Just saw a Malaysian dude on the telly saying they were even considering that it may have been engineered by someone trying to commit life insurance fraud. Really? WTF?
ETA - BG, I heard something about the fake passports being in relation to human trafficking, or escaping from a trafficked situation - ah, didn't hear it very well, but it does indicate there may be many other motivations & issues than are apparent at first glance
The news this morning said that both men were from Iran, but one of them was a 19yo who they believe was trying to get to his mother in Germany. It was just a coincidence that they were there on stolen passports. Now they are saying that the plane was 100's of km's off course because it was tracked for an hour after they said it was not being tracked. Too many stuff ups so far no one knows what the truth is right now. Such a bungled situation.
WYSIWYG, I buy your theory :lol: at this point anything is possible/plausible. Luna Moth, I've just finished reading the Rho Ship trilogy and even someone who created a wormhole and just happened to suck the plane through it is not too far fetched to me LOL.
I am thinking that they just had some sort of mechanical/electrical failure and dropped off radar and then had to fly really low for quite awhile to desperately keep the plane in the air. from what i read this morning that seems to be sort of backed up in that they were flying lower on the last military radar transmission.
I really feel for the families and friends left behind and it just makes you feel so sad to think that it probably didnt go down all that quickly. And of course we know that there were infants on board, but there also would of been children...as a parent it really hits home how intense it must of been for them all.
Yeah. Pony show. With wings.
I want to believe that they landed safely and are awaiting rescue.
Second choice is that it was a massive explosion and an instant, painless death.
Pretty sad that those are the best two outcomes :/
News is now reporting that officials believe the communications were manually switched off, which brings me to believe it's been stolen... Hopefully landed but not likely :(
I was talking about this yesterday at school pick up with another Mum. It's fascinating and scary to think a whole plane can just disappear.
We were discussing that perhaps the plane has been hijacked and taken to a country where sooner or later, ransom requests will be made for the safe return of the passengers.
Pretty far fetched I know, the other theory is the same as Wysiwigs (methane bubbles)
The kidnapping theory is a very interesting one. Especially when you look at how far away Beijing is, and then draw a circle with the same size radius and look at the countries that are inside of that circle (as places that would use a similar amount of fuel to get to). Very interesting.
ETA
But I also feel very frustrated as I'm certain there must be other (possibly much further away) countries with accurate (but secret) radar & satellite data who can't share it because (*ahem*) that would be admitting they are watching parts of the world that are none of their business. (A bit like China made a huge show of "announcing" that they were "deploying" satellites several days after the disappearance, like there was some big red switch that had to be turned on, & then nearly immediately reported something of interest). Tragic that the lives of a couple of hundred people could be hanging in the balance.
I was thinking the same when I read this earlier, but had an appointment we had to get to..:
With knowing how corrupt some of the officials are in some of those countries, it wouldn't be too surprising.. (I am talking about some personal dealings with some customs officials in some of these nations through work).
OK, so latest is that Malaysia PM has held a press release indicating they have looked at "more sensitive data" (ie, musta been someone else's) and have confirmed the plane's movements are consistent with someone on board taking deliberate action. ie, pointing more & more toward criminal activity.
Its scary that they have lost a whole plane. Scarier still they cant work together to find it or its remains... How these officals cant just join the dots already
So everything I'm reading/seeing/hearing now pretty much says hijacking is confirmed, unless the pilot had something to do with it - they're looking into his political background or something.
They're saying the flight communications were switched off within half an hour after take off, and they actually had contact with the plane, or it turned up on a radar or something, at 8:11am - seven hours after originally thought.
I actually 'like' the kidnapping/hijacking idea because then they're alive. I hope they're all being treated ok.
ERMA. GERD.
In breaking news, someone in the ****pit was heard casually saying "all right, good night" AFTER the comms tracking systems were disabled.
Flippin' flip. This just makes my blood boil, all this data must have been available from the time the plane disappeared - why has it taken this long for this info to be shared? A whole week of searching time has been wasted because some bozo(s) couldn't or wouldn't connect the dots any earlier.
My fear now (because it's gone well beyond the conspiracy theory zone) is that attempts were made to hijack it for terrorist purposes, and that someone on board (ie pilot, copilot) went through the motions of appearing to cooperate but flew as far out into the ocean as possible to take the plane out, Flight 73-style, to prevent a much greater tragedy elsewhere.
Wow, this is all just crazy! I really hope the poor families affected get some sort of closure, one way or another, soon.
What the hell? I don't see that as an inability to connect any dots, because surely they've had info like that all along? More and more I'm thinking it's that the officials, government, whoever thought "Oh ****. This is not good. What the heck do we tell people? Um, we lost it. That'll do, we know nothing." And then we get drip-fed more and more info that I can't really believe is only just coming to light.
DH and I have said all along that the officials know/knew more than what was being broadcasted. :( my heart hurts for the families of the passengers on the plane, who've been left in limbo all this time :(
It wouldn't surprise me if a government had a hand in it somewhere and for sure know more than they are letting on. It would be interesting to see who was on the plane and what occupation, knowledge, research, evidence etc etc they had.
The 'alright goodnight' comment was discussed last week on one news program that I saw. It was written off as the pilot saying goodnight to the one airtraffic control as the plane was handed over to the next.....:
They're concerned with the casual nature of the comment though, and the fact that it came after the communication/tracking controls or whatever it is was turned off. The pilot wad supposed to sign off properly, citing the plane's call sign and instructions for contacting the next tower. So they're going to analyse his voice for stress to see if they had been taken over prior to this and maybe he did it 'wrong' to alert them that something wasn't right.
That's what I took from the article anyway.
My theory is that another country has shot it down. A low flying, non responsive commercial plane in airspace it shouldn't be in? It would scream danger. I agree that the government knows more than they'll release but it's coming across really messy.
Ah yes, sorry I wasn't discounting that it was probably a strange comment, more that MD was saying how could they not have shared the info before now, it was at least mid last week I heard it mentioned.:
Ah I get you :) I still think they probably know a lot more than they are letting on.
I think there would be a while lot of information being withheld for now. They could be alive and already be negotiating for their release and the governments may not want to reveal that for now. However, the logical me says no, the passengers were killed after hours of emotional terror by the pilot who commuted suicide.
My guess is that the pilot was the one responsible for the change in course (that's why he had a simulator at home, to practice the radar evasive flight paths) and the muffled sounds on the radio from the Japanese bound plane 30 mins ahead may have come from a restrained co-pilot. The Pilot, upset by the actions of his family (they moved out the day before) snaps mentally, compounded by his sadness due to his political dissolution.
Engine data suggested that the altitude changed frequently to avoid radar so passengers & crew may have known something was up, maybe even began to start switching their phones on to reach family.
The plane eventually crashes 8 hours later (according to data the plane flew on) on land, where phones that survive the crash and were already switched on finally get a signal and ring, but ring out, which is what families said (I don't believe that excuse from tech people at all).
We'll find notes saved into people's phones about what happened. But sadly they all died :( now it's just a matter of where the plane is.
I too think it's a case of some of the less er... "flattering" info being suppressed, probably by different parties (bearing in mind there are civilian organisations, military, and governments involved across several countries in the region). BUT - someone in Malaysia was getting info from all those sources but fluffed it when it came to drawing conclusions about the several ways in which those chunks of info fit together into a bigger picture. Had those various scenarios been properly communicated, the search could have been widened much earlier.: