i would love to start a thread about girls going through hormonal changes or teenager girls .just to have a chat with mums going through the same thing would be great
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i would love to start a thread about girls going through hormonal changes or teenager girls .just to have a chat with mums going through the same thing would be great
Good idea... I'll be in it! I've at least two BooHoo threads about my 13yo DD!
i hear you i have a soon to be 13 yr old
and a 11 yr old going through hormonal changes
i thought if i chat about it it will keep me sane
Count me in, there are days when I could kiss my 16 yr old and days I could kill her LOL Even my frineds say "where did our beautiful sweet Jess go??"
Count me in aswell, my DD is 13 next month and just dont even bother looking at her at the moment. :doh:
I really hate to tell you ladies- it doesn't get easier for a while yet :(
MrsMac...thanx for that just what I really want to hear right now. :pray::pray:
Sorry hun! Maybe we could just send them all off to some boarding school??????? (I can really see why people used to do that now!) ITs just different Mel, they push different buttons and want differnt things when they are older. I always say that there are a lot of similarities between Jess (16) and Riley's (2) behaviour atm!
:wall:I think the worst thing is she thinks she is mother and bosses DS7 and DS8 around so then they fight and all breaks loose, then says she didnt do anything ggrrrrr :wall:
Oh yes I hear you on that one- we had to constantly tell J that she is not E's mother and should not treat her like she was (and not in a good way either LOL) Funnily enough she is fantastic with DS and is a great babysitter just her and her sister clash.
DD is gr8t with Cooper aswell, she gets him up in the morning makes his weetbix and feeds him ect but the other two she is shocking with.
my 11 yr old thinks she is everyones mum but sometimes shes a great help but then somedays its just too much .
my 13 yr goes through stages at the moment shes ok i can actually talk to her but somedays she scares me the way she chucks a tanty and my 11 yr old the same i might as well have twins cause there both going through the same thing .
i just hate the way they talk to me there treating me like crap
Thats not good Jessabel, my DD may dismiss my ideas or look at me like I'm so out of touch but she is basically polite to me eg she would never swear at me or say horrible things to me.
I just had the biggest argument with DD....she went to my sisters for the weekend, and I went to put her clothes away yesterday and her room was a pigsty, I said to her she had to clean her room tonight and her job is to clean the kitchen, she went into her room at 6.30 pm and I thought she was cleaning, she hadnt done the kitchen either well I went to lay down at 7 as I had a bad headache, Cooper woke me up at 9 he was screaming so I went into him I opened DD door to see how much she had done and tell her dont forget the kitchen, well sh was asleep with her TV on and ipod in her ears, hadnt touched her room, so I woke her up and told her to get out and do the kitchen I took the TV out of her room and took her Ipod off her aswell, told her she doesnt get the tv back for a month and can have her ipod back when the room is done, she cracked it, about half hour ago my mum rings me to see what is going on, she then used her mobile and called my mum REVERSE CHARGES to say she hates me and wants to go live with her and how we dont let her do anything the list just goes on and on, so now she has also had her phone taken away. TEENAGES :wall::wall::wall:
Oh Mel you poor thing. Hopefully your mum supports you? I miss my mum terribly now that DD is a teen cause I have noone to ask how I was and what she did (Dad is very self centred and doesn't remember anything that doesn't directly involve him and i hated him as a teen)
I need to make a confession now, this is something I am embarrassed about so don't usually discuss but my DD now lives with my dad (her grandad) a km away because the situation between her and DH got out of hand- they both hate each other and it was doing my head in. I am not completely happy with her at dads cause he has a new girlfriend and spends heaps of time with her and doesn't seem to look after Jess (I know its not his job) Jess refuses to come back cause DH is so mean to her (he is, he has told me she no longer exists to him) DH is not her biological father but has been there since she was 6, her biological dad vanished without trace when she was 2 1/2. I know there are jealousy issues between them and he found all these sms she sent saying how much of a b@stard he was and how he was her step monster etc (he has never ever referred to her as anything but his DD) I know he is hurt but he is so immature about it.
Anyway sorry ramble over, just pointing out that even though she may not swear at me and hate me things are pretty bad here with regards to my mothering skills.
Count me in too!!
oh the joy of teenage girls eh???
I did read that book that someone recommended (i think it was you mrsmac) princess b!tchface syndrome... and it did help put some perspective on the situation.
Laura has recently had AF start - and was extremely impressed with how she handled it all, much better then I did when i started. I think AF might be about to pay a visit again soon, she is as moody as all hell, and the attitude - OMG!! the way she speaks to EVERYONE in the house is driving me nuts. I could slap her! Bossing around her brother constantly, moaning about DH (who is her step-dad ... so I hear you mrsmac - the whole blended family thing ugrh!! my DH behaves the same, and I'm like HELLO who is the adult here!!!!) and basically behaving like she is the most hard done by child in the universe.
Mel - we do the same thing when laura misbehaves - take away the things that are important to her - music, phone. and be consistent with it. I have actually stopped myself from engaging with her when she is arguementive, i found it only excerbates the situation - its hard, because all i want to do is yell back at her you ungratefull so and so... but I state the facts, and then if I have to walk away.
It did get worse before it got better though, and will probably get worse again, but at the moment I can actually see her thinking "right, if I keep going here I'm the one who is going to suffer the consequences of my own actions..so maybe I should just stop..."
My son Nathan is the one who cops it the most, i liken it to the whole pack thing - you know, he is the next down in line, so when she is p!ssed at mum and dad, instead of turning it on them, she turns it on him. and then of course, he can stir her mercilessly... with great delight!!
Laura and I got a book sent to us for our birthdays (which are close together) kaz Cook's Girl Stuff. It really is a great book, and has been the point of departure for many conversations between us. Even when I don't think she is listening (got that pinched expression her face that says loud and clear WHAT WOULD YOU KNOW MUM!) she really is, and quite often comes back and apologises for her words, or will start a conversation about whatever it was I was saying....
for the moment I really do think the biggest difference to how she is behaving has more to do with how I am behaving... if that makes sense. It is hard believe me, to not engage in it, but if I want her to learn how to manage her own behaviour, I have to model it. so its been good for me too. I think the fact that I could hear myself in her tone, and behaviour made me actually cringe - and take a step back and go whoa, hang on a minute, no use talking the talk, but not walking the walk.
anyway, that's where we are at at the moment...tomorrow may be totally different, and I could be pulling my hair out again, in the mean time I will enjoy the reprieve while its on!
I had a really long post done and I lost it.
Mrs Mac, DD is not DH's either, I left her dad when I was pregnant and DH has been around since she was 2. I was going to put her up for adoption when I was pregnant and my family talked me out of it saying I would regret it ect, as at the time I was in no frame of mind to raise a child still clubbing 4 nights ect, Mum said she would raise her I would have unlimited access to her ect and she would always Know that I was her mum. In reality it has been a lot different yes she hasnt stopped me seeing her and she knows I am her mum, but my sisters have also all played apart is raising her making decions ect and she calls my mum mum not me (that is the thing that hurts the most). All was working out like this til last year when Cooper was born and an argument she had in the shops with my mum becasue she couldnt get her own way (mum spoilt her rotten) so she decided that she wanted to live with us, um phoned me and we discussed the situation she had 2 weeks of the school term to go, grade 7 then half a semester, we tried to tell her stay there till primary schhol finished and high school with us but she wouldnt and came to us that weekend, She doesnt understand that has been changes for everyone, Cody is noticing he is no longer the oldest ect and DH says when she isnt here it is so peaceful (it is) if she doesnt get her own way straight on the phone to mum ect her says she isnt getting involved but she does, so in saying thatis making it difficult for everyone. We cant get her to do dishes clean her room or anything as mum did absolutley everything for her. Anyway best go gotto do the school run.
KAZ KOOKE .....Girl stuff my dad got her that for Christmas I might actually read it today.
Mel - it sounds like she is testing your boundaries - big time! another brilliant book that I read, and saved my sanity was Boundaries with Kids. It is a christian book - so there are bibilical references in it, but having said that, I'm not a christian, and tended to flick over them. it doesnt take away from the overall messages - which basically that actions have conseqences and taking responsiblity for your own behaviour and the choices you make- now and when you grow up. after I had read the book I sat down with Laura and nathan and told them that this was what would be happening. this was about 4 years ago. and yes we still have our ups and downs, but overall things are monumentally better. it did get worse before it got better, but I just kept reminding myself that I was over the fighting, yelling and nagging... and it got me through.
the whole blended family thing is painful and has a unique dynamic all of its own!! often I feel like I have two families - one with DH and aston, the other with laura nathan and aston... drives me nuts!
I'm glad you took her phone off her, and the other things, be consistent with her, you have done the right thing, no matter how much she yells at you, YOUR THE MUM and you make the rules. She may have been able to do what she wanted when and where when she was with your mum, but she chose to come and live with you, so she has to live by your rules. Hang in there Mel. have a look at Kaz Cooke, see if you can get a copy of Boundaries with Kids, and talk talk talk... and I know how hard it is - but DONT engage with her when she is being arguementive.... just repeat after me... "when you are ready to talk to me calmly I'll be ready to listen..." and walk away. :hug:
Just reading this (in terror since my teen (in 11 years...) DD will have a step daddy and a daddy....) and wanted to share with you Mel, something my own mother did to my sister when she wouldn't do her chores. Sis was supposed to do the dishes. If she didn't my mother would serve her meals on dirty plates. Not everyone's, just hers. So she would "get" the link between her inaction and the consequence of it. Sis was 14 at the time and within two meals was doing her chores.
I will admit that since we had our own rooms, mum let us keep them however we wanted, but she didn't go in there either - like if we wanted clothes washing we either did it ourselves or put them in the family washing basket (which we took turns at sorting/washing). She did not come in our rooms to rescue our clothes and she insisted on correct attire. i.e. if you left your school uniform on the floor on Friday you went in stinky and crumpled on Monday...
wow ladies im so glad i started this thread i so hear you on alot of thinbgs we have a blended family
and we the same we take things off the girls when there getting punished .
i must admitt clarissa seems to be getting better least we can talk and this year shes even starting to talk to me about things we are great but still there are days and oh my god you think who are you .
its like my girls are taking it in turns clarissa has a bad day then its kates turn .
kates just starting to turn into this girl that you dont know least i know with clarissa theres a light at the end of the tunnel not like last year when clarissa
was going through it i really felt this were not going to get better .
i realised alot of things that workand alot of things that dont work
Just wanted to say... teenage boys can be just as trying! Hoobley I do the same with Joshua and his clothes... if they're not in the washing, they don't get washed...as for his room, I only ask he makes his bed. He's not too bad with that.
I noticed a few who have kiddies living with dad/mum... Joshua lives with his dad (his choice mostly) but I tell you they butt heads like nothing else and I'm at my wits end with it sometimes when Joshua calls me because he hates living there but doesn't want to live here cos his mates are there.... *sighs* it's not a fun part of being a parent that's for sure... although I must say that I'm so grateful that just in the past few months Joshua seems to trust me enough to come and talk to me about things more now. It's taken many, many hard years of letting him know that he can come and talk to me about anything at all. My number one rule is I will do my best not to get angry about it... and for the most part I don't. What's the point? The point is he now is telling me stuff - even stuff he knows I won't like... he will say, you probably won't like this mum but... and the other day I asked him - is it something I will like or something I will think you're silly for doing and he said you'll probably think I was silly. I've told him that I might not always like how dad does things either he's still his dad and he needs to show respect to him. He knows that he can talk to me to get it off his chest but that I can't necessarily fix what his issue or problem is but that it's better to get it out than to keep it all bottled up. Slowly but surely I think that the calm approach with teens seems to work... well it does mostly...lol. Don't get me wrong though there are days when I could do a Homer Simpson and just strangle him but then the next day he will be the nicest kid you know.
My cousins (both girls) attended boarding school during their teen years. They lived on a farm and because they were both heavily involved with sport (couldn't do it otherwise) their parents allowed them to board at the school, a girls' school. This arrangement seemed to work really well. They would return home for the weekends and school holidays. Honestly, they have the best relationships with their parents.... always have had. Lots of affection, even in public. My aunt and uncle are quite strict, no nonsense kind of people too. Last time I spoke to them they highly recommended the boarding school option... I always thought that was a "cop out" solution until recently! I think the fact that the school would be enforcing all the routines that I find hard to be consistent with: supervised home work sessions, dinners eaten at the table without ipod head phones and involving polite discussion, keeping living quarters tidy and organised. Because I have the large gap between my children I often find that I am "caught up" with dealing with the boys routines and can't focus on my DD as much as she needs, especially of an early evening. I can barely help her with her homework... the boys make noise and want to be involved... fortunately DH does that after the boys have gone to bed and when i need to fall in a heap somewhere!
Our biggest problem is that we have no extended family that are available or active in the raising of our kids. They are nearly all in the country. If only I could send my DD off to stay with them occasionally!
I grew up in a blended family. My parents separated when i was 12. My stepfather was pretty violent too. It got so bad that when he threatened to send me to boarding school I eventually agreed!!! But obviously he decided that he had better things to spend his money on :( So life went on with me at the local highschool... getting pretty bad grades because I was so distracted by an awful homelife.
I really think that if we had my cousins/aunts/uncles/grandparents around to reinforce everything that I was telling DD that it would be better. DH tries to be her bestfriend instead of a parent half the time. I'm left to be the "bad cop" in the "good cop, bad cop" scenario he kinda constructs. The worst thing is that he disagrees with me infront of her about consequences for her poor behaviour :( Oh and he demonstrates very poor frustration control... I know where she gets her Drama Queen genes from! His Irish temper! :wall:
DD tries to be the boys' mother as well. She barks orders at them. Tries to tell me what to do and how to do it. Whips them up into a frenzy while I am trying to cook dinner every night then wonders why, when she has had enough of them and wants to watch TV, wonders why they are all hyper and wanting to jump all over her! This is an almost nightly event. I've taken to separating them all at about 6pm otherwise the house is like a zoo (they end up fighting).
She won't keep her room clean either but she will happily tidy the boys' rooms so i'm as relaxed about that as I can be. She keeps her bathroom in a total state of filth though. Hair everywhere. I can't stop her from cutting her own hair. Y'know I thought I was going to be fine with the whole teenager thing. I thought I was a pretty open-minded person with a fairly alternative aesthetic... but I never expected my DD to have such an opposite aesthetic. She is such an attractive girl but the look these days is just so plain ugly! But I guess that's their role: to define themselves as totally different to "us". Rest assured that whatever clothes and hairstyle that you dislike the most will be the one chosen by your teen DD. If you are a Goth they will probably prefer a neat and conservative style worn with a twin set! If you are a hippy mumma your DD will emerge in a suit and hair in a tight bun!
I have friends that make me feel like I must be doing something wrong: maybe it's ME who has become boring? They are friends with either no children or very young children. Well they are lucky I'm not the kind of person who will tell them: "I told you so!!!" if and when they have a teen to raise!!!
Quick girls!! Dye your hair black and go waaay over the top on the eye makeup.
Wear band tshirts, even if you dont know who they are. Use words like, angst, misunderstood and phrases such as " you will never understand me", and the classic "its MY life"
That should guarantee us a daughter that dresses in twinsets and pearls....
BTW - on the room issue. DD got cr@apped off when I asked her to do the weekly clean/vacuum of her room, stomped in there and right onto a needle she left on the floor (at least she does her own hems I suppose), it snapped off in her foot and she is now up at he hospital waiting to have it removed......
Oh Lulu what a lesson to learn! Hope shes ok.
We have a blended family with my two older dds from a previous relationship though i feel blessed to say our dramas are fairly minimal right now. Last year we did have a lot of boundary pushing with Jess, but alot of that was fairly age appropriate and a mix of interesting friends with limited parental involvement.
I have found that its so important to have the lines of communication open so that you can hear about anything and everything you possibly can about what is going on in their lives. Fortunately i have chatterboxes who seem intent on telling me every last detail..whether it be an 'omg mum you should have seen what this girl did today....' or 'mum this guy asked me out blah blah blah...'.
Because we had the blended family despite the fact that I seperated while pregnant with Emily and Darren has been involved since Emmy was 18 months and Jess was 3 I was and have always been the diciplinarian. Thats not a cop out for Darren who always backs me up, but I just felt that it was in all of our interests to establish that right from the very start.
Thanks for everyone for sharing your stories..it certainly helps knowing that we all are in no way alone...teenagers are interesting and fun but they can also be very tiring!
Jo
i just wanted to say bathsheba freinds shouldnt make you feel like that
you are a good mum im sure and you are doing what you can so dont let anybody make you feel like that
Aww ta Jesabell :) it's so funny watching friends become parents a decade or so after you started and seeing how much they end up contradicting themselves. Our closest friends (a couple) knew us waaaay back when we had our DD. I was 25 when i had her just before Christmas 1994. These friends invited us to their New Year's Eve party a week after I gave birth. They were childless as were all the people who attended the party. When we were first invited I gave a non-committal reply to the invitation... saying that we weren't getting much sleep and were still adjusting to parenthood (I had never heard of a babymoon at that stage). Anyhow they told us that just because we had a baby wasn't an excuse to go all boring "COME OVER!!!" they demanded. So we did. As we arrived our DD was sleeping in her capsule. Our hosts told us to "just put her in the spare room with the coats, she'll be fine"... so we did... and I proceeded to check her every 10 minutes... never relaxing enough to actually enjoy the party... we left soon after midnight knowing that a good nights' sleep isn't garanteed for us, unlike the rest of the part goers... and neither of us were drinking of course, you can't do that and be in charge of a newborn! Fast forward 11 years. This couple have their first baby. We drop in and see them at their place and only stay about 15 minutes because they are obviously exhausted, this is about 2 weeks after the birth. 3 months later we invite them over and they say "oh no... it's just too hard to go out with the baby and we're just sooo tired". Hmmmmmm! Needless to say they have forgotten how they accused us of being boring... we're not reminding them... but it's fascinating to see them doing all the things they had contempt for prior to having children!
Lol... I would remind them... hahaha the evil side in me!:
As for your DD's "look"... Joshua wanted to cut his hair a certain way and his dad wouldn't let him ... well a few weeks later he went out behind his dad's back and got his ear pierced instead! I always wondered why he wouldn't let him get his hair cut though cos it wasn't something strange that he wanted...he wanted a similar type of thing to Kyle Sandilands actually.... go figure huh.
Lulu, I hope they get the needle out of your DD's toe.. I saw your other post... lol @ kharma though huh.
Bath I think Id want to remind them as well!
Jo
Yeah? But they wouldn't thank us... it'd probably just strain the friendship. There are so many things that I'd like to tell them regarding their parenting choices... I don't want to sound smug. They are now expecting their third. And I'd hate to be reminded of all the things I did wrong as a teenager... I felt so justified! Lulu: I did my fair share of stomping but only when my stepfather was out because if I did that with him around I would have been dragged back to square one and forcibly made to walk properly with him holding my arm in a vice-like grip until I demonstrated compliance. I think this is one of the reasons I get so annoyed by DD... she doesn't have to live in fear... why the hell does she have to make a fuss!? All comes back to "comparing" (remember my thread?) Is it useful... would either my friends or my DD really benefit from me comparing?
I too would remind them. My youngest sister has 2 younger boys well 7 and 2 and she is always on my back on how notonly to raise DD but the boys as well, she must think she is the perfect parent, anyway she was on the phone having a go at me that I have decided to send cooper to childcare a couple of days a week, so she demand to know my reasoning, I tell her he needs time with kids his own age I need a break I am raising 4 not 2 and I dont want him to be a mummies boy which he already is wont let anyone else touch him or pick him up ect, she says well you are doing the wrong thing he doesnt need it ect (she lets her kids call her a b!tch). Then goes on about how I wont let DD go to a private school I pointed out we cant afford it, she said well my son goes and we make ourselves afford it , I say DD is happy at the school with the freinds she has, then goes on to say KIds from state schools are nothing but trash who get into drugs ect and we arnt helping the situation by not enforcing her to go to an all girls school, I asked how to pay for this she said ask mum to pay for it, or work 76 days a week otherwise this is just the tip of the iceberg, I realise that it will probably get worse before it gets better but I really pity her when her kids are older I hope they give her Hell.
Hey everyone. Well done on starting this thread jessabell. I have a 12yr old dd and my dp is finding it difficult to cope with her atm, we have been together 2 years and she is use to having to only listen to me so we have a fair few conflicting arguements in our household. We have just had a beautiful ds and things are going fine so far, but i am just waiting for the next arguement to errupt. I have read all the posts and sympathize with you all, it seems there are more blendid family's out there than i thought with issues. Hopefully venting and discussing our problems with each other will help.
i hope so to abb
at the moment things are fine at my house but when the next bad day happens it will be nice to get on here and talk about it
hope you dd alright lulu
The most important thing for my relationship with my daughter (all my kids actually) that it be a better one then the one I had and still have with my own mother. In the process I don't want to extinguish my daughter's light, or break her spirit. Her determination, confindence, passion are things that I admire greatly in her. all things that I didnt have (due to a highly dysfunctional and abusive family and father)
sometimes walking that fine line of teaching her how to be respectful, without pulling the "because I'm the mother" said -in- a- very- harsh -disrespectful- tone -card is hard. It is so difficult to know how to parent when the role models you had were crap.
I have to look outside my own biological family for role models, and have read a lot. some of it is great, some of it is yeah right in a perfect world wouldnt that be nice....
so - how are everyone's beautiful daughters travelling??? or should I ask that question at around the time of the next full moon :lol:
So true Vicky about it being hard to know how to parent well when your own role models were crappy.
Well ever since Sunday I seem to be surrounded by mothers and daughters who are comfortable showing lots of outward affection to each other. Yesterday my neighbour and I bumped into each other up the street and her teenage DD (a year older than my DD) wandered up to her (it was lunch break at her school nearby) and greeted her mum with a hug and a kiss. On the weekend i was talking to an older mother who's 19yo DD was lovingly stroking her hair while we were in conversation and looking at her so adoringly. My DD hasn't done that since she was about 6yo. When we are talking to people she'll stand beside me scowling at the world. I really must be doing something wrong. :(
no i think some kids just grow up and stop showing affectinate well my did i cant remember the last time clarissa gave me a kiss on the lips she gives me her cheek .
some nights i just grab her and give her a kiss .i still know they love me although dont hear it often but if somethings wrong they come straight up to me isnt that wrong but sometimes when there upset i like it cause i get the best kisses and cuddles .
i just try and remember what i was like at that age and i was the same i dont even think i gave my mum kisses at clarissas age .
*shakes her head at Bath*
Will you please, please trust your parenting a little better??? C'mon girl EVERYONE goes through a hard time through puberty/teen years. Remember, she is stretching into a new skin and trying things out. Give her a soft place to fall, she will come to you....
You know the letting go thing means we realize that we cant be the only ones teaching life lessons anymore. Its important to let them make the mistakes now, when the problems are small partly so they have the confidence to make the right decisions, but also to commiserate if they get it wrong.
And another thing Bath (!)- you don't know what those other mothers/daughters have been though to have the bond that they do. DD and I are always closer after we have weathered a storm together....
Well after a peaceful 2 days the monster in DD has emerged again GGRRRRRRRR..........this time because she wants to go shopping with her freinds which isnt the problem I said would give her $50 and that was her pocket money in advance for 2 weeks she wanted $80 and still wants pocket money, I took her shopping yesterday and spent $130 on her.......so she chucked a tantrum so is now not allowed to go at all :wall::wall:
Hi everyone.
Just a short post, i have been a bit concerned my dd (12) was not copeing with the new baby etc. We had parent teacher interviews at school today and it was run by the students. Dd had to stand in front of me and her teachers to explain the work she has done in class so far this year, also go threw her portfolio and watch video footage of speeches, plays etc she had done in class. Then she had to talk about her goals for the rest of the year and her career goals etc. After listening amazed at how well she presented herself and work to us, her teachers went on to tell me how grown up she has become in the last term, how her work has improved to the point that next term she will be doing year 7 work (she is in grade 6), every teacher had fantastic things to say about her, not only her work but her attitude and maturity. I was so very proud but i must admit a little shocked i mean i know she is intelligent but i always thought she lacked a little confidence and was a little complacent with homework etc. I am so very happy and proud of her ad hope she carry's on improving when in secondary school.
Sorry about the "me" post but i just wanted to once post something positive about my dd as i think sometimes i dwell on the negative's a little too much and need to see the good in her also.:clap::D
Just testing this thread.
I can see there are replies after my post June 13th in the menu, but cant see them when I get here....
oh abb that is just wonderful!! reach over and pat yourself on the shoulder hun. it so nice to get some positive feedback isnt' it. Your doing a wonderful job - DD is the proof of that. :cheer:
lulu - it was the same for me, but your post has seemed to make it work again.
mel - well done on standing your ground. its hard though isn't it - when they are chucking it big time. my dd was having massive tantrums that would go on for hours, with lots of door slamming ,screaming at each other, her taking off (where she thought she was going is anyones guess - we live on a farm!) Anyway, after some discussion with her when she was in a calm rational state, about conseqences of her actions, and taking responsibility for her behaviour, there has been a change - you can actually see her "thinking" about what she is doing, and instead of hours of tantrums, she pulls herself into check. In hindsight I can see now that it was cyclic, and she has recently started her period, so I think that it was all part of the moodiness and irrationallity in past months. Hang in there mel. I know how hard it is, I would look at laura and think where has my beautiful daughter gone??? She will come back, I promise. just stick to your guns, have firm boundaries, and be consistent. :hug: