17yo DSD Wants Rental Place - How Feasible?

[Marlene]

My DD moved out at 16 to live with her boyfriends and his parents, but that didn't work out and they found a private rental. It's a totally unique situation though, the house is next to his Grandparents and hadn't been lived in for 10 years. The owner has the land as an investment, as it's in an industrial area, so they actually went to him and asked if they could rent it. They don't have a lease and the rent is only $70 a week. She always seems to land on her feet! I don;t give her any financial assistance, but our situation is different as she ran away from home.

If you are considering giving DSD financial help, maybe only do it as long as she continues her schooling, and only help her out with school fees/stuff for school etc... If she wants to play grown-ups she needs to be able to stand on her own two feet and BE a grown up.

[PumpkinZulu]

She won't be eligible for unreasonable to live at home UNLESS it's because you are moving more than 90 minutes from her school . I still think it goes on your income anyway so that's out for her. And you aren't kicking her out either, and she isn't at school anymore (?)

She would still be eligable for unreasonable to live at home I think Lulu. The reason DF put was that it was causing undue stress on all parties, there was constant arguing/fighting, and all of this was distrupting his studies and he wanted to be indipendant, so he was. The froms don't say anything about school, it just asks you to list the reasons why you consider it unreasonable to live at home etc etc.

Unreasonable to live at home

ETA: If she's not at school I'm not sure how easy it would be for her to recieve it, if at all...but I guess there's no harm looking into it?

[Jennifer13]

Back in the old days when I was 17 I moved out of home into my own rental place.

I didn't share, I was dealing with the difficult fall-out of a dreadful family situation and desperately wanted my own space. To qualify for rent assistance and a higher level of Austudy (can't remember what it was) I had to fill out a stat dec with my reasons for no longer living at home. I only moved about 10 mins away from my family home. I concede that was so long ago that no doubt the last ice age may have seen some changes come in since.

I got a flat through a friend. Her parents owned two units and she rented one, I rented the other. After six months I moved in with a different friend and that was a disaster. You don't need anything fancy on your own, and after several failed attempts at sharing I ended up renting a granny flat - best decision ever! Not too $$ but I had my own space and no more flatmate dramas.

I never had any trouble getting a place, my first rental was through a RE agent, even though my friend smoothed the way for me. If you rent privately (like a granny flat) you'd have even more leeway. The important thing would be to have good refs and be able to prove you can afford it. If a landlord is going to be ultra-picky, they probably aren't worth renting from anyway.

Moving out at 17 was a great decision for me, not just because of my family issues, but in terms of giving me space to grow, managing my own life and really becoming an adult. If she knows you are there to support her I think she's got a great safety net and she'll probably do much better. GL!

[Lulu]

PZ, there are different reasons and classifications. The forms don't always give all the information as it's assessed individually. It's not reasonable to be supported by the govt just because you don't want to live under your parents rules iykwim?

The school can come into it because it is unreasonable to travel so far to continue education - this part is important for the country students that need to leave home to get be closer to Uni/TAFE etc. Or if your parents move away from your school.

There are grounds if there are family issues - but in this case SDD just wants to be independent and is not being asked to leave home. Income more than likely will affect all this anyway.

If she does leave without a job - Fi let her know Clink will HASSLE THE CRAP out of her to look for a job/go to the job centre etc etc etc.

[PumpkinZulu]

Oh okay, thanks Lulu I was under the impression that DSD was causing a few problems/stress to the family etc, but I may be mixing this up with someone else on the forum And yep, Clink WILL hassel the crap out of her, my brother is a 'job seeker' and it is not fun! More worthwhile just getting an actual job IMO haha.

[fionas]

Yep, I'm not sure that the 90 min thing will apply - her current school will be 90 mins away from where we're moving to but obviously there's other local schools that she can go to - just that she doesn't want to transfer. At this stage she SAYS she wants to finish VCE but her grades and attendance don't support that, so she may get kicked out anyway. She always seems to 'get' that it's important to carry on at school, do as well as you can, you'll have more options that way - we'v been telling her that for three years and she says all the right things. But she skips classes, doesn't do homework, fails every subject and still believes she will get into uni. There's only so many pep talks/punishments you can give - she needs to learn the hard way that actions (or in this case inaction) have consequences.

Yep, I'll make sure she knows about Centrelink hassling her - I mean, she'll NEED a job anyway to pay rent, buy stuff so that will be a good incentive in itself. And, as I said before, a much better incentive than if she failed school, was living with us and it was just us telling her she needed to get out of bed and get a job.

[Lulu]

Don't they have VCAL at her school? It's half working, half schooling....

[fionas]

Just to clarify PZ - I've certainly posted a few vents about DSD but it's fairly mild stuff in the whole scheme of things. I've kind of withdrawn from the situation a little and am not putting in much effort with her. There's a whole lot of reasons for this and without bogging down this thread, the bottom line is that there are no real arguments, the atmosphere in the house could be better but it's certainly civil and probably a whole lot better than in a lot of houses. So room for improvement but definitely not a crisis situation.

[fionas]

Yep, they do Lulu. Unfortunately, as the stepmum I always feel like I should leave the school side of things to DP (who is very hit and miss). I've just asked him AGAIN to arrange a talk with her coordinator to see where we're at in terms of attendance/finishing VCE/other options. I've actually been suggesting the VCAL thing for the last 12 months.

[PumpkinZulu]

Good to know. It would probably be more beneficial for her to be working anyway, to pay her own way completely. Like Lulu said VCAL is a good option that gets them out there learning some really good skills/trades that can be applied in real life, and they leave qualified do do a lot of courses.

*whoops, snap, got me on the VCAL :P*

[allycat06]

If she wanted to rent privately and didn't put her name on lease then I don't think she would be able to claim rent assistance, perhaps someone can clarify?
A share house would be the way to go. I doubt any landlord would be keen to let their house to a 17yo with no work or rental history.

[Mother Goose]

Fiona, I've not read all the responses but my sister did the same as Lulu's daughter. She was linked through Mission Australia and lived in a share house with a lead tennent. She lasted about 6 months before she moved out. There were strict rules which she couldn't handle. Things about curfew, cleaning, washing, going to bed. It was much stricter than living at home!

FWIW, if DSD is studying, she may be able to get student accomodation. There is plenty around esp in Bundoora and Mill Park areas. Not sure how she'd go without income and with her hairdresser friend though.

I think that a landlord *may* give her a look in if you and DH were guarantor on the lease for her... but I don't like her chances either. I'm sorry.

A private lease might be slightly easier for her. Or a bungalow type thing...

[fionas]

That's interesting MG. Is student accommodation for high school students though as well as TAFE/uni students? She's barely 17. I'm not overly keen on her living in student accommodation because well, I know what that lifestyle was like when I was a student, I guess.

DP and I need to work out how much we want to facilitate this (by helping with bond etc.) and how much we want to let the plan fail dismally which I think it would if we didn't facilitate in some way.

[~clover~]

Just wanted to say that the only reason I was allowed out of home at 17 with c'link is coz DH & I had been together for over 12 months. Otherwise there was no chance. Mum even tried to say she was kicking me out.
My sister had problems too. She couldn't move out (at 18), an hour wasn't far enough away (as mentioned). As soon as she was out though she was put on living away from home & rent assistance & no questions were asked.

[Mother Goose]

I'm not sure what the "definition" of student is ie TAFE/Uni Vs High school - I guess it would be dependent on the landlord?

[LionsandBears]

I didn't move out until I was 21, but Mum had a hard and fast rule for all us kids. She would support us financially as long as we were studying. If we finished or dropped out, we had to pay board or move out. I don't know if you've mentioned similar ground rules to DSD.

I think share houses are a great (cheaper) way to start. Yes there are problems, but that's part of growing up and becoming an adult.

It will be interesting to see how things go between her and her friend if they do manage to move out together - nothing like living with other people's mess to help you appreciate things at home

[fionas]

Hi tashybabe - I absolutely agree and those would have been the ground rules when she finished high school - you can live at home and we will support you provided you are studying. If you're working, you pay board. If you're not studying OR working, you move out and bludge somewhere else. I'm pretty hardcore on this stuff. DP moved out of home at 17 and paid his own way. I moved out of home at 18 to go to uni and paid my own way using savings I'd built up since I was 15 and had a part-time job. I came out of uni with far less debt than other people whose parents were always bailing them out (mine couldn't anyway even if they'd wanted to).

Our situation is complicated by the fact that we're moving from Melbourne to Woodend and she has decided she doesn't want to come. It's more the fact that she doesn't want to leave her friends and her school rather than the fact that there are insurmountable issues at home. But, having said that, she mentioned moving out before we even bought the Woodend place. She wants her independence and her freedom and the move has just brought it to a head earlier than anyone would like. We did not take moving lightly. There are a whole lot of reasons for it. And, as both DP and I have said to her, we would NOT be moving if her grades were anywhere near acceptable but she can't come home with a report with all Fs and expect us to base where we live (and our finances) on her schooling given that she doesn't take it seriously anyway. If she had been at least trying at school, we would have bent over backwards to stay in Melbourne so that she could have continuity of schooling. I spent the last six months of last year trying to find a house that would fit us all and that would be commuting distance for her. Unfortunately, my health problems mean that I can't climb stairs or hills and most of the houses that were big enough were either two storeys OR they were in burbs with hills (like Eltham).

We've also emphasised to her that school is not the be all and end all but she needs to be realistic. We understand that not everyone is good at school - DP and I are at opposite ends of the spectrum in terms of educational qualifications yet we earn similar amounts Qualifications are not everything. BUT, what really peed me off last year was that she found a good part-time job and then stuffed it up because she didn't like the customers. Now, as far as I'm concerned, that's just lunacy. You can't afford to be picky about jobs if you're coming home with all Fs.

So the fact that she will need to hold down a job in order to pay rent I think is an excellent motivator in her situation.

[Muffy]

Hi fionas,
I see you've had a fair few responses so far but i wanted to share my story anyway.

I moved out of home when i was 17, i moved in with a girl who was a bit older than me (my name wasnt on the lease) Mum said as it was my decision to move out of home i had to stand on my own two feet and pay for EVERYTHING (schooling, rent, bills, food etc)
At the time i hated her for it but now i am thankful as i learnt a fair bit about money.
Although my situation was a bit different i had a casual job and i also recieved youth allowance from c'link. Altogether from work and c'link i would recieve about 200 a fortnight and after payin my rent, schooling etc i was left with nothing at all.
I tried applying for living away from home allowance but was refused as mum hadnt kicked me out of home and there was no reason that i couldnt go back there. I also couldnt apply for rent assistance because my name wasnt on the lease.
I had big dreams of finishing VCE, but living out of home i got lazy and realised i could sleep in whenever i wanted etc and i also partied way too hard and i only finished year 11

When i was preg with DS i was 18 and found it very hard to get into the rental market having no 'proper' rental history even though i had had the same job for 3 years and had been fulltime for almost 12 months.
It was only by chance that my sister was friends with the property manager of one of the houses i had applied for and she pushed my application through.

GL to your DSD, its going to be very tough for her.
HTH