Feeding and sleeping stuff/issues/questions

[Teeki]

This is kind of about feeding and sleeping. I'm not sure there's any problems, but I want to make sure I'm doing this right and I'm matching up what's happening now with what DD did, and wondering if I'm doing anything wrong. It's probably going to all come out in a jumble, sorry!

First thing is, DS has started stuffing around when I try to feed him. He's only nearly 6 weeks so it's not a distraction thing. He shows hunger signs so I try feeding him - he puts his mouth on and maybe has a little suck, but then he kind of gets angry and bobs around on there like a madman. He has a few goes, kicks his legs, scratches and gets frustrated. DD used to do this too, and I'd persevere because I was certain she was hungry. Eventually she would/he does latch on, feed a bit and go to sleep - especially if I stand up and walk around.

But I'm thinking, maybe it's not hunger but tiredness? Because he's not having latching issues, and he does it if I walk around but it's not real feeding for hunger, it doesn't feel the same. If he was hungry he'd just do it right away, and it wouldn't matter if I was sitting, right? Should I not try feeding him at these times?

It happened tonight, so I just held him, patted, sang etc. He didn't sleep. Tried lying down with him and the cheeky monkey just grinned and made noises at me. So I figured he mustn't have been tired either, and put him in the swing. He had a lot of good interaction with DH and I so he really just mustn't have been tired or hungry I guess. That's fine, but it was 8:30pm. I know he has no concept of time and I'm not concerned that he's up late or anything, but I'd like it if he went down earlier. But what can I do if I can't feed him to sleep and he just doesn't seem tired? Tonight I was all touched out so went to have a shower, when I got out DH had gotten him to sleep by walking the pram around the house (we have a basinette attachment).

The other thing is during the night. With DD if she woke I'd feed her both sides and put her back. Pretty easy. DS will wake, take the first side and then go into a deep sleep. I try burping him, I try everything to wake him for the other side. He just won't do it, so I put him in bed. He's awake in seconds! So I give him the second side, same thing happens. This time when I put him in bed he squeaks, grunts, wriggles around. If I pick him up he's straight back to sleep, so sometimes I'll bring him into bed. But I sleep better when I don't stay in the same position the entire night so at least the first time I like him to go back to bed. Anyway, I pat him, shush etcbut it kind of makes it worse. Last night he fell asleep holding my finger. It kind of seems like he doesn't want me touching him, he just wants to wriggle and grunt til he falls asleep. It's not every time though so I never know if I should just try to go back to sleep or if he needs help!

So I guess, should I keep trying to give him the second side? Does he maybe not need it and I should try patting him to sleep, or let him do his thing? This seems so different to me, all I did with DD was feed to sleep. With DS he doesn't need it so much - eg I was exhausted at about 4:30 today so lay down in bed with him. He didn't seem tired but I didn't want to be sitting up or walking around. Even though he was wide awake, when we lay down he just looked at me and slowly went to sleep. This has happened a few times now, hence me trying it tonight. But even this is different to me, I don't remember DD going to sleep just like that at all!

If you've gotten through all of that thank you! Any tips at all would be welcome, even if it's just to say I'm doing it ok and there's nothing more I can do.

[tk1999]

I am finding my DS (4 months tomorrow) is a bit the same - very different sleeper than DD was (she is currently 4 yrs old). DD just fed (very easily and quietly LOL) and went to sleep - she was sometimes difficult to transfer but more often than not she transferred and overnight if she woke I would feed her and if she went into her bassinette/cot then I left her and if she didn't then I bought her into our bed.

DS though - he feeds and feels the need to grunt and groan and moan - it is almost a theatrical dinner and show type performance for him to feed. He will quite happily sleep in my arms but if I try to put him into his bed he is awake in seconds - if I pick him up he is basically asleep before I even completely pick him up but if I put him back down again - awake!! He reminds me of the dolls I had as a child (when you laid her down she closed her eyes - when you stood her up they were open) - but he is reverse LOL. I find DS is a lot windier than DD ever was and he tends to posset more.

I don't have any gems of wisdom - the thing that gets me through is to remind myself that DD and DS are two different people and that he is doing what is normal for him regardless of how frustrating it is for me.

Big hugs for you

[Arimeh]

Sounds like my baby!

And also - dd3 just fed and went to sleep too!! I'm currently awake with ds2 because he's fed and not going to sleep after having both sides. Its almost like my milk powers him up instead of knocking him out LOL

He did the bobble head thing, it was especially bad between 5-7 weeks of age, I was so close to formula because I thought it was a problem with my milk. I found that burping him helped a bit, sometimes it was wind, sometimes overtired.

I can't help you with the going down earlier - ds2 cat naps during the day so is usually asleep by 4.30/5pm and wakes up usually around d 10pm or midnight. Which would be awesome if I went to bed in the early afternoon with him LOL

So no advice but you are not alone!

[Heaven]

I would not worry about the second side during the night and see how you go. If he's in a deep sleep then don't wake him. He's got the supply and demand thing sorted now so he'll let you know if he's hungry again. And I would just leave him to try and go to sleep himself if it seems like that's what he wants (how awesome would that be!) and only intervene if he gets upset. That's what I would do anyway

[HotI]

I felt like a newby with my 2nd, had to learn all new tricks and kept reminding myself they were different people.

i think there is a wonder week at 6 weeks, so maybe that is affecting what is happening too.

take care,

[onthefly]

Well, see what you have here is your DS and he's not your DD And what you're doing is just fine because you're figuring it out as you go. Which is - I'm guessing - exactly what you did with your DD.
You're doing great

[Ladylove]

Teeki you sound like such a fantastic, intuitive, adaptive gentle mother. I wouldn't change a thing in your approach. Even at your DS's age it us still about feeling your way through, trial and error etc and you are doing just that.

[luna moth]

My trick for getting through the head bobbing thing was to squirt a bit of milk into the open mouth. They'd usually jump back on soon enough.

One side at night isn't a bad thing, if it works. Try it!

[Teeki]

Well, see what you have here is your DS and he's not your DD

Lol I was so hoping he'd be just the same, would have been easier on me!

I've noticed he only does the crazy bobble head thing at night, never during the day. And I think that's probably because I care more at night. With DD she was all I had, and it was all new and I was so focused on sleep - reading the silly books and writing down when she slept or fed or how long for. So I think I tried to force things a little with her. With DS, I have too much going on to notice what time he sleeps and how long for. If he's not asleep I don't mind, he just goes on his mat, in the swing or I carry him more.At

But then at night, when DD has gone to bed I guess I just think he should too, he shouldn't be up playing on the floor at 9pm. I think I'll just have to let that go

Last night he didn't wake til 2 - so I'm very happy with a 5 hour sleep, I think he's only done that twice before! He had one side and I just put him down, but he was well and truly awake and wanting the other side, he had it straight away when I got him out. Seems like the only way to make him wake up for it is to put him down lol. Then after that I put him back again, he did the wriggling thing and fell asleep on his own. He never opens his eyes during this so I don't think he fully wakes up, he's just doing whatever to get comfy or something I guess. It just feels weird to me to not actively get him to sleep myself, just let him do it. But it was good, because I was only up with him for half an hour, if I keep trying to settle him it takes over an hour. Then he didn't wake til 6, so a fantastic night for us!

Oh, he has just come out of a wonder week, so he's noticing everything and is so much more aware and wanting to be up and looking at things. I think that's maybe why he's sleeping less and later, there's so much for him to see now.

[onthefly]

Re head bobbing, have you tried laid back nursing or lying down to feed? Sometimes the problem is gravity pulling their head back because they're in the cradle hold (or similar) and not over the breast where gravity would pull them down on to it.
Sometimes it's just that they need a bit of time/help to get calm before they feed. Even letting him suck on your finger for a bit can help with that.

Anyway, it sounds like you're figuring it all out yourself

[Teeki]

Thanks, I'll try the lying back thing tonight if he needs it. It still seems to be because he's not hungry though, he's very strong and puts himself where he wants - when he's doing that I can't hold his head close at all. When he does finally calm and latch on he goes straight to sleep without much actual feeding, so I think I need to just calm him first then help him get to sleep. Will see how he goes tonight!

[chody47]

Just to throw something else random into the mix....if he's fussing around when feeding, could reflux (even silent reflux) be an issue?

As for the wanting to go to sleep kind of on his own, that's ok too. DD2 was especially like this for me. In some ways it made my life easier as I could just pop her in bed and head straight back out to DD1

[JLeigh29]

Aww, he sounds like a real cutie.

Just wanted to say it's been great reading this thread as a reminder to me that DS2 will NOT be the same as DS.... And I can't plan for, or expect it to be that way. I hope I can be as intuitive as you seem to be....the control freak in me is already worried though.