Birth Rights Rally in September: Who's Coming & Co-ordinators

[BellyBelly]

If you're on FB, then reply to the thread in there about it, otherwise:

Jo Hunter wrote
at 1:31pm
For all those who can't make it. We are looking at organising a 'virtual rally' at the same time as the 'real rally'. Having everyone send in a head shot, their name, location and 25 words or less that you want the pollies to know. We will then stick the head shot onto preggo bellies with your words on the belly, attach it to a stick and shove them all in the ground out the front of Parliament House. We are just working on coordinating this with some help and we will probably need each person to pledge some money to cover the costs of this happening. our new website is very close to being launched and all info will be on there. Come back here regularly for updates though.

LETS MAKE THIS HUGE!!!!!

[lilmisshavachat]

I will either fly to Canberra or try and organise a rally at the same time on the Gold Coast (Whichever would be more productive).. We have to do something but I don't know where to start with organising something like this... If anyone has guidence to give on what to do just PM please...

[Visitor6]

I'm somewhat uncomfortable being a devils advocate here but reading the article and as a Registered Nurse and Paramedic, I feel I have to......

Under the draft Health Practitioner Regulation National Law, released last week, a midwife cannot be registered unless she has insurance.

Midwives as a group are consistently requesting to be independent practitioners and regarding as competent to contribute in that role. To practice for an employer, their insurance is meant to cover you. However, Nursing bodies recommend independent malpractice/indemnity insurance for all nurses. So really this isn't a new expectation.

But with insurance companies and the Government so far refusing to include home births in the indemnity scheme, midwives will face being de-registered if they attend a homebirth.

So the cause should be to force legislation for reasonable indemnity insurance.

"Even though only less than half a per cent of women have homebirths, they should have the same rights as a woman who chooses to have a caesarean. Home-births won't stop."

Caesareans aren't done at home last time I looked. Choice isn't the issue. Adequate financial coverage is. Every one is happy until something sadly goes wrong and a poor midwife is sent into financial ruin because of inadequate insurance covering legal action.

But from July 2010, they will no longer be able to call themselves midwives even though they are trained. Only those insured and registered can use the term midwife, otherwise they face a $30,000 fine

The terms Registered Nurse and Midwife are protected titles so that isn't new. Registration is one thing, insurance to practice outside and hospital again harps back to adequate affordable insurance.

"It breaks my heart to hear that the Government will do this," she said. "This is about choice.

It's about affordable insurance

"The Government should be driving this and helping midwives who want to (do) homebirths. They will never be able to afford insurance."

By allowing legislation to provide affordable and sufficient insurance.

Home Births Australia secretary Justine Caines said the new law took away the rights of women

Birthing is a collaboration. The new law hasn't even been passed, yet the wrong message has been sent.

The minister I have heard previously seem pretty supportive of midwives. To receive the outcome that allows them to practice supportively and independently is about affordability of insurance that safely covers their practice. That has to be the warcry. The aim is about protecting the public as much as protecting Midwifery Professionals.

Burying this amongst emotive rhetoric will have a negative effect. I appreciate the opportunity for home births having attended a few. I am also well aware of when things sadly go wrong and in a very big way. It is very easy for the happy partnership to disintegrate when clients look for an outcome legally.

I hope a successful outcome is reached for those who seek homebirths.

[Neenee Jellybeanie]

^^ Perhaps this is just baby brain but none of that made any sense to me. What I gather is that homebirthing midwives currently attend homebirths without insurance and under the new laws this will be illegal. So I don't see how this can NOT be about choice? Since it will remove the choice to have a homebirth??

This is just bizarre. In WA homebirths are government funded for crying out loud, now they're going to be illegal?! I wish so passionately I could afford to go to Canberra for this, hopefully we can organise a protest in WA and other states for those who can't go to Canberra.

[Indadhanu]

I'd love to go... not sure about the logistics of me and Jazz making it down there but I love the "Virtual" idea... if they had a rally in Brisbane I would be down there in a heartbeat...

[FabFiona]

Stretcher_Bearer - Just wanted to say that I agree with your take on it, and congrats put being brave and putting them forward.

It seems to me that the home birth movement are absolutely sensationalising their campaign and putting around misinformation that home births will be 'illegal'. There is no proposal to outlaw home births under any law around the country.

As explained earlier, under the proposed legislation Midwives who attend home births will not be eligible for insurance. If they don't have insurance they won't be able to attend hospitals, use medicare benefits numbers etc.

[lilmisshavachat]

In response to your comment Fionaw..

Quote: As explained earlier, under the proposed legislation Midwives who attend home births will not be eligible for insurance. If they don't have insurance they won't be able to attend hospitals, use medicare benefits numbers etc. End Quote:

Homebirth won't be illegal, in that you are correct. However if a private practising midwife attends a homebirth without insurance (which they cannot get due to the Govt not assisting them as they do Obstetricians and institution employed midwives) then they will be de-registered and a fine of up to $30000 can apply. Private practising Midwives don't attend hospital for birth and if they transfer with their birthing mother then their role reverts to that of a support person only anyway.

So yes, homebirth will not be illegal. We can homebirth but if we do we will have to do this unassisted without trained midwives thus removing our choice for a safe homebirth. I'm not interested in birthing at home unassisted and whilst I respect a womans choice to do just that I would also hope that my choice to birth assisted by a trained midwife with or without insurance in my home would also be respected.

Quote: It seems to me that the home birth movement are absolutely sensationalising their campaign and putting around misinformation that home births will be 'illegal'. There is no proposal to outlaw home births under any law around the country. End Quote:

There is no need for us to sensationalise this topic. Every man, woman and child should be concerned that our government is taking steps to remove our right to choose. It may be safe homebirthing now, but what happens when it's something that is close to your heart and your dream. Will it be so sensationalist then.

[Julie Doula]

It seems to me that the home birth movement are absolutely sensationalising their campaign and putting around misinformation that home births will be 'illegal'. There is no proposal to outlaw home births under any law around the country.

As explained earlier, under the proposed legislation Midwives who attend home births will not be eligible for insurance. If they don't have insurance they won't be able to attend hospitals, use medicare benefits numbers etc.

I think the charge that the "homebirth movement" (whozzat??) are 'absolutely sensationalising their campaign' is not accurate.

Coroner Reimer is not a homebirther, but a person who had to rule on a very difficult case. I don't think his comments are born of any desire to sensationalise anything. But this is his perspective of the effect the legislation is likely to have:

Report from Coroner Reimer re. the case concerning midwife Jillian Delaile
June 2009
Research shows the rate of infant deaths for homebirth is the same or slightly less than the rate of infant deaths for similar low-risk women who plan hospital births.
This concerns the sad case of a baby who did die in the process of being born at home, despite the midwife's efforts to resuscitate and transfer the baby.
Coroner Reimer's comments in the opening paragraphs make some compelling points:
"At the outset, it should be noted that certain pronouncements of the Federal Government of late might have a vast effect on the viability of private practitioner midwives and indeed the future of the practice of homebirthing altogether.
It seems that it is intended to legislate to make it unlawful for homebirths to take place attended by midwives, unless they are fully covered for professional negligence. It has been forecast that no insurers will be prepared to issue such policies. It seems to follow that the practice itself, by this back-door method, could in itself become unlawful.
Obviously this could have disastrous ramifications. It might have the effect of driving the practice of homebirthing "underground", which would be a dangerous outcome. History has shown that there will always be a small group of expectant mothers (and fathers for that matter) who will want to give birth in their home.
The representatives of the parents in their submission (and indeed the mother in a separate letter to the Coroner), despite the disastrous experience of this birth, argue that it is the inherent right of a mother to determine how and where she should give birth and birthing at home should be an available option. Not suprisingly the midwife's representatives also press these sentiments on the Court. It is a practice that will not go away and it is to be hoped that the Legislators take great care in drafting any proposed laws in this regard."

[Schmickers]

I'm somewhat uncomfortable being a devils advocate here but reading the article and as a Registered Nurse and Paramedic, I feel I have to......

With respect, Stretcher Bearer, I think you fail to understand some of the politics behind the decision to make indemnity insurance a requirement to practice as a midwife.

So the cause should be to force legislation for reasonable indemnity insurance.

This is correct.

Caesareans aren't done at home last time I looked. Choice isn't the issue. Adequate financial coverage is.

But surely you understand that, without that adequate insurance cover and therefore, under the new legislation, the right to practice, the choice of women in Australia IS limited? What do you think would happen, in 2009, if the last of the southern hemisphere medical insurers withdrew cover for OBs in private practice? Do you think the government would simply say "tough luck, no more private obstetrics?" Do you think obstetricians in private practice would accept that decision?

Every one is happy until something sadly goes wrong and a poor midwife is sent into financial ruin because of inadequate insurance covering legal action.

That is a risk to no one - NO ONE - but the midwife concerned. It does not impact on her practice, or her ability to provide safe and competent care.

The terms Registered Nurse and Midwife are protected titles so that isn't new. Registration is one thing, insurance to practice outside and hospital again harps back to adequate affordable insurance.

Answer me this. Do you stop being a paramedic when you leave your workplace? Are you still a paramedic at home? Do you suddenly switch off your knowledge and skills outside of the workplace because you are no longer covered by insurance?

To suggest that midwives cannot call themselves midwives and acknowledge their years of training simply because outside of the hospital system they are not insured is insulting to midwives.

And another question - if you, as a paramedic, come upon someone in medical distress in public, when you are not on duty, are you ethically bound to offer assistance to the best of your skills and abilities? If so, is that as a paramedic, or as an untrained bystander?

You don't just stop being what you are trained to be because you are not insured.

It's about affordable insurance

... the lack of which limits the choice of Australian women who want to have a safe homebirth with a trained practitioner.

Birthing is a collaboration. The new law hasn't even been passed, yet the wrong message has been sent.

I wonder if you could clarify what you mean here? I'm not sure I follow you. Birthing is a collaboration. One which will not be able to happen when one of the people collaborating is risking a $30,000 fine.

Burying this amongst emotive rhetoric will have a negative effect. I appreciate the opportunity for home births having attended a few. I am also well aware of when things sadly go wrong and in a very big way. It is very easy for the happy partnership to disintegrate when clients look for an outcome legally.

Does anyone know the last time a homebirth midwife, in Australia, was succesfully sued by a client? This statement alone is indicative that you share the position of the government - that homebirth is in some way riskier than hospital birth or birth with a private obstetrician, and that therefore midwives need to be prevented from putting themselves at financial risk. That completely ignores that facts that a) independently practicing midwives are happy to take that financial risk because they are passionate about providing Australian women a safer alternative to birthing in hospitals, and b) that there is any increase in risk, when in fact, if appropriate screening and admission criteria are in place, the opposite is true.

I hope a successful outcome is reached for those who seek homebirths.

And for those who have chosen to make a career out of providing them.


On a personal note, I wish I could be there marching with you all, but with a brand new baby, I just can't. I'll be with you in spirit.

[kelebek]

ust wondering if anyone will be travelling through xxxx to get to canberra to go? and if they would have room for an adult and toddler? (we can supply our own car seat)

[BellyBelly]

I think its a great idea to share transport up there, shame there will be difficulty with those who have little ones, cos we could all hop on a bus and go up there as a group... I'm thinking of spending the weekend there, then have the Monday off work for myself and my partner and come home that day...

[BellyBelly]

Oh and about those coments of homebirters becoming emotive about this issue... for goodness sakes... if your choice of birth was taken away from you, you'd be pretty upset too. Imagine if the obstetric insurance fell through again and they said no more caesareans until it's sorted out... who'd be creating then? Masses of the population because 1/3 babies are now born via c/s. Just because it's a major choice doesn't mean everything else deserves to be ignored or taken away. I would be devistated if I couldnt find a midwife to attend my homebirth. Its been a dream of mine since I had my first two.. a beautiful, nurturing birth... and to have that swept under my feet, I reserve every right to be upset and emotive, as does everyone else, including the profession who will lose their livelihood.

[BellyBelly]

Here we go these links should all work...

VIC
NSW & ACT
QLD
SA, NT, TAS & WA

[-hannah-banana-]

sooo if I happen to not agree to everyone else, I cannot contribute my opinion and be a part of the discussion, despite it being what a forum is for?

[The[cookie]Doctor]

Hannah-banana you are most definitely entitled to your opinion but it Kelly mentioned should be kept out of this thread as it defeats the purpose of it's intention. To inform those of us that are passionate and are interested in the rally.

If you have a differing opinion you may like to share it in the homebirth forum (i don't know where else would be appropriate really), however keep in mind BellyBelly is a community that promotes the ideals of natural and non-medicalised birth ... so it's something a lot of us will fight for.

[-hannah-banana-]

ok thanks, I was just wondering

[Schmickers]

I'm confused, Hannah, given that you haven't posted an opinion yet.

This is an announcement and coordination thread for the protest in September. If you have an alternative point of view, you'd be welcome to post it in an appropriate forum, but as Kelly pointed out, the intention of this thread was to assist in coordinating those who are attending, not discuss or debate the new legislation. We got a bit carried away...

Try the search - I think I've contributed to at least two other threads on this topic today. I'm sure you'll find somewhere to have your say.

[BellyBelly]

Yes please read the earlier posts. Any further debate will be removed without warning. This is a co-ordination and organisation thread for those who are passionate about supporting this issue, I don't want a messy thread. Please feel free to start one somewhere else if you wish to discuss this further. I wont ask again. End of.