"Why men should NEVER be at the birth of their child"

[paradise lost]

I didn't agree with the article but then i'm not a big fan of Odent either.

XP was a rock during my labour (way more than he has been since, hence the "X") and i can't see how those 4 hours being shorter would have been better for me!

I am not interested in being with a man who loses his desire for me after seeing how powerfully feminine by body and my Self can be. That is a juvenile reaction to me and i'm not interested in it. If i have to face the reality of birth then so does he and if he can't he can take a long walk and not come back.

My partner did not know it, but I had given her the exceptionally rare, but ideal situation in which to give birth: she felt secure, she knew the midwife was minutes away and I was downstairs, yet she had complete privacy and no one was watching her.

He GAVE her the gift of abandonment at the moment of birth? Are we to assume that she chose that even though she "didn't know it"? There is a big difference between a woman wanting to be alone, and a woman being left alone "for her own good". How is it different from ANY other treatment at labour or birth a woman herself has not chosen? Sorry. No thanks.

[Snacks]

My DH found Natalie's birth distressing. I know this because he happens to be very good at communicating his feelings (better than me) and we were able to discuss it afterwards. If he was incapable of expressing his feelings, I would understand that perhaps he'd deal with it in a less desirable way.
I think its pretty harsh to judge men for not being able to deal with such a traumatic experience. Some people need help but don't feel it is socially acceptable to get it. I think it is sad but true that if a man said he needed to get councelling after experiencing the birth of his child he would be slammed for being selfish, or a wuss, or whatever. And that's not fair. So I can understand how difficult it would be for some men to come to terms with.

DH and I are both incredibly glad that we had a female birth attendant who is an experienced midwife to lead us through labour and birth. If she hadn't have been there, I think Natty's birth would've been VERY different.
I have to say, I'm glad DH was there because I wouldn't want him to feel left out of such a momentous occasion in our lives... But next time if he'd rather not be there, I won't mind. TBH, when the rubber hit the road and I was in established labour, then in transition and then pushing, I really don't think his presence made a difference to me. I probably wouldn't tell him that, but I think that's the ultimate reality of it. My focus was on getting my baby out and it was the women who gave me the encouragement to do so. DH just got upset, kept telling me he was sorry for my pain... Really lovely sweet stuff, but so unhelpful at that time.

I'm inclined to dismiss articles that overgeneralise, but in this case I think Odent has given us something positive to talk about... Guys shouldn't feel pressured to be at their childrens' births, and women shouldn't feel pressured to have them there.

[myboysmumma]

It would probably be OK if Odent had said men (and women) should be able to choose.

But he didn't - it says why men should NEVER be at the birth of their child.

[Helly]

That is also just his own opinion, don't forget!

I must admit, this article made me look at things in a new light. I had always assumed without question that my hubby would be present, but after reading this, I realised that I had never really given him the option to say "no". So last night we sat down and had the discussion, and although he maintains that he'll be fine to stay, he also knows that he has complete freedom to leave if needs to, without me getting upset or judging him. I think it's definitely healthy to have both options available. OF course, the better educated the man is about the process, the less he may be shocked my it all. I feel sorry for my hubby sometimes, being a naturopath, I often discuss in detail all the new and wonderful (!) things that I've discovered about birth. We were joking about the "poo" issue last night. lol.

[Twin Sister]

myboysmumma - I agree, never is too strong a word to use. Not all men get tense in the delivery room. My DH was very relaxed and therefore kept me calm. He wouldn't have wanted to miss it.

[LimeSlice]

It would probably be OK if Odent had said men (and women) should be able to choose.

But he didn't - it says why men should NEVER be at the birth of their child.

Odent never actually made that statement - it is just the headline given to the article (it is not in quotation marks) and nowhere in the story do those words appear.

It is merely the headline put on the article by that journalist trying to get readers.

What he actually says is:

Here, with a view that will outrage many - but will strike a chord with
thousands of others - he describes why he believes that when a woman goes into labour, her partner should stay well away.

That there is little good to come for either sex from having a man at the birth of a child.

When it comes to the delivery suite, men would be well advised to stay away.

Just thought this was worth mentioning to clarify what exactly was being reported.

[Lulu]

Well said Helly and Snacks!

[Phteven]

Just saw him on TV.
I have to say he's pretty convincing when it comes to the idea of creating a safe space to birth in and his ideas are not so one dimensional as the article suggests.

[fionas]

Geez, this is a timely thread - I was awake for about two hours last night thinking about whether I would want DP at my next birth if I'm lucky enough to have another child.

I would be ropable if HE said he didn't want to be there BUT that doesn't mean that I think it would be helpful to me to have him there.

I fully agree with the question that I think Odent is posing - would you want someone there as your support person who is likely to be distressed to see you in pain and has never actually experienced that pain themselves so can't truly empathise?

TBH, I completely understand the stuff he's saying about finding your husband distracting. I had a very long labour over 3 days with a total of 7 hours sleep. For the vast majority of that I used pain management techniques that I'd read in a book. I'd asked DP to read the book and we'd talked about it a bit but although the book talked about what support he could provide to me in labour, I found that I just wanted to do it on my own. I didn't want to make conversation, I didn't want someone trying to tell me jokes and GODDAMIT I didn't want to hear about where he'd parked the car and how long it could stay there before he needed to move it.

I'm not trying to have a go at my DP - I found the midwife equally annoying. She sat in a chair and watched me because I didn't want to have anything to do with her either. I didn't know her from a bar of soap and she obviously didn't know the theory behind my pain management stuff and looked at me like I was a freak when I was banging my stress balls together.

The techniques worked but I did feel a bit of a dill doing them. And that's the point - I wanted privacy.

So I think there's a few different things to being a good support person - empathy, encouragement and advocacy if need be when it comes to birth choices and arguing with the medical people.

Some people (men or women) may have some of those things but it would be rare to find someone who is good at all three. My DP would have been BRILLIANT at the advocacy if it had come to it but he wasn't good at the empathy. That's OK, I know him well enough to have predicted this.

It's not a male or female thing. My friend Tracy who wants to be at the next birth is equally shocking at empathy but would also be terrific about telling doctors and midwives to go shove it.

Odent recommends doulas - I think that's fantastic. I think it's really helpful to have someone (especially in a long labour) who gets to know you a bit beforehand so they're not a stranger, knows your preferences, can empathise and encourage you AND advocate for you.