Reflux & feeding

[{sarah}]

Before I post I just want to say that I don't want this to be turned into a breastfeeding vs formula feeding thread. I'm posting my observations & wondering if anyone has seen the same thing. I'll have the thread locked if it starts up a debate.


Alexzander was bottle fed from a few days old due to my milk not coming in. He had reflux that cause him so much pain & he spent much of his early months crying in pain & fighting being fed. He'd throw up after most feeds & it would clearly be hurting him every time. He was put on Losec & we finally got him weaned from it at around 12 months old.

Juliette is breastfed & is a very calm baby. I suspect she has reflux as well, the difference is that it does not hurt her. She throws up after most feeds like her brother, but is fine with it in that it doesn't seem to hurt. She doesn't do the back arching or any of those things, but clearly she vomits far more than what would be expected for a non reflux baby.

So that got me wondering..... Is the difference in the way that they are fed? We're not doing anything different that I can tell other than what they are eating/drinking. Is breast milk gentler on their stomach making it less painful for them?? Or is it just a coincidence & Juliette doesn't have as serious a case of reflux as Zander even though she is more spewy than he was?

Has anyone noticed the difference between reflux in a breastfed vs formula fed baby?

[Trillian]

Sarah, I think it could just be as simple as them being two different kids rather than it being solely about the way they were/are fed. Naturally BM is much easier to digest than formula is, but reflux doesn't seem to discriminate between the two from what I have seen - you can give thickened formula to help stop the vomiting, but they can still be in pain from it. It could be that she is just a 'happy chucker', which is still reflux, but it isn't reflux kwim? Even when my older three were BF in the beginning, it didnt change once they were on formula.

[~Trish~]

I really think it is the individual baby. Juliette may not actually have reflux, some babies are just more "chucky" than others. My first DS was breastfed at first and he would chuck heaps, but didn't have reflux and was perfectly happy. I think the term is "happy chucker"!

My second DS is breastfed and he doesn't chuck nearly as much as DS1 did, but he did develop reflux at 3 months. He would scream and arch his back when I tried to feed him and he would wake up in the middle of the night screaming in pain. So I wouldn't say formula is worse than BM from my own experience.

DS2's reflux disappeared after a trip to our paediactric chiropractor, he is a miracle worker!

Glad Juliette is a nice calm baby for you

[The[cookie]Doctor]

I have a "happy chucker".
But he doesn't chuck a lot.

My sisters on the other hand, had painful reflux when they were solely on BM and now that they are comp fed, they are "happy chuckers" too.


I don't think this really answered your question, i'm just throwing examples *scratches head vaguely*

[River]

OK, this is a bit tainted with my own experiences and those of others around me but......every time I see a reflux baby now I consider whether or not its a cows milk allergy. Could it be that your kids do have a cows milk protein intolerance as babies and Juliette gets very little from you through your milk, but Zander got a whole whack of it through the formula?

K still refluxes when she has something with milk in it, she had some girl guide biscuits yesterday and has been refluxing ever since, but she generally has a dairy free life (as do I) and no reflux at all. It bothered her the most with the burning and such when I had heaps of dairy in my diet, then we went through the real shocker colic days *shudder*.

Just a word of warning though Sarah. From my experiences with three refluxy bubs, it *seems* to be harmless happy chucking until about 3 weeks old, then it turns nasty. Has happened every time. My guess from my kids is that it takes the system that long to work up to critical mass. So either if its caused by allergies it takes the body that long to reach the point of 'no return', or if its run of the mill reflux, it takes the stomach acids that long to develop the qualities to start to burn.

[~Trish~]

Just so you don't feel too afraid Sarah, my DS1 was a happy chucker and it never turned into reflux.

But I agree with River that it can possibly be a sign of a dairy intolerance. The first thing the paediactric chiro asked me when I told him DS2 has reflux was whether I have a lot of dairy in my diet. He tried to get me to change to goats milk, I tried it once, yuck! I don't have much dairy though so I don't think it was a problem for us.

[River]

Bleugh on the goats milk *yuck*. Rice milk is nicer .

[Staceylaurice]

Wow. My daughter is now just over 2 months old and since birth has had problems feeding. She wouldn't attach to the breast so subsequently I pumped for 5 weeks only to give it up as it really done my head in (7 - 8 times a day for 30 minutes each). So, I then began the long stream of formulas as my Maddy (Madeline) had a silent refulx which caused her to choke - to the point where if I wasn't watching her ALL THE TIME she could go blue without notice. I am sure the doctors thought being a first time mum I was just hyper-sensitive etc etc and I also have heard that she is extremely active and has 'attitude' etc. And, yes she is active but has a very special stubborn side too!!!! So, I have tried every formula and am now on Karicare De-lact and thickening it - tho I don't believe she like the formula the doctor doesn't want to switch again. I have tried gaviscon which made the choking worse and have been using Zantac now for approx 2 months however in that 2 months Madeline has decided she doesn't like to drink much and sometimes not at all. I am about to try Zoton which I too hate switching meds as I wonder what happens when we do take her off them. Perhaps I need to find a Natropath and go the alternative way? I might add that Madeline was doing the 'choking' thing when she was breast fed too. My paediatrician said "It's probably reflux and lactose intolerance.... She'll grow out of it".... That might be but at what point does insanity take over. A month ago I went to Tresillian at Canterbury and found it FANTASTIC. The nurses were angels and knowing that people understand and are compassionate to your situations made me feel great again! We have a 'routine' now and even tho the reflux is not any better, I can handle Madeline's tiredness and I know her tired and pain signs. Tho, 12 + sleep per night would be GREAT! Having said that, I am going to take your belief in the Natural Alternative with me and hopefully get the same results you have! Thank you!

[Tarnee]

Zedd - I have a 4mo 'happy chucker' just like you. It is driving me insane!! I don't feel any pressure though to medicate - I actually just feel like noone will listen and offer me advice. I don't want to medicate my daughter, I would just like to hear some things to try other than 'she will grow out of it'. She is exclusively BF and I have been holding on to 6 months for things to get better when starting solids - then I read the post here that said she might just continue spewing up food - oh no!!

The worse thing is not the constant washing for me (or splatters on the floor) but the bib around her neck all the time that she is awake and that whenever I hand her over to people for a cuddle, I have to say "careful, she might spew on you" and inevitably she does. It makes me feel bad and that they don't get to appreciate her for what a wonderful baby she is.

Like you Zedd, I also think I have been over-feeding her and she is big (she is 7.3kg at 4 months) - I have moved to 3 hourly feeds from 2 hourly feeds for the last month but it hasn't made any difference to her vomiting and I can't stretch her any further at the moment (unless she has a really big sleep).

The poor Child Health Nurse I saw on wed ended up causing a major break down about Charlotte's vomiting. I went to see her about a rash she has under her chin from the constant wetness (from constant spewing). She said to try nappy rash cream but the best thing was lots of tummy time so that it has the chance to air dry - DD spews constantly when on her tummy - down came the tears!!! She said I should go to a paediatric gastro-entroologist (sp) - and that he would give her some anasthetic and do an endoscopy and that was the only way to know for sure if it is reflux - is this true!!! I was really put off by this because it seems like a very invasive thing to do to a baby!! I think I will just ride it out.

Am also considering eliminating dairy from my diet - DD definitely has good and bad days - maybe this is related to a dairy intolerance?? Worth a go anyway.

I am glad to hear that there are lots of 'happy chuckers' out there.

[Janie]

Sarah, I haven't read any responses, only your opening post, but I thought I would add my experience

My DS suffered from reflux as a baby. He was BF and topped up almost from birth. Sometimes his top ups were EBM, sometimes they were ABM. Without a doubt, his reflux wreaked alot more havock when he had had formula. It was VERY easy to tell that it was the problem. We did try him on a LF formula (at the LCs suggestion), but it made no difference. Gaviscon in the formula helped somewhat.

So yes, based on my one and only experience of feeding a reflux baby, I would say that artificial milk can definitely make matters worse.