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Very well said!:
I have been trying to get Dp's sister to restrain her son properaly in the car but since he was about 18months hes been in a booster seat :(. With an adult seat belt. This will crush his chest if they crash.
I have sent her emails upon emails with the facts and even the little bubbas that have died from what she's doing.
Yet still nothing. "It'll never happen to me" or "She'll be right" shouldn't be in a mothers vocabulary :(
Do I judge. Unfortunatly yes, I do, sometimes.
I have lots of friends who do things very differently to my way ,like CC, not even attempting to BF because they feel that FF is "more convenient", feeding their toddlers a diet of mainly chicken nuggets and chips, giving their 2 year olds only diet products (no fat milk, yoghurt, processed cheese) give them softdrink from 1 year onwards (albeit the "sugar-free" versions), teach their kids to make insulting comments about others (regarding their weight or state of boldness - a friend of ours actually told his kids not to touch my DH cause they might catch "baldy germs"),.....
Do I think they're bad parents? NO. A bad parent to me is somebody who does things that intentionally harm a child. I do think they don't have the "right" information. I believe that they are doing their best based on the knowledge they have. I do believe that if they had the information that I have and approached it with and open mind, they would do things differently. Of course this attitude is extremely patronising and I'm not proud of it.
Do they judge me? Of course they do. I'm too soft with my child and I spoilt her by co-sleeping and feeding her to sleep. In their mind I don't have a sense of humour cause I don't find it cute when the kids scream "Eeeew, baldy germs" at my DH. They probably think that I'm doing the wrong thing by occasionally giving my child a treat with real sugar in it (I would never give them sweetener). They cringed because DD had cow's milk, honey and even peanut butter in ver small amounts before she was 1. They thought I was depriving her of something cause I never gave her Farex and exclusively BF for 6 months, then kept doing it til she self-weaned at 19 months.
The bottom line is, although I do feel that what I am doing is the right thing for my child and me, I have to accept their approach, too. They are the parents, they get to make the decisions. I reserve the right to do things my way, so I have to let them have that freedom, too.
I would never judge somebody I don't know for little things like that. If I see a mother taking her toddler to Macca's, this might only be an occasional thing or they might do that every day. i don't know that. If I see something that I would disagree with, I don't know what lead to this happening. I try and give people the benefit of the doubt.
BUT, when I see a parent shaking their baby, or something like that, then I do judge. Although I do understand how frustrated we can become, especially when we're sleep deprived, this is completely unacceptable.
To the poster who mentioned about judging other's parenting styles while she herself is still pregnant. I used to do that. I think most women do. But you might find that you'll do a complete 180 once your bubba is here. I used to admire a family member's child who was so well behaved. Now, I feel sorry for her, sometimes. She is never allowed to be a kid. My toddler runs around giggling and squealing with joy, while her 2 1/2 year old sits at the table and waits for the adults to finish their dinner before she is allowed to leave her chair (and I'm talking 3 courses, but only close family).
I try to remind myself that we are just different and so, our kids will be raised differently, too. This approach doesn't fit in with me or my daughter, but my approach wouldn't fit with her and her daughter.
Sorry, for the ramble. And thanks for bringing up this topic. It made me have a long hard look at my attitude towards other parents.
Saša
I do judge.
And I am proud of it!
I expect and know that I am judged by others, and so it should be. We are all used as measuring sticks for each others parenting in some way shape or form. This is what I believe keeps on an even kiel. It is what allows us to try new things, and experience others points of view.
Just because one make or forms a judgement does not mean that it cannot be changed through understanding and perspective.
I find that my personal views are at odds with many people I know, and this in turn impacts the way they raise their children, obviously. So I think it only logical that I would form an opinion and judgement on how those views influence their children. After all, these are the people that I will eventually live in the world with and run the country when I am old. iykwim.
How they are raised, the values they are instilled with, their education levels, etc are therefore important as they will have a direct impact on my life and the lives of my children in the future. How society guides its moral compass is going to be a direct result of how the next generation are raised. I expect that I shall be judged and I welcome that judgement. It enables me to change my views or practices, or not, and gives me the different perspective from how I was raised myself.
Hmm. That sounds a bit messy doesnt it! lol
Anyway, I think that judgement is crucial to how the next generation are raised. Some parents are not given education they should have been (YES!! A judgement!! lol) and some ignore it. These people need to hear different opinions, views and practices in order to fill the void between how they are and how they should be caring for children.
There are obviously times and places to voice ones judgements or criticisms, but I do believe that there is nothing wrong with being judgemental of others parenting skills. And I welcome people to openly judge mine. I would be worried if people tried to tell me that I was perfect and required no thought on any aspect of my parenting - there are obviously many ways of doing things, and I am always open to any suggestions on how I could parent better.
Parents should be open to all and any comments on their parenting as far as I am concerned. (Just because someone has a different way of doing something, there is nothing that says after careful consideration, you cannot ignore them anyway.)
Hope that made sense...lol it is getting late!
Mmmmm, Lime Slice , I see what you are saying. But I think we're still having a different view on things.
DD got sun burnt a couple of months ago. I felt horribly guilty. It was obvioulsy not something I let happen on purpose. I didn't need people asking me: "How could you let her get burnt. Don't you know how dangerous it is..." And people did say it. Some even added: "Well, I hope you feel guilty".
Or when I decided to continue BFing past 6 months of age, I didn't need people telling me all the time that it is creepy for a toddler to BF or that they think I'm not doing the right thing nutritionally for her. Or when they told me to CC because they "think" it's the right thing to do.
I guess if somebody wants to judge me, they should do so based on facts that they know about me (not making assumptions) and they should be able to back up their opinion with research. But, at the same time, they should be open to the reasoning for my actions, too. I find that the people who are the most judgemental are usually the least receptive for a different point of view, even if it based on solid research. And often they are also the people that have no experience of their own about raising children. Like my MIL (she became DH's stepmum when he was 10) who has never had young children of her own.
I do get very sick of having to justify myself to others. I do the things I do because I have done my research and I have added some common thought to it and I believe it is the best way to go. It is my business.
Saša
I think judging is something we need to be so careful of. Whilst I do understand where you are coming from Limelice, I do believe you have the right intentions, it could seriously backfire.
I was raised by a mother from the "What will people think?!" or the "Tut tut" generation and I can tell you now, it was not pleasant. It certainly did not mean that people were raised well, it was just that people made sure that what they did in public was perceived to be right. It was really, really screwed up! As an example, my mother never wanted me to be a part of scripture classes as primary school, rather than going with her beliefs, she had me go as she was afraid of being judged. She put her personal reputation above how she thought I should be taught As an extreme example, I had to give a statement to the police one evening, it was late, so they gave me a lift home. My mother was highly embarrassed. I explained to her that isn't it better to get home safely and she was not happy with that. She would have rather had me walk home in the dark and have something had happen to me, than have the neighbours thinking I had been brought home by the police for doing something wrong. As I said before, really screwed up.
If we are too open with judging and passing out unwanted opinions, then there is a real risk of parenting being pushed underground. Many parents (including myself) would be almost too afraid to go out the front door in case someone comes up gives some ridiculous opinion. How much damage would that do? Kids kept home, not going to playgroup, due to that fear. Parents afraid to admit something, get help, for fearing of judging.
There is so much judgement out there already, without people feeling they need to add more. Please do not encourage others to be more judgemental than what they already are.
I think there's a difference between judging and evaluating- and constructive criticism! I have been told countless times to CC and have kindly deflected the thoughts a lot, by explaining that it wouldn't work for us, DS wouldn't stop crying and anyway I don't want him to learn that Mammy doesn't come for him when he needs her! It's a way of saying "thanks but no thanks" with also "and you're doing it wrong because..." without sounding judgemental or mean!
WRT child restraints, I'd be pointing out that it's illegal not to use a child restraint. IMO parents with unrestrained children running wild in the back of the car are irresponsible. If DS took off his seatbelt and ran wild I'd stop the car and not move until he was strapped in again. Every time. Even if it took two hours to get five minutes down the road to get home again! But other parents for some reason think "we're nearly home, it doesn't matter" - most accidents happen near home! I can't fathom that thinking, but then they can't fathom my putting DS's needs first all the time: safety is a real need.
BTW, I have a child who sits to table until everyone has finished and who is mostly quiet and well behaved around adults. It's not my parenting, well not much. It's his nature too. OK so he has toy trains if they are needed and takes them to Church every week (now that we're going again: another story but DS is quiet for 95% of the sermon and doesn't run amok). DS is full of fun and laughter, but he also knows when it's important to behave as an adult should. He doesn't always, but he does his best and knows what behaviour is appropriate when. I don't quash him (much LOL) but he knows my expectations, that I'm not cross if he can't meet them and that these expectations will be with him for life. My expectation is that he sits quietly through a sermon. He knows he may talk quietly or move around in a set area. He is not in trouble if he wants to run and play loudly, but he may not stay in the service. And the joy is I'll never expect anything different from him. My expectation of a 2 month old is the same of a 2 year old is the same as a 20 year old. With less tolerance if the 20 year old wants to play trains though!
And I've taken DS to burger king! It was that or starvation one evening on a motorway. He picked the food up and decided to starve LOL. He had fruit in the car but DH and I were fancying something and DH was driving, so burger king... and DS had none of it. Bless him. But we still took him in!
I think if we look at others' parenting and we can learn from it, be it a "let's do this" or "let's not do that" then WE have learnt and that's good. If we can share a tip then that's great: I was chatting to another woman about sleep problems earlier today and told her what worked for us. Without either of us mentioning CCing! But to... not just judge, but to jury and exocutioner as well IYSWIM, that I don't agree with. If you have a real problem with a parenting style then either say something or stop whinging in your head. I may have thought SiL was doing the wrong thing stopping BFing at 4m, but it's her choice and she made sure Niece was nurished... just because I breastfed for over a year doesn't mean she has to, or to feel judged by my continuing to feed beyond when she chose to stop. Nor should I feel that she thinks feeding beyond a year is wrong because she stopped formula at that point... I don't feel judged and that's good.
I think judging is a bad thing but if we do feel something is wrong then we can always offer constructive help. "Oh, my little one was just the same, this helped me: I know you've probably tried everything but just to make you feel less alone because I've been there too." My word, I'd take that advice! I wouldn't take "Your child is awful, you should do this" advice at all.
Child beating, child molesting, child murder... OK, I do judge here. I can understand being at the end of your tether and have told Liebling before now "I can see how with another mother you wouldn't be here any more" but I can't fathom crossing that line. And I am soooo thankful and grateful for that.
This reminds me of someone I know. I know a girl who lifts her son out of his pram by pulling him out by his arm - one arm. I also strongly suspect she abuses him physically (she claimed a black eye was caused by a fall but I don't believe it) but that's a different issue altogether. The thing that annoys me the most is people shake their heads and say "Oh, those young mothers" and I'm a year younger than her :wall::
Indeed. I was certain that co-sleeping was dangerous and wrong before I had DD. Now I strongly believe in it for health, safety and sanity reasons!:
To the poster who mentioned about judging other's parenting styles while she herself is still pregnant. I used to do that. I think most women do. But you might find that you'll do a complete 180 once your bubba is here.
I think it's an important point that some mistakes are out of ignorance and some are just careless. For example, I will confess here in front of all of you that I gave DD honey on her dummy when she had colic a couple of times. I knew the sugar wasn't good for her teeth but I was told that it didn't matter as the teeth hadn't actually broken the gum yet. I didn't know that it can contain harmful bacteria. Once I found out that my initial opinion was correct and it is harmful, I stopped doing it or letting anyone else do it. Luckily it was only a couple of times. I wonder if that's the case with parents who give their kids sugar-free soft-drink. We know that artificial sweeteners have been linked to cancer, perhaps they don't?
I've noticed that my parenting gets judged actually. I was out with DD and she had been tantruming all day, it took us hours to get somewhere that should've taken 15 minutes. She had thrown herself on the pavement screaming and crying and I was telling her to stop and lifting her up to her feet. I've been told I have the patience of a saint and I was trying to be firm with her, I certainly wasn't cross. A goup of women walked by and one of them gave the most horrible look and I honestly can't think of why! Was it my parenting? Was it my naughty toddler? I still don't know but it sure made me feel like crap at a time where I was already having troubles! As DD has gotten older I've really started to understand just how bad it feels to be judged. On the other hand, I've seen things that have absolutely shocked me. I saw a little girl (maybe 4 years old) running in fear away from her mother who was screaming swearwords, abuse, names and threats at her. It was just awful. I've seen a mother push her son by his head onto the floor of a supermarket. I'd like to say there is a big line between parenting choices and abuse, but then again smacking children is abuse in Australia and I personally don't agree with that, though I don't smack myself.
Probably a combination of '*tsk tsk* Those young mothers...' (I get it a lot too, what, I'm automatically a terrible mother because I got married and had a baby at 21 rather than wasting another decade 'living my life' or 'finding myself'? Pfffffft.), and 'Just flog the little tyrant, you're obviously one of those namby-pambies who doesn't believe in disciplining your unruly children'.:
Either way, both narrow-minded opinions from women who don't know what they're on about. :)
What? That law got passed? Smacking is now banned here??:
*looks around* well... I'm up the creek then, aren't I? I already try to avoid doing it in public because I don't appreciate busybodies getting into my business, but yeah... uh-oh for me.
I thought it had, perhaps I'm wrong? I tried googling it but I can't find any information.
My mum always says: I was a perfect parent until I had children.
It's easy to make knee-jerk assessments of people who's situations we don't fully appreciate. I think it's just part of the way we make sense of the world - I guess the key thing is whether we take that further and 'judge'.
I don't like that I do it, but I do sometimes... and then mentally slap myself.;)
I love this quote. I'll have to steal it.:
I was a perfect parent until I had children
I knew it was being discussed, it was all over the news for ages, I thought they ended up rejecting it by saying that there's a definite line between 'smacking' and 'beating' a child, and that it's a parents' right to use 'smacking' as discipline provided the child isn't injured, kwim??:
I think "smacking" is such an emotive word - it covers everything from "a quick tap on the hand" to "beating child senseless with kitchen implements". Whilst I'm sure you're in the "tap" end of the spectrum, Gothmum, there are others who use smacking who are not. So when we hear "smack" we're not sure where on the spectrum people are and it is worrying.
Personally, I don't judge on smack bum/tapped hand sort of thing. Because before I had DS I always thought I would smack. As it happens, we know smacking won't work with our lad. Beating senseless probably would, but we don't want to do that! Who knows what we'll do with another child? While it's something I'm glad I don't have to do with DS it's not something I would rule out wholesale necessarily - although it wouldn't be first choice.
I agree that 'smack' isn't a good term. I thought the basis of the law change (if that is what happened, I might be wrong?) was that it prevented any potential for arguement over what is child abuse and what is discipline. If a smack is meant to cause pain, it's too much IMO but I know parents who completely disagree and say that the pain is what stops them from doing the behaviour again. When does it stop being discipline and start being abusive IYWIM?
I am not sure where you are, but I know that recently the "No smack" law was defeated in QLD, and NSW has acceptable smacking specified.:
It must not:
* Be above the shoulders
* Cause sustained pain
* Leave a mark
* Be done by anything but an open hand
Onto the subject at hand!
I try not to think of it as 'judging', more like - having an opinion. For example, in my opinion, anyone who would let a know pedophile stay in their home with their child deserves to have that child taken from them until they learn to put that childs needs first. Putting the child first is - in my opinion - an agreement you make with yourself before you get pregnant.
It is also - in my experience - a very bad idea to give babies cola. My XH used to give DD1 coke in her bottle while I was at work because it was easy for him. I ended up leaving him because the health and welfare of our children was not a priority for him and no amount of 'training' changed that. He still gave her coke. He still treated DS like he didnt exist, and he still dumped them with his father at every opportunity. All also in my opinion bad traits. To give you an idea of how important his trophy wife and kids were to him, he was happy to give me full custody with all rights and no interference if we left the state and he got to keep the house, contents and shop we owned. I agreed. The coke had already ruined DDs baby teeth. I was not going to let him ruin any more of their childhood.
IMO, co-sleeping is one of the best methods of giving mum and bub the best and most rest possible. However, IMO, you should not do it if you have been drinking, use recreational drugs or medication that causes drowsiness.
That way its not judging anyone. Its just my opinion. Everyone is free to have a different one. It doesn't automatically make either right or wrong, just different.
^ Well then I'm definitely not a child abuser as far as the law says :) Always on the bum/thigh (seeing as nappies act as a big bit of padding and therefore don't allow me to get the point across), always with an open hand and never hard enough to leave a mark - just enough to give her a bit of a shock, hurt her pride worse than her backside, and enforce the message that 'no' means just that... and I only use it when she's being deliberately disobedient (ie has been told several times 'no' and still does it regardless) or when she's in immediate danger where having a stern chat or waiting for her to listen to me is putting her at risk (eg touching power cords/opening the oven door while it's open etc). Or, when she's throwing a completely unnecessary tantrum and a quick tap on the bum sort of shocks her out of her hysteria and gets her to stop and think long enough for me to talk to her and calm her down.
As far as judging goes, I'm sure there are parents out there who would judge me for using smacking as discipline, but I didn't set out to be one of those 'smacking' parents - maybe for other parents, non-physical forms of discipline work perfectly well and that's awesome for them, but for DD in particular, sometimes it's just necessary. I'm just waiting until she's old enough to understand me properly and we'll review that when the time comes, perhaps as she gets a bit older she won't need to be smacked as other forms of discipline will work - but then again, maybe not (I remember being smacked right up until I became taller than my mum at the age of 10). DD2 may be a completely different child and may not ever need to be smacked, I will certainly try to avoid it if I can.
At the moment I'm being really mad at DH because he thinks it's entirely hilarious to 'teach' DD cuss words - he's already taught her the 's' word and today he had her repeating the 'f' word back to him in her tiny little girl voice - 'buck, buck'... I know she's going to pick those words up eventually because DH and I use four-letter words as frequently and casually as we use words like 'dog' and 'car', but I don't think it's funny for him to sit her down and teach her how to say them, kwim??
So I'll be in for it as she begins to speak more clearly, all the daycare/school mums will be pursing their lips and glaring at me because DD is teaching *their* kids how to cuss... :(
Oh, I so know how you feel there. My DS3 run up to me the other day with a toy Mack (The truck from cars) and declares. "Mum, a f***".
He also does "ah s***" when his blocks fall down. *sigh*
Unfortunately, he learnt the second one from all over the place. I have been known to cuss when I kick my toe - which I do with gay abandon these days. O.o DD1 has started trying to be all grown up through expletives. Then there is tv. I am wondering if there is any point trying to stop it. Its rampant at school. Only DD2 finds it all distasteful.
^ I agree with you there, I think no matter how much you censor yourself (or just don't use four-letter words because you don't like them), the kids will pick them up from somewhere and it's just part of life - like them going through the phase where they're obsessed with bums, bodily functions and genitals... it's not 'polite' but it's a novelty and the less of a big deal you make of it, the more likely they are to grow out of it, kwim??
I just worry because I'm not the most conventional-looking mother (lol I get the weirdest looks when I'm out doing the groceries, especially in a small town) and I know people judge me enough without having the old, 'You're a horrible parent for allowing your child to swear, especially because *your* child has taught *my* child how to swear' thrown into it!!
Not that I think kids learn swear words from just one other kid, I know when I was young my parents used them, I heard them on TV or in movies my parents watched, and *everybody* at school used them on the playground - it was pointless trying to blame Jane Taylor or Caleb Jones for 'teaching' me because we all knew them!!