Boys in girls' changerooms - how old is "too old"?

[LuluHB]

I think she was taken to the toilet by the killer, as opposed to him finding her in the toilet. Considering the sheer number of shopping centre toilets, families and toilet trips each year, 1 death a few years ago is not going to fuss me.

I assume you're all referring to the little girl in Perth. She was actually sent to the toilets alone because she was out shopping with her uncle and older brother. They were waiting for her at the top of the little corridor thing that toilets come off in shopping centres. She was actually nabbed in the toilet where she was brutally murdered.

1 death a few years ago is going to "fuss me" a great deal. This poor little girl died terribly. Her brother and uncle found her and I can't begin to imagine the guilt they both feel. The horror her parents will forever feel. The individual that did this was suspected in a sexual assault previously but due to lack of evidence the case was not proceeded with. Who knows how many other little people may or may not have been unfortunate enough to come across him.

So, while it doesn't happen often, but just once is too often for me to take the risk with the most precious thing on this earth. If that makes me a helicopter parent, then bring on my pilot's licence.

[Floweryfields]

So, while it doesn't happen often, but just once is too often for me to take the risk with the most precious thing on this earth. If that makes me a helicopter parent, then bring on my pilot's licence.

Just want to share some love - fantastic post!

[Astrid]

I assume you're all referring to the little girl in Perth. She was actually sent to the toilets alone because she was out shopping with her uncle and older brother. They were waiting for her at the top of the little corridor thing that toilets come off in shopping centres. She was actually nabbed in the toilet where she was brutally murdered.

1 death a few years ago is going to "fuss me" a great deal. This poor little girl died terribly. Her brother and uncle found her and I can't begin to imagine the guilt they both feel. The horror her parents will forever feel. The individual that did this was suspected in a sexual assault previously but due to lack of evidence the case was not proceeded with. Who knows how many other little people may or may not have been unfortunate enough to come across him.

So, while it doesn't happen often, but just once is too often for me to take the risk with the most precious thing on this earth. If that makes me a helicopter parent, then bring on my pilot's licence.

That is your choice and I respect that, just as you should respect that others see other situations as more risky. I am more concerned about what males are in the house that my DD's will visit, statistically that is a greater and very real risk. If we look at ever risk we may as well lock our children in boxes, but then that is a risk in itself. Life in it self is a risk, we all do what we can to navigate those risks.

[LuluHB]

I do respect that Astrid, and I'm sorry if my post came across as argumentative. I still remember vividly when that little girl was murdered, and I have a friend who was involved in the prosecution so its a case that is very real to me. As you say, sadly (and scarily) awful things are more often than not done by those that our children should be safest with. I am always going to be wary of males within our extended family and circle of friends. I find it very sad that that's the way it has to be, but anyone who things otherwise is I think being naive. I can't do much in that respect though except be watchful and hopefully teach my children well as to what is appropriate behaviour, as well as ensure they know they can always come to me about anything at all. Its not like I can cut all men from my children's lives.

The risk, however small, that my daughters could be in danger using public toilets is a risk that I can easily negate though.

[AndiE]

Thanks all for the interesting debate. The male and female changerooms at our learn-to-swim school are open - there are shower cubicles but there's barely enough room to swing a cat in them. You really have no choice but to change your child side-by-side other kids.

Must say, when I posted my thinking had nothing to do with sexual harrasment/inappropriate dealings with a child etc. It was really more about the comfort level of other girls getting changed when my four year old son is in their company, and at what point I should stop exposing my son to naked girls and women (at least until he's well and truly legal!!) I've not had any reason to worry - it hasn't been an issue at all - but seeing the mum dress her daughter from behind a towel just got me to thinking. However, it's a natural progression of the debate to consider child predators. I do think children are probably less at risk in a learn-to-swim environment but I guess it can happen anytime, anywhere unfortunately.

Re: taking my boys to the toilet ... I use either the women's loos, parent's toilets (when available), or when it's signed for disabled/baby change I'll use that toilet. Fortunately our major shopping centre has a parents room, so that's where we usually go and that's where I'll take my boys for a looong time to come.

[Phteven]

I think that in part it's up to our children. DS1 doesn't like using the female facilities any more but I don't want to send him into the men's on his own so we often use family or disabled facilities. In places where there are less people coming and going I will send him in with his brother and wait outside. I know that it's not likely that my children will be abducted or murdered by a random in a toilet but both DH and I have been affected by random violence committed by strangers so I'm not as confident as many that it won't happen to me.
At the pool we go to for lessons there is a communal showering area. Some kids strip off and some stay in their swimmers and there are cubicles beside the showers so those who want privacy can have it.