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Thread: Am I missing something?

  1. #1
    Stormi Guest

    Default Am I missing something?

    Okay, probably a long post, probably a bit of a vent, too.

    *takes a deep breath* I'm getting fed up with all of this! I have 2 DS's - one will be 7 in March, the other 4 in March. Lets start with DS almost 7. He still wets the bed every night. He used to wear a pull-up to bed and we thought maybe it was making him "lazy" by treating it like a nappy, so we bit the bullet and told him he was going to wear undies to bed - after about 3 months of still wetting the bed every night, we got sick of washing sheets and doonas every day and realised it wasn't laziness and went back to putting him in pull-ups. We're not sure if he is weeing through the night or when he first wakes in the morning - although DH went to wake him one morning and his pull-up was already wet. But DS doesn't seem to care less that he's the age he is and still has to wear a pull-up to bed. He also poos in his pants a lot - not full poos though. He holds on till he can't anymore and soils his pants, yet still won't go and finish in the toilet most of the time. He doesn't seem to care about this, either. We've tried various things to get him to stop this (the pooing) but they don't seem to work for longer than a couple of days. He had a star chart for keeping his undies clean, but this just led to him hiding pooey undies! He says sitting on the toilet is "boring" and that he'd rather be playing etc. I just don't know what to do.

    DS #2 we've been trying to toilet train for a while now - eventually we gave up and then HE decided he didn't want nappies anymore. So he went into undies and for a few days he was going great (except for poos, although he even did a couple of those on the toilet). Then the novelty wore off and he was just weeing and pooing his pants again. So we put him in pull-ups and started a star chart and this worked well for a couple of days and then he lost interest in that - even though he could see the toy he was going to get when he filled in the chart, we didn't make it too many stickers before he got his toy so it was fairly easy for him, yet he still just poos and wees in his pull-up except occasionally when he feels like it he will use the toilet. When he does use the toilet, we make a big fuss about it and tell him how good he is etc etc. Quite often he tells me he doesn't want to use the toilet anymore and he wants nappies again.

    We also have a 5 month old DD.



    Anyway, am I the only one with this problem? All I hear is how so-and-so's child was fully trained by 2 years old etc, my sister always makes snide comments like "He's THREE, he shouldn't be in nappies" etc and I just feel like a failure because we've tried all the things we're supposed to - sticker charts/reward system, praising them for using the toilet, ignoring the accidents. I just feel like my life is spent cleaning up wees and poos. Thanks for reading this, it's more of a vent than anything but just wondered who else has the same problem and what they did about it etc.

  2. #2

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    Could there be a medical reason?

    My cousins daughter always smelt like poo, she would always have a small amount of poo in her undies & my Cousin would tell her off etc...
    But when she started school it continued & she couldn't & didn't want to have sleep overs as she was terrified her friends would find out.
    After her 8th birthday my cousin was so sick of it happening, only ever poo, not wee though, but took her to the Dr, who sent her off for ultrasounds & etc & found out that she has a kink in her bowels, possibly caused from being an overweight infant they think, although now she is trim & 13 yrs old!
    Anyways, this excess kink in her bowel catches poo in it & it sits there & goes rancid as such, as it has already passed through most of her bowels & is so close to the exit area, her body doesn't let her know when it rejects it (after going rancid & getting really woofy over a few days!) her body then forces it out of the pocket or kink & it's just a small amount, but really smells.

    At age 10 they did keyhole surgery & stitched the kink shut, but her bowel made a new one.... So she literally goes to the toilet every hour & tries to poo, they think doing this mght shrink the pocket or once she has grown more they will try to stitch it again...


    Not sure, but maybe this could be the problem???

    But if your 7 yr old is saying it's boring to go to the toilet then he quite possibly knows & gets the sensation, just doesn't stop what he is doing???
    I think I'd talk to a Dr or someone to check it out, maybe now their holding on has made this pocket in theire bowels or a similar thing?

    Good Luck....

  3. #3

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    First of all

    I think that this is something that is common but not spoken about much.

    My neighbours son at 7 wets the bed, by best friends daughter at 6 wets the bed, I have Mason in a nappy at night as we tried him without it and after 3 weeks wetting every night it's not a stress I need.

    I also wet the bed for years and I can remember that I would dream about going to the toilet and wake up wet.
    Maybe he is sleeping to heavily to wake up to go to the toilet.

    I'm not sure about the poo part, has he been constipated and is scared to go and is holding on till he can't hold on anymore? If this is isn't the case maybe get him to a paediatrician to rule out anything physiological.

    With the 3yo they can have setbacks. Mason didn't even want to sit on the toilet till he was 3 1/2. And boy IKWYM about being given advice for that one. I sent him to kinder in a pull up and it was in the first term holidays that he did a wee on the toilet. We are still getting there with poos.

  4. #4
    Stormi Guest

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    Thanks for the reply, Barley. I will be taking him to the doctor soon to sort out his bed-wetting.

    The thing with the poo is, he never does it at school. His undies are always clean when he gets home from school, so I don't think it's an involuntary thing to some extent. He doesn't seem to care about it, either, which really doesn't give him motivation to use the toilet. We explain to him that he needs to be using the toilet etc and he's like "Why?". We have even resorted to scare tactics such as "if we can smell it, your friends at school would be able to as well" but then he says "I don't do it at school". We've tried things like no TV if he soils his pants (as we were thinking it was pure laziness) but this had limited success as it led to him hiding his undies. He does do the poo in the toilet eventually - he doesn't complain of pain and he doesn't strain and they are normal in appearance. I forgot to mention in the last post that when he does use the loo, he often won't flush it or wipe himself, which is making me think it's laziness, he'd rather get back to the "fun" things like playing or TV.

    Edit - thanks for your post, too, Sam. As I just said, he's not constipated and has no pain etc. Maybe it's a boy thing LOL. Most people I know have girls that are supposedly quicker to train and more worried about what others think! I joke with DH that my DD (who is only 5 months) will be trained before the boys ever are LOL.

  5. #5

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    It does sound like laziness then...
    I recall struggling to make the 15 min walk home from school each day, I'd end up literally holding on to my crutch trying to stop myself from peeing!!!
    Literally coz I wanted to get the heck outta school & during the day I was always too busy to use the toilet!!!

    Well fingers crossed the Dr can help???

  6. #6
    Melinda Guest

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    I'm just wondering if for your 7 y.o, that it's possible that there's some psychological reason why he does this? It's interesting that he does it at home, but not at school. It seems to demonstrate that he knows what he's doing IYKWIM? I'm not sure........

    I think like Sam said it's common for younger ones to have set-backs, but perhaps your youngest son is aware of what the older one is doing and that might be hindering his progress?

    I really don't know unfortunately.......I hope you find a solution soon!

  7. #7

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    Lisa, I was just reading through different topics in this forum and came across your post.

    My nephew is nearly 8 and apparently still wets the bed. BUT, he also still sleeps with his parents and 4yo sister! Mum and I think it's an emotional thing. He doesn't have any problems during the day tho. I have heard of younger kids when being toilet trained just not wanting to stop playing to do such a boring thing like going to the loo. They'd rather dance around for ages in their discomfort than relieve it. hehe.

    I'm going to be honest here and tell you the first thing that popped into my head with the laziness thing at home (please remember I haven't had my first baby yet.. so I'm completely inexperienced!!). My first thought, was I'd make him stay in his pooey pants until his butt was red raw.. or if he's hiding pooey pants, find them and put them somewhere he'd hate them put. Like on his pillow.. or drape them over his favourite toy truck. LOL.

    OK.. I am now prepared for the barrage of comments telling me what a terrible mother I will be. hehehe. I think what I'm saying is, I wouldn't want him thinking he can do it coz mum will clean it up anyway.

    Having said all that, I would definitely speak to a doctor first to rule out any emotional problems etc.

    Wow... I have a lot to look forward to don't I 8-[

    I hope you can get it all sorted

  8. #8

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    you poor thing. I have a small idea what you're going through because I moved recently and since the move our cat has had "issues".
    I think Fletch's idea of taking them to the loo at night is a great idea and hopefully they can get in the habit himself after a while.
    I have another couple of suggestions for Mr 7. By his age he should be capable of using the washing machine, hanging sheets out and making the bed so maybe you can take the pull-ups back off and make him clean his own sheets and re-make his bed. (with summer here doonas aren't such an issue) Maybe having such a tedious consequence will make the loo seem more enticing.
    Also if he doesn't do it at school he must realise that its socially unacceptable so is there any way you could get him to spend a really extended period of time with some other kids ie with the school holidays coming up you could arrange a kid swap with a really close family friend or family member; thier kids come to stay for a while and then he goes to stay with them and then you have some differant children over and then go camping. Maybe if you could arrange a fun way that he could be in a social setting constantly for a week or two he might by the end of it prefer to be cleaner or be in the habit of being cleaner.
    I hope you sort something out soon.
    Is there a school counsellor at his school? Maybe they can help with strategies.
    Also if he does go for say a week with no accidents why not take him somewhere really special with just him. I think that toys and star charts are great rewards but special time with your parents is even better and if Mr 4 knows why he might try to win a 'date' as well.

    just a quick edit to add some extra thoughts - I think that if you get him to wash his sheets and remake his bed you need to make it clear that it's not a punishment but a consequence IYKWIM. Also if I was going to to get him to spend lots of time in a social setting I would be sneaky and not mention that its a cunning plot to try and stop him pooing so often.

  9. #9

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    Shannon - LOL at me 8-[ I kinda knew when I was posting it would never be taken as good advice, just thought I'd post what popped into my head. Of course I hadn't thought of the health risks. In my defense, I guess I was thinking along the lines of dach.. in that i'd be finding nasty consequences for the laziness, and of course the grossest one popped in my head first! hehe.

    My mum got me to stop using my dummy, by simply never replacing it, and one day I looked at it and said "yucky" and never used it again. (maybe that's where I got it from )

    There's plenty of words I'll be eating I'm sure. We joke around saying "oh.. our baby's not gonna cry" LOL. My SIL is one who has a lot of clutter... photo frames everywhere type thing.. and I remember she was going around saying she'd be able to just train her DS not to touch these things... needless to say, everything was put away or moved to a higher shelf within days of him becoming mobile! hehehe.

    Anyway.. sorry to get this thread off topic Lisa! I hope you can find a solution soon. I haven't really asked my bro & SIL what they've been doing about my nephew's wetting in the night. I think it's a bit of a taboo subject that they don't even like to acknowledge. But sadly as a result, he never stays over at our place or at nannas. Anyway... they've just moved to Canberra, so perhaps a fresh start, and new school etc might help him settle a bit.

    Take care!

  10. #10

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    I remember several of us kids had plastic sheets on our mattresses until we were about 7-8 because we used to wet the bed occasionally. I cried when mum made me take mine off. I think I was about 8,9.10 - something like that. I still remember the "wee" dream. I always dreamt I had to go to the toilet, and as an adult I've learnt to wake up before actually using it!!! (If you used the "dream" toilet, you would wake up wet.....) LOL.

    This sounds like a really tough thing, specially the #2 thing with the 7 year old. My 3 year old niece has just had to go to the dr for the opposite reason. She WONT do poos cause she hates them, and ended up needing to have an enema to clear out her system.

    Children are strange creatures huh?

    I remember when we used to wet the bed, mum would make us have a bath in the middle of the night, and we used to have to change the sheets there and then. Mum would help us, be we had to do it IYKWIM?
    I think the lights being on, and the bath and all the rest of it actually started making us see the consequences. But we were all quite old.

    Can I just say that "pull-ups" are possibly a terrible thing? They make something that should be trained out of us, OK, and easy to deal with!! I'm sure it can't be good for little boys testicles to be wrapped in waterproof pants for all these years!

    Anyway - I hope the dr can help. I think its definitly time to visit a professional.

    Fi

  11. #11
    Stormi Guest

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    Thanks for all your replies.

    I know there are others out there with the same problem - 10% of kids that age still wet the bed every night, and I guess as I haven't come across anyone else who's admitted to it, I guess I feel alone. It's every night, too, not just occasionally. He is a deep sleeper so I guess that might be it, but will be taking him to the doctors soon as they say if they are still doing it every night at around 7 years of age to get them checked to rule out physical problems.

    We've tried all sorts of things - stopping drinks after a certain time etc. They actually don't recommend this OR do they recommend waking them to take them to the toilet in the night etc. We've also made him wash his own sheets etc to no avail.

    As for the #2's, we had a star chart for him and his brother - DS 3 year old got stickers for using the toilet, DS7 got stickers each day for not pooing in his pants. He has stayed at a schoolfriends overnight once, I thought he'd be embarassed about wearing a pull-up to bed while there but he didn't seem to care.

    I'll probably take him to the doctors soon and see what they say. I'm just getting fed up with it a bit as I seem to be dealing with dirty undies, pull-ups and nappies all the time!

    Oh well, when I'm old and incontinent it will be payback time! LOL

  12. #12
    Custardtart Guest

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    Hi Stormi,

    I'm wondering if his not using the toilet might be just plain disobedience? You say you've tried a star chart and it hasn't worked, what other options have you discussed with your husband for encouragement/discouragement?
    Your DS's comment about the toilet being 'boring' makes me wonder if he isn't just plain ignoring you, rather than it having some physical reason - although I would also be taking him to the doctor to get a check-up to rule this out.

    I'm assuming that the general rules you and your DH use to deal with bad behaviour haven't worked in this instance, so you need to find something that really makes a difference to him, whether it be positive or negative.
    With the weeing, I know some boys who are more encouraged to use the toilet if it has a ping-pong ball with a target on it floating in the bowl to aim at.

    With regard to discouragement, (and here I'm risking being blasted for not suggesting a 'gentle parenting' approach) I know of someone at the end of their tether cleaning their son up with the outside hose (not hard, just thorough) so that the clean-up isn't a 'reward' warm fuzzy time with Mum where you get to feel nice and clean and scented with wipes, but a brisk rub-down outside with cold water.
    As it's summertime now, this is quite do-able without causing physical trauma. This worked for some friends of mine, it only happened twice and he decided that using the toilet was preferable. I'm not suggesting that this is the only solution, or even one you want to use, but it is one that I know has worked for someone.

    Personally I believe, IF this is a behavioural rather than a physical issue, that there needs to be some sort of consistent consequence for him messing his pants. Encouraging him and telling him that it is not socially acceptable hasn't worked for you, so there needs to be some form of discouragement that will make him decide to change his mind about doing it - basically, the discouragement needs to cost him more effort than going to the toilet, so he decides it isn't worth it.

    Kerrie

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