butter and marg - thought this was interesting

[Inanna]

Yes Bath there is canola in peanut butter from the supermarket. I personally don't buy that either. If you go to a health food shop they will make peanut butter from scratch from peanuts. It's yummy and way more healthful... Canola is also in pestos, hummos etc. It is really prolific.

There are ways around the canola conundrum - however my beef is that it is not healthful and it is a cheap cheap oil that is being marketed as wonderful.

People - mostly Mamas are trying to do the best they can for their families and are being swindled into the marketing vortex (imo) and that - as a Mama worries me...

[Astrid]

I was reading somewhere that heart disease in the US increased after the use of butter decreased.

Been going through so much butter here and suprisingly I am losing weight (well stalled for now). DH has been eating it as well and even though he is huge is cholesterol is only 1 point higher than what the doctor would like, but a lot less than what his doctor expected it to be.

[Nelle]

We use real butter too - we don't use that much butter, so my plan is to just cut off a bit a day from a block - but it's hard to find a butter dish that is a flat dish with the deep lid, as opposed to the deep container with the flat lid...I'm being very particular about this and I think I need to let it go!

ETA: I looooove homemade nut butters, it's not hard to make at home if you have a food processor, cos the nuts have their own oil!

[aimz78]

Thanks for this, I love hearing things like this. We only have butter in our house, too! Can you believe all the hype and marketing that surrounds margarine, especially the ones which "lower cholesterol" levels (which they were prob causing in the first place lol!) There is always a new one on the market. "Butter soft" by mainland is good and spreads well (nothing but butter)

[Inanna]

Nelle my maxwell & williams has a shallow plate & high lid...

Have any of you read: "Nourishing Traditions"...

She talks a lot about butter, cream etc and her theory is that the increase in the use of oils such as canola and the high refined sugar in take causes diabetes and heart disease.

After following her redommendations for 12 weeks my cholesterol that was 5.2 went down to 1.9... Despite the high animal fat content of what I was eating...

The same can be said for those that follow atkins. When sugar is removed the cholesterol level reduces... "food" for thought...

[Janie]

I too think that marg is crapola, and would always choose butter. BUT, DS and I are now dairy free and the only alternative that I can find for us is Nuttelex? If anyone knows of anything else that is less......modified, I would be ever grateful.

But DH still has butter

[Pinny-mum]

Thanks was a very interesting post. We mainly used the olive grove spread before Easter, but when hot cross buns came on the market I was craving real butter with them, My family has since moved to having butter now, we just slice of abour 50grams and put it in a little crockery dish,

As a child we only had butter and now I know why toast always tastes better when your mum makes it!!

[*Ash*]

I will be upfront here - I don't eat dairy, and haven't for over a decade.

I agree that margarine is unhealthy, but I feel the same way about butter.

Should humans be eating either of them?

I don't believe that butter is 'natural'. It is made from the milk of another species.

Cows lactate to feed their calves (as we lactate to feed our babies). Sadly, calves are taken from their mothers at just hours or days old, so that humans can consume the milk and the products made from milk. I don't think there is anything natural about that.

Butter is not healthy. It contains no fiber or complex carbohydrates and is laden with saturated fat and cholesterol.

But the main reason I don't eat it is because of the cruelty. Quote:

'as part of the dairy industry?s ?normal operations?, cows give birth to a calf each year to maximise their milk production, and that as a result, every year almost 1 million baby calves are discarded and slaughtered before they are even one week old'.

But there are also compelling health reasons. Quote:

'According to the American Academy of Allergy, Asthma and Immunology, cow?s milk is the number one-cause of food allergies in children. According to the former director of pediatrics at Johns Hopkins University, Dr. Frank Oski, there is evidence to indicate that up to half of U.S. children have some allergic reaction to milk. For these kids (and for adults who are allergic to dairy foods), milk is a mucus maker and can lead to persistent problems such as chronic coughs and sinus infections, asthma, and ear infections'.

Ditch marg and butter.....

[Nelle]

What about the calcium? That's good for you.
As for the cruelty, that's a good reason to buy organic, although I have family who dairy farm and all the calves I saw got milk to drink, and were far more than a month old before some of them would be sold. Is your source an Australian one? I'm pretty sure all dairy farmers wouldn't be exempt from a certain standard of responsibility regarding animal care.

[Astrid]

Humans as a species have been consuming dairy products for nearly all of that time (ok, some culture may not have just to clarify). Fats are important in the human diet, regardless of lack of fibre. Do we dismiss other foods as they are not "complete"? No we do not, we eat a range of foods in order to get what our body needs to function and be healthy, There is nothing wrong with cholesterol in moderation and there is in fact good cholesterol which our body needs Saturated fats have since been found to not be a major problem in our diets, it is the trans fats that are the problem.

I do think the whole whether we should be eating meat or animal by products is probably better for another thread so this one does not get off track.

[Bathsheba]

Crockery Butter Dishes: Be warned and don't buy an Arzberg (made in Germany) butter dish... it is too low to fit a standard block of butter. I bought mine from Myer. It's wider than most butter dishes so instead i use it to house cheese that I am raising to room temperature.

Aliash: fair enough, your opinion, but I do tend to agree with Astrid and would say that's a topic for another thread

[Inertia]

Nelle, in fairness to vegans, calcium is available from plant based foods and eaten in the right quantities can be the equiv. Extra calcium intake (over RDI) have not shown any evidence of increasing bone density.

However, as a dairy product, it is a source of B12 - which is only available from animal sources (meat, dairy and eggs). B12 is one of the most crucial vitamins really as without it, the pathways between sections of your brain can break down. It is generally accepted that had homini not started eating animal products we would either have been wiped out a long time ago, or still be running around in loin cloths exclaiming "Ugg".

Seeing how I have become quite fond of my marbles - I will probably stick with my butter.

[*Ash*]

Is your source an Australian one? I'm pretty sure all dairy farmers wouldn't be exempt from a certain standard of responsibility regarding animal care.

Yes, Nelle, my source is Australian. Sadly, this is the hidden secret of the Australian dairy industry. Go To The Dairy Industry // Animals Australia if you want to know more. There is a current campaign to improve the transport standards for young calves, called bobby calves. As a result, many consumers have become aware of the plight of bobby calves.

I, too, have family members who were dairy farmers. It depends what your definition of 'a certain standard of responsibility regarding animal care' is. Bobby calves are bred so that cows will lactate. It's as simple as that. They are a by-product of the industry. The calf can not be left with her mother to 'compete' with the farmer for milk. Is that 'animal care'? Everyone will have their own thoughts.

Calcium is present in many other foods - sesame seeds, dark green leafy vegies, broccoli, almonds, tahini, legumes. A diet high in protein, especially animal protein, can leach calcium from your bones. So, the amount of calcium you body obtains is not necessarily the amount you put in.

[Inanna]

I disagree that the cruelty aspect is for another thread! - sorry to be contankerous!

I think the footprint we leave upon the earth is always relevant and you bring up good points. I have spent about 25 years vascillating between vegetarianisim and not...

I agree with Nelle that it's a good reason to go organic. I actually live smack in the middle of a dairy farm... Every cow has a name (all my children have a cow named after them!) and I can vouch for how loved and well cared for the cows are... I don't agree with the insecticides used nor the treatments used for medical conditions. However, they are loved cows, and I talk to them all the time!

I get my milk from an organic dairy - because homeopathics are used rather than antibiotics, there is no dipping and the feed is organic (the land is certified organic)... I choose this because it's important to me that my family are consuming pure food and because it's kind to Mother Earth...

Eating meat is one I vascillate between also - I eat organic meat now - however I do believe that it leaves a far bigger and less manageable footprint than a vegetarian diet.

It's a tough one -

[Bathsheba]

But it's such a huge subject (the cruelty one) that I just think it's more "deserving" of a thread unto it's own. I don't eat red meat for ethical reasons.... haven't for 20 years.... but I also think margarine is totally disgusting and believe it's important to try to focus on one issue at a time... imagine if we end up having a great discussion about animal cruelty yet no one will realise it's hidden in the margaine thread. I guess this is just the anal retentive coming out in me LOL

[Trillian]

Hi, just a friendly reminder to keep this on topic please. If you wish to discuss the issue that Aliash has raised, please start another thread.

[Inertia]

Eating meat is one I vascillate between also - I eat organic meat now - however I do believe that it leaves a far bigger and less manageable footprint than a vegetarian diet.

I have always disagreed with this. Cows don't care if their are trees and hills on their field. Crops do.

Mans way of breeding cows for consumption is what makes its less ecologically sound. Its exactly the same as mans way of agricultural farming. The only way to minimise your footprint through food is to go purely organic and live in the country where the food is bred and grown.

[*Ash*]

I am happy to discuss these issues in another thread.