Senior Campus allowing students to smoke

[toomanyshoes]

Oh and another thing, I bet my money on there still being students who don't smoke within the designated area because its "uncool" "too far" etc, happens at my husbands work, they only have to walk a few meters and they are complaining!

[Phteven]

My senior college allowed us to smoke. I really don't recall anyone deciding that they were going to start because they could. I think by that time most of the kids who were going to smoke were smoking.
What I do remember is lots of amazing teachers who managed to make children who were on the verge of walking away from the education system re-engage with learning.

Personally I would prefer that children not lose their educational opportunities as well as their health if they are smoking. As for whoever asked about shooting galleries.... at the risk of a public lynching...... yes, if there were junkies at my children's school (which isn't likely since junkies tend to drop-out), then I would prefer that they were given a quiet corner in sickbay with a curtain and a sharps disposal bin and an ask no questions tell no lies policy, instead of using the toilet or oval and maybe leaving a needle where another child could get a needle stick injury.
There's no need to provide them with anywhere to shag - teenagers are expert at finding those places themselves

[Starfish]

What Onyx said. (As usual someone else makes my exact point but so much more eloquently.)

Re the second hand smoke - I thought it was giong to be a deisgnated area, like in any other place, i.e. if you don't want to smoke, don't go there...

For the record - I'm not actually a smoker, I just don't believe in imposing my personal choices on everyone else.

Dianne - I understand your point, but as an ex-smoker, isn't your DS going to have this same issue, i.e. being around smokers, everywhere he goes?

[C~Q]

Oooh this is an interesting thread...I don't have time now but will come back with my opinion

[toomanyshoes]

Well unless its a designated area with its own air supply people will be exposed to 2nd hand smoke.

Why don't we just all go light up in the local play grounds while kids play?

[Phteven]

Smokers do take their children to the park on occasion. Should we ban them from doing so?

[toomanyshoes]

I don't believe people should be smoking on play grounds.

Why can't they wait until they are away from other peoples children?

BTW my husband is a smoker and even he wouldn't smoke anywhere near a play ground

[Pretty Butterfly]

[QUOTE=Starfish;2701209Dianne - I understand your point, but as an ex-smoker, isn't your DS going to have this same issue, i.e. being around smokers, everywhere he goes?[/QUOTE]

I know you asked Dianne, but as a mum of teens, I'll answer too...

No, my teen isnt around smokers everywhere he goes.
With the law the way it is, my kids are rarely arond smokers, thank god.

I certainly dont send them to to school to be segregated from their friends at lunch, unless they want to smoke with them.
How much easier is it going to be for those who hardlt get access to ciggies, and who might have to odd puff, to just get them at school and just smoke to their hearts content?

Parents could have what they thought were good kids, only to find the school has ALLOWED them to smoke there all day, 5 days a week.

If smoking has become SUCH a problem for kids they cant handle school without them, maybe they need help, not enablement????

No lynching Onyx, , but you really would be happy for junkies to be taking their drugs to school, where your kids are??
I try to keep my kids AWAY from this at such an impressionable age, not have it in the school yard for all to know about, and trust me, its school, everyone would know!!!

[diannescruffy]

Thanks PB, the only way DS was able to give up smoking was during the holidays he didn't associate with the kids from school who are smokers. When he was hanging out in the holidays he would call on two of his mates who don't smoke. He took up fishing during the holidays and he literally spent nearly every day, on his own. The majority of his Yr10 mates smoke so will be in the "designated" smoking area, which is the tennis court. Maybe he'll find some others that don't smoke, they may end up being the minority.

Regards,
Dianne

[Pretty Butterfly]

Thats sad babe.. Its going to be VERY hard for those trying to not smoke if its in their face 5 days a week, at a place that should be "safe" from smoking/drugs etc......

(yes, i know school isnt "safe" from these things, but I do beleive it will be less safe if its "open season"....)

[LimeSlice]

Parents could have what they thought were good kids, only to find the school has ALLOWED them to smoke there all day, 5 days a week.

If your kids were so good in the first place, then they wouldn't be smoking no matter what the rules were or weren't.

A 17 year old will make their own decisions, they are not children, and tbh, I am amazed that you give them so little credit to make intelligent decisions sometimes - surely if you have raised them the way you hope you have, then they will stand up for themselves and their own rights and not smoke if they didn't want to. If you have raised weak minded sheep, I suppose you should be worried.

The fact is, that 17 and 18 year olds will make choices for themselves, good or bad, and having a particular area available at a school in which to have the freedom to live that decision is not going to magically make teens begin smoking just because they are have that space. If the inclination was/is there, they will do it behind the toilets or where ever anyway.
The premise that having the space designated will facilitate more to make that choice is as ridiculous as the argument that providing condoms in schools will facilitate more to choose to have sex.

[LimeSlice]

Thanks PB, the only way DS was able to give up smoking was during the holidays he didn't associate with the kids from school who are smokers. When he was hanging out in the holidays he would call on two of his mates who don't smoke. He took up fishing during the holidays and he literally spent nearly every day, on his own. The majority of his Yr10 mates smoke so will be in the "designated" smoking area, which is the tennis court. Maybe he'll find some others that don't smoke, they may end up being the minority.

Regards,
Dianne

Have you actually had this even confirmed by the school yet?
The notion that such an area would exist in the first place is difficult to fathom, let alone that the place the school should deem appropriate for this to take place would be a TENNIS COURT is laughable.

[Phteven]

but you really would be happy for junkies to be taking their drugs to school, where your kids are??

That's a no brainer. But, if there were children using IV drugs at my child's school then yes, I would prefer they did it in sickbay.
Really it's pretty hypothetical because children with drug problems slip through the cracks and get lost. They don't usually continue their education


Truth is that there are drugs in every high school in Australia (every single one of them) and I believe that policies that mimimise harm are better than sweeping it under the carpet.

[toomanyshoes]

I never said anything about sweeping it under the rug...I would be happier if they got the help/support they needed not injection rooms

[Pretty Butterfly]

If your kids were so good in the first place, then they wouldn't be smoking no matter what the rules were or weren't.

A 17 year old will make their own decisions, they are not children, and tbh, I am amazed that you give them so little credit to make intelligent decisions sometimes - surely if you have raised them the way you hope you have, then they will stand up for themselves and their own rights and not smoke if they didn't want to. If you have raised weak minded sheep, I suppose you should be worried.

The fact is, that 17 and 18 year olds will make choices for themselves, good or bad, and having a particular area available at a school in which to have the freedom to live that decision is not going to magically make teens begin smoking just because they are have that space. If the inclination was/is there, they will do it behind the toilets or where ever anyway.
The premise that having the space designated will facilitate more to make that choice is as ridiculous as the argument that providing condoms in schools will facilitate more to choose to have sex.

My point is, aren't ALL teens sheep at some point?

Do we really need to put things like smoking on the curriculum at school, as a choice to take up?
I know HEAPS of kids that started at 16, 17 & 18, to say they all start beforehand is just not true.
And to be honest, were my kids to have to the odd smoke, I would rather it STAYED the odd smoke, not a full time activity to take up every recess and lunch break... as if that is good for them!!!

Like I said, if smoking is SUCH a problem they cant attend school because of it, maybe help would be better?
Same with the drugs, wouldnt a zero tolerance, and HELP, be better than saying, "just bring em in, and do them here!" ??? The policy of NO DRUGS isnt sweeping under the carpet, its TRYING to make school safe for others, not just the users and smokers.

But like I stated in my first post, wont happen at my kids school, so all my talk is hypothetical anyway, and has no weight whatsoever!!!

[Glamourcide]

Okay, as to the second-hand smoke argument... really? My old school had a strict no-smoking policy. That didn't stop me smoking before school at home and then sitting next to kids in class, or smoking outside the school fence during lunch hours and then going to another class and 'infecting' another student who had the misfortune to sit next to me while I reeked of cigarettes and Impulse (now that I'm older, I genuinely wonder which one is worse lol...). That covers the 'third-hand smoke' argument, and as for second-hand smoke - that's the whole idea of a DESIGNATED AREA within or just outside the school grounds. Our unofficial 'smoker's area' at school was under a big tree next to the fence on the bottom oval. Nobody ever came near us unless they were a smoker, 'visiting' a smoking friend (and we were pretty wary of 'outsiders' so they tended to stop at the next tree and wait for their friend to go over to them rather than coming right up to us), or a teacher trying to catch us out. No way was anybody unwillingly affected by second-hand smoke, we were seated a good 100m from the nearest building, which was the school hall.

I know a designated area isn't the 'ideal' situation here, but come onnnn. Some other posters have covered the arguments really well

[Floweryfields]

I am reading some of these posts and thinking "what planet do you live on??"

- that's a bit rude don't you think? People have personal convictions for, well, personal reasons - the planet we all live on differs in our own eyes.

But on my planet, rules are rules, laws are laws. Of course banning anything never stopped it from happening, that doesn't mean we should go - stuff all the rules, someone's gonna do it anyway, why not make it simple and allow it. Someone commented used the drug scenario and it was indicated that that was an extreme example - OK fine - but where do you draw the line?
I may think it is riciculous to allow drugs at school, another person may see it the same way some of you are seeing the smoking issue.

As far as I see it, school is the formative years of life, you are setting rules and standards for life.

[toomanyshoes]

Who's to say this designated area is "away" from everyone else? Or is not on the way between "here and there".

Smoking at school and near children IMO is not ok, I can't see why this is acceptable other than "because they are doing it" that isn't a very good argument.