A few 4+kid specific questions.........

[Freya]

A few things Dh brought up in our discussion about why he doesnt want four kids. So I thought Id ask the experts what they think in regards to his issues

First thing: extracurricular activities. He is worried that we would be broke from having them all play something (and with what could prob be four boys theyd most likely all play football) and that most of our spare time outside of work hours would be spent ferrying them here there and everywhere. Thoughts?

I said that people spend weekends doing various sports with only 2 or 3 kids too, I figured we could just try and work it so they all go on the same day or at same time like we do with swimming lessons; and that if all four played the same sport we'd prob get some kind of discount or be able to reuse uniforms/boots etc like we do with swimming lessons. Not a big deal to me.

His second thing: financial costs for feeding six people, and possibly four boys. With what I cook now, I definately have enough left over for an extra meal that usually gets eaten as lunch the following day or frozen for later. Thoughts?

I think its about smart shopping which I already do; I also make alot of my own snacks. No big deal to me.

I just dont think one extra kid at this stage will impact all that greatly on our lifestyle. Three is already hectic, I am sure another child thrown in; while adding a bit extra busy-ness, will not make or break us. If its another boy even better, he will have untold amounts of perfectly usable clothing from his older brothers. We would just have to be savvy in optimising group discounts and the like...........

Anyway give me your expert opinions!! Be brutally honest.

[Persephone1]

I'm one of four kids (plus a younger half-sibling). I can't comment on the financial stuff cause I didn't have to pay the bills, but I don't think we ever went without or were disadvantaged because there were four of us. Life was busy, fun, never a dull moment. I honestly don't remember there being much difference btwn having three of us and when the fourth arrived.

Hand-me-down clothes are a plus for the budget! And my sisters and I all played netball at the same place every weekend, so that was handy. I think we struggled to fit into an average 5-seater vehicle and occasionally had to squish two in the middle backseat, but it didn't cause many problems - mostly we were in a troop carrier.

When we were older, and my parents split, we often spent time with Dad in groups of two - the two older kids, or the two younger kids. I think that worked for everyone, but that was more to do with trying to entertain 4 kids with an 8-year age difference btwn the oldest and the youngest.

Good luck!

[Feijoa Mum]

Organisation and help is the key.

I have four boys and although they dont all play sport anymore there is many wknds where Aunty and Nanny were called in to help out as we had three different places to be at different times and Dad was working.
Yes you do get a discount for the more you have playing and there is nothing wrong with 2nd hand uniforms! Our club even has boot sales where you can pick up a perfectly good pair of boots for 5 bucks.

If you already are feeding five then seriously another mouth is another potato in the pot.
My older two eat for Africa and I just make sure I am organised and meal plan but also I use cheaper meats, (mince and sausages here no steak for us ) and loads of veges.
We use a loaf of bread a day easily but with careful planning and bulk buying my grocery bill isnt too horrendous.

We have our princess now too so I do find I am time poor at the moment and spreading myself a bit thin but as she is still only little I know it wont last.

Good luck I think you have the right attitude, dont sweat the small stuff and its all small stuff!

[mbear]

I have been here....esp with your DH's concerns, coz they are my DH's concerns.......

My DH looks past baby age....he looks at teenage years, he looks at our retirement, he looks at being able to provide our kids with a good future....he also doesnt want to be working till hes 65-70yrs.....reason he was tossing up a #4....

I know your thinking of a catholic school.....A catholic school is about $400-500 per term.....4th child is free, but free from fees, there are still things to pay for.

My DH works two jobs.....whilst we could live off one wage - we couldnt afford foxtel, we couldnt afford the internet, we couldnt afford a holiday, we couldnt afford swimming lessons for 2 of the children, trips would have to be limited coz of petrol costs, christmas would have to be really tight. Birthday parties at a play center would be a no go - we just couldnt afford it....and TBH...i dont want to live like that, i dont want to watch where every cent goes....whilst we're not rich by any means, we are essentially a family of 6 with two incomes.....and TBH, i dont know how people do it on one wage, i really dont. I dont see an awful lot of DH, i do a lot on my own with the kids. But thats the decision we've both made....

I think you have to work a bit harder with a family of 6....we want an inground pool next summer, i desperately need a new kitchen.....if we were a smaller family, it would prob be a lot easier. But bills, and food take over a lot of our budget, and working that bit xtra will hopefully get us those luxuries you want......i think its about what you put in....you will get out.....

GL hon....

[Fleur]

Our four are a bit more spread out than others.
So some of it is a bit different, for example by the time DD2 is doing sport, DD1 will probably be gone from home, or certainly much more independant.

But FWIW I agree that a 4th doesn't impact much more than 3...I found the step from 1 to 2 to be the biggest, each additional child has been less of an impact on us financially.

The biggest thing was we needed a new car, but we really needed one anyway... we got a 4yo Kia Carnival & it's pretty good...we like it.

I think a lot of the costs are gradual, they just slip in IYKWIM? we don't really think about 'well if we didn't have to buy this or that then we could...' because it all gets eaten up somewhere in the end.

Sport.... DD1 dances, so it doesn't interfere with DS1's football. DS2 wants to do swimming... but TBH we find that football on a Saturday takes up a huge chunk of the day anyway. The hardest part would be if the games are scheduled at different times & different fields... but you could be facing that with 3 boys anyway

[Arimeh]

Freya - those were the exact reasons my DH had for not going #4 as well...

[~clover~]

When we were kids my bro played footy & us girls played netball. Where we lived it was all done on the same days & times. Training on Thursday & games on Saturday. Being the same team, we all played at the same towns when away too.
I did swimming from about 10, but I walked to the pool & back. Good thing about a small town I guess, everything is right there.

We are about to have our fourth & I haven't thought about that stuff TBH. I plan for the kids to do little A's & nippers. Both the girls will be starting this year. DD1 has done LA's before.
I don't know much about netball/footy etc, but we'll worry about that when we come to it.

Our biggest concern is getting another car. We could just get a seat for the back, but this is actually an excuse to upgrade & we are happy about that.
When this one gets to school I will be returning to work of some sort, if not before, so there will be more income, so I guess as their appetites get bigger there will be more $$ to go around.

We already get most of the kids clothes from op shops anyway, so that doesn't bother us. Birthdays & christmasses are the only times they get new stuff.

TBH, my main worry about them being older is space. I feel like teens need more space. (Or I will when I have teens & don't want to deal with them!!) I only hope that by the time we get there we'll have been able to buy/build our own home with the kids rooms further away from ours, but 3 stories up so they can't sneak out! lol

[~Raven~]

OK well our 4 weren't planned and we were really worried about the financial but TBH we're coping fine!

Our biggest expense is swimming lessons ATM. With 3 of them it is a bit over $400 a term but I want my kids to be able to swim properly. We only started them 6 months ago and they're doing well

School isn't much for us besides the uniforms and a couple of hundred at the start of the year for books. M is due for new uniforms due to a growth spurt but his brothers will wear the old ones.

Food, yes well sometimes it can be costly but then it depends on how much you rely on convenience foods I think. I enjoy baking. My kids don't get packaged snacks (ie museli bars, chips etc) in their lunchbox at all. Partly because of me trying to reduce additives from their diet and also because they got bored with them!

Going places can cost a bit too eg the aquariaum etc but you really only go to places like that once in a blue moon.

There is probably more but I gotta run ATM

[Freya]

Thankyou so much for your input ladies! We dont know anyone IRL with more kids than us so we have no one to ask advice from to either confirm or erase DHs concerns. And I can understand his concerns.

I think our biggest issue would be a bigger car. Currently we have a Ford Falcon we just about own outright and have a debt for the 5 seater Toyota Kluger that we love. I think we could trade in both cars (as we dont need two right now) and get a 7-8 seater car, or even just trade in the Kluger for a 7 seater Territory or Kia Carnival without being in more debt or ending up with an older car. We'd have quite a while to sort that out though.

As for exta curricular activities; currently we have the three boy in swimming lessons once a week on a sunday all at the same time. We pay $40 for it. Which is quite reasonable. An extra child would make it $53. Definately affordable for us. Eventually they obviously will pick something else to do and I will make sure when the time comes we have the money to afford it; but with 3 (possibly 4) boys the likelyhood of them doing the same sport is high, and with their age gap being so small (for the first 3 anyway) they would eventually be atleast 2 in the same age group team if not all 3! So its managable.

I think his biggest concern is that they wont get as much one on one time with a parent as he'd like them too. I dont feel thats the case, the youngest will get one on one time obviously because the others would be in preschool/kindy a few days a week; and once the new baby hits 10-12mths we become able to do things one-on-one or both of us with one of them because we can leave the baby with the other parent or a babysitter. In the end though, the two friends I have who grew up with several siblings dont have any issues with being one of four or more, they actually have fond memories of fun and companionship. I dont think how many siblings you have impacts that greatly on your life in the end. I dont think anyone seriously wishes they DIDNT have any siblings but alot wish they had MORE siblings.

[megs]

I have been watching this thread with interest as I am in the same position as Freya, my husband is also unsure if he will cope with the demands a 4th child will place on the family.

I got alot out of everyones answers, but Mbear it did stike a chord, like you I too would like to have some luxuries for my children, but I think the we could manage.

Reading from other posts, food well I'm feeding 3 boys already and we don't eat steak now. And at present swimming lessons are the only mandatory sport given we live around dams I think it is essential that they be confident around water.

So now for me it is back to trying to convince DH that we can do it, that I will manage (he is a farmer and not around much) and that we will love being a family of 6.

Good luck Freya hope you have success in convincing your DH also

[Freya]

We can TTC a girl together Megs Atleast one of us has to hit the jackpot!

[Toomanytoomany]

I have six, although one has left home so technically only looking after five.

First thing: extracurricular activities. He is worried that we would be broke from having them all play something (and with what could prob be four boys theyd most likely all play football) and that most of our spare time outside of work hours would be spent ferrying them here there and everywhere. Thoughts?

Some associations give you a discount for subsequent kids. But, yeah, it can get expensive. Uniforms, fees, etc. You can get to know other parents though who can help out with spares, and I share netball on Saturday mornings with other parents, so I don't have to ferry dd#4 every week. Dd3's music lessons are after school and she can get herself there and home. To be honest, I don't necessarily think that parents *should* ferry their kids everywhere unless there's no alternative or they are too young. When they are older, they can ride bikes, catch the bus, etc. We also have limits on what they can be involved with - one sport, one other extra curricular, like music lessons, Scouts, etc.

His second thing: financial costs for feeding six people, and possibly four boys. With what I cook now, I definately have enough left over for an extra meal that usually gets eaten as lunch the following day or frozen for later. Thoughts?

Our food bill is about $250-$300 a week. It could be less if we tried harder. I do menu planning, and I try to do some cooking in advance (and I'm also including in that helpings from each meal for my dad who is an invalid, and I freeze a ton of meals for him each month). We are thinking of going to a couple of vegetarian meals a week for our health, but we're also happy about the impact it will have on our budget! I think you are right with the shop smarter idea, and the making your own snacks. But I can't recommend menu planning enough - it really does help you get the absolutely best value out of your food.

I just dont think one extra kid at this stage will impact all that greatly on our lifestyle. Three is already hectic, I am sure another child thrown in; while adding a bit extra busy-ness, will not make or break us. If its another boy even better, he will have untold amounts of perfectly usable clothing from his older brothers. We would just have to be savvy in optimising group discounts and the like...........

From a workload point of view, I didn't find #4 that much of a big deal either. Where I *did* notice the difference was in things like, family deals for entrance to things is always two adults, two kids, sometimes two adults three kids, but never EVER two adults four kids! Cars to fit four kids are more expensive. It's very hard to find hotel/motel accommodation for a family with four kids. But, we still have holidays, we still go places. With the hand me downs, clothes might go through two kids, even three, but by the time they get to #4 they can be a bit run down!

Where I really notice it is with four at school at the same time. The school fees, uniforms, books... it's a terrible time of year for us financially, especially coming just after Christmas. And pocket money. The kids all grow up knowing that when they hit sixteen we expect them to get a job to start looking after their leisure stuff by themselves, to ease the burden a bit.

My brutally honest opinion is that if you have to work really hard at convincing your dh to have another one, he's just going to keep on coming up with endless other reasons. It may be that he's just making excuses and he feels like he's done. And that's a harder one to answer than the practical questions you've asked.

[Toomanytoomany]

Oh, one more thing. If I asked my girls, "what would you prefer, your little brother, or more of life's luxuries?" I'm pretty sure Tom would win hands down. Siblings can be some of the most enriching relationships they'll ever have.