Declining needles for baby at birth

[meow]

I'm sure this must have been discussed here already, but I can't find it so if someone can feel free to post a link.

I'm just wondering why some people choose not to give their baby injections at birth? We have decided to postpone the Hep B vac as I believe birth is too young to be getting vaccinations. But I'm wondering about the Vit K- if you choose oral over needle you have to give it to them 3 times on certain days... the needle seems easier. Why do you choose oral? Is it simply about avoiding jabbing tiny little bubba? Or something more 'medical'?

[Pandora]

I think that there is a less likliehood of reaction from the oral dose than the needle, but I cant remember for sure.
I know we delayed on of the injections until the day I was leaving hospital as one of the effects it could have was to interfere with feeding, and we were having enough problems in that department already.

[Arimeh]

I know we had the Vit K injection just for ease I think. I don't think he suffered any effects from it, not that I could tell anyway. His problems with feeding were to do with his neck not a needle. Having said that, we didn't get the Hep B one at birth cos the midwife advised us not to, as its not needed if you aren't going away in the first two months of their life? So we didn't do it. However, if you don't do it, you don't get the immuisation rebate thingy from the government. Not sure if that is an issue or not for you? It wasn't for us. :-)

[Neenee Jellybeanie]

I know we had the Vit K injection just for ease I think. I don't think he suffered any effects from it, not that I could tell anyway. His problems with feeding were to do with his neck not a needle. Having said that, we didn't get the Hep B one at birth cos the midwife advised us not to, as its not needed if you aren't going away in the first two months of their life? So we didn't do it. However, if you don't do it, you don't get the immuisation rebate thingy from the government. Not sure if that is an issue or not for you? It wasn't for us. :-)

Aparently you still do - you just have to lodge a form . . . what's it called? A something objection form, basically saying you won't get your child immunised because you've researched it and don't think it's the best thing.

[BellyBelly]

The studies are all over the place - the first one linked the injection to childhood leukemia, the next found no link then the next found a small link to it - so very confusing. So its a matter of what you want really, but its an easier decision if you have had a healthy vaginal birth - if you have had a forceps/traumatic birth might be better to have it. You can also supplement your diet with vitamin K, as baby will get it through breastmilk.

[leebee81]

We have declined hep b but have agreed to Vit K. The problem we were told with the oral dose is that there can be issues with getting it all swallowed, it needs to be given in multiple doses... and something else I can't remember.

Neither of us is a Hep B risk and the baby won't exactly be out getting tats and picking up strangers in bars for the first two months so it can wait. Also, there is a 20 odd year history of Vit K being given with little side effects so we decided to go ahead. I might change my mind once I have the baby in my arms though.

[smiley10P]

We gave neither the Hep B or Vit K, since all babies are born with low levels of vitamin K, we figured their was a reason for low levels we also did a physiological third stage also, keeping it all natural here thanks

[Lulu]

I don't see the point of the Hep B and I still think it's wrong to introduce it. Thats why!

No one ever questioned me or hassled me about it.
You can still rec the immunization allowance regardless.

[Loqua]

My friend and her DH decided against the Vit K jab and, until they left the hospital, her DH had to stand guard by the baby's crib! Every time a nurse came to perform checks, they'd make a remark about bubs not having had the needle, and make preparations to do so... regardless of them explaining repeatedly that they did not want that for their child. They were so pleased to finally be out of there.

[Lea79]

My friend and her DH decided against the Vit K jab and, until they left the hospital, her DH had to stand guard by the baby's crib! Every time a nurse came to perform checks, they'd make a remark about bubs not having had the needle, and make preparations to do so... regardless of them explaining repeatedly that they did not want that for their child. They were so pleased to finally be out of there.

I don't understand that because written consent along with explanations need to be given before anything else can take place....interesting though!

[mountain mummy]

The thing that the midwives explained to me about the vit k is that the oral dose is actually 3 or more times higher than the injection.

As far as vaccinations, I have conscientiously objected for all of my kids so far, and signed all of the forms when booking into the hospital. Of course, you still get certain medical "professionals" questioning your decision (I even had the local early childhood nurse begging me to reconsider, for the safety of the other children they come into contact with!) My kids are all healthy and the only childhood disease they have picked up has been chicken pox (which isn't on the immunisation schedule anyway! Or should I say, not that I know of - it wasn't up until the birth of my last, but I haven't checked recently!)

I really do think it's all personal choice though, and I am glad to have that choice!

[meow]

We didn't have any hassles declining. It was in our birth plan so the midwives just brought us the right forms to sign. We ended up deciding to give him the vit k by injection though as he had a pretty big bruise on his head. We were happy with that as a case specific decision.

[paradise lost]

I'm glad they didn't pressure you to vax ren.

Coming a bit late but we decided to take the Vit K vaccine (in the UK they don't offer anything else until 2 months). I took the view that because DD wouldn't see a paed (homebirth, she saw the GP on day 2 or 3 i think) i'd rather obliterate the risk of Vit K deficiency right away. It's a very personal decision but for us we felt the fact we'd had a homebirth meant we'd minimised one kind of trauma and would thus feel ok about allowing the injection. When my SIL had her DD#1 she got the Vit K while lying alone and naked in a plastic cot under a bright light with MW's and Obs talking over her in loud voices while trying to get SIL's BP up and temp down (epidural complications). DD got hers in a dimmed, hushed room, lying skin-to-skin with me, breastfeeding. So that meant I felt ok about the circumstances around the injection.

Bx

[~Saram~]

We declined vit K and Hep B at birth with DS Hep B because we had no risk factors for Hep B so didn't see why we should introduce foregin matter at birth and vit K because after doing the research I didn't think the risk factors were worth the "welcome to the world, stick you with a needle" We got a lot of lectures about giving oral Vit K however our paed was much more supportive after he saw that we had followed up all three doses - apparently he sees a lot of people who don't follow through

However... DS was born at 36wks (induced) had little suck reflect and developed severe jaudice so when we had DD we decided to get the injectable Vit K as we read that it helps with jaundice and although she did suffer from slight jaundice it was no where near as bad as DS. We still declined the Hep B and there is now a revised schedule for people who refuse at birth whereas when we did it with DS there was a lot of confusion over if there was a catch up or not

[meow]

Oh poor bubbies- I didn't know they jabbed some babies unsupported. Our son didn't have his needle (and routine checks like weighing) till sometime in the afternoon (he was born at 7.30am) and with us right there with him.

[paradise lost]

Ren i was the birth assistant with SIL's #1 and it was my primary motivation for a homebirth. The VitK was like icing on a big medicalised doctor-centred (rather than baby or woman-centred) interventionist cake. Classic cascade (induction for EDD+10, gels, painful pre-labour, AROM, sinto drip, morphine, vomiting, epidural, posterior baby, slow dilation, low BP, fever), she was lucky to avoid forceps (though the Ob came in with them in his hand after she'd pushed on her back (she'd been given the epidural at 3cm and bubs was still posterior 9 hours later, a stint on her side finally allowed rotation anterior but then caused random decelerations so she went back on her back to push) for 40 minutes waving them above her, in litho (basically right at her vagina, between her feet which were velcro'd into the stirrups so she couldn't move them should her epi wear off a bit) and saying "If you don't get the baby out i'll use these and you and your baby don't want that!"). It was truly awful. Seeing her baby come into the world was wonderful but it was like watching people flush a miracle down a toilet. She was totally disempowered, her baby was not treated with respect by all the staff (needle-sticker being the worst offender) or even talked to when handled, and the two took a long time to bond. In fact they still obviously struggle compared to her #2 who she had with one shot of peth, a few sucks of gas and a lot of bouncing on a fit ball in the shower.

It was the most beautiful and saddest thing i had ever seen.

Bx

[mumma_lion]

Can anyone please help me I am not sure how you would know if you are a high risk for hep B?

When i had my daughter over 6 years ago I don't remember saying yes she can have the hep b needle? Which I know she did have because I just checked her blue book.

Thanks

[Nelle]

I *think* high risk groups are certain racial groups (not sure which), and perhaps those in a very low socio-economic bracket? I think perhaps that's why everyone gets the Hep B at birth, cos you can't say to someone, 'you have to get the hep B because you're Nellanese', in case that's seen as discriminatory, or racist or whatever. And also I think it's given at birth because perhaps some of those groups don't go to follow up appts or get other immunisations done.
(I could be way off track here, because I don't remember who told me that, a midwife, doctor, or a lady in the checkout queue...could have been anyone :P).