Reasonable Overtime?

**beansbeans!** · February 8th, 2013, 11:12 AM

In Dh's work contract it says that his normal hours are 7.6hrs per day, with two days off. Then it says that reasonable overtime will be required at times and that it will not affect his pay (he doesnt get paid for overtime).
The average day that dh works is 12 to 15hr days, with up to 18 hr days on weekends.

So heres my question, what constitutes reasonable overtime? There is no explanation in his work contract, his work dont give answers to this sort of stuff (I wonder why

). So does anyone have insight as to what is considered reasonable and what is not reasonable when it comes to overtime?

Tah

**LimeSlice** · February 8th, 2013, 11:14 AM

In his position, those hours would be considered reasonable. That is the standard for the industry and what is expected from his position within the brigade.

**LizLemon** · February 8th, 2013, 11:22 AM

I don't know what his position is but wow I'd want to be getting paid squigabucks for that. My DH works those sort of hours but he is in a very senior position is paid well.

**LuluHB** · February 8th, 2013, 12:35 PM

I don't know what he does or what level of seniority he has, but I think there is a huge difference between what is acceptable reasonable overtime "from time to time" as opposed to what you seem to be saying in that his contract is 7.5 hours per day but the ongoing day to day reality is effectively double that. That's not reasonable in my opinion.

In my former life I would never get paid overtime and while my hours were officially 8.30 to 5.30 pm with an hour for lunch, the reality was far more a sandwich at my desk while working and not leaving until more like 6.30 pm on a standard day, with much later finishes at particularly busy times.

**nothing2lose** · February 8th, 2013, 12:43 PM

My DP works similar unpaid hours overtime, as did I with my former employer. We both work in senior roles and it's expected.

**Floweryfields** · February 9th, 2013, 10:50 AM

Is he on a salary? I personally don't consider double the normal hours reasonable overtime.....maybe I am naive. It sounds to me like a good way to have people work twice as much as you have to pay for them to be there. So he doesn't get paid overtime rates or doesn't get paid at all for anything over 7.6hours?
You say he is on more than the award, but is he on double the award? Cause in reality that's what they are getting out of him.

And it is against the law to expect anyone to work above a six hour shift without at least 30 minutes (unpaid) break. You are also entitled to 2x10 min (paid) breaks if you work over those 6 hours. I don't believe it matters what industry you are in, as far as I am aware they are standard fairwork requirements.

**Onelittleprincess** · February 8th, 2013, 12:54 PM

Life of hospitality! Paid for 38 do more like 60+. With constant 'wages are to high'. Reasonable to me would be doing 45 hours a week and accruing time in lieu for overtime hours

**beansbeans!** · February 8th, 2013, 01:25 PM

he is 2ic at work and he's in hospitality. We expect the overtime and all that, and it never really bothers us. But at the moment things are a tad pear shaped there and well the boss wants more hours out of him. According to the boss there is to be no breaks except toilet breaks. No split shifts allowed, which splits alone would cut back on his hours yet the same amount of work would be achieved.
but as I said we expect the hours and are used to it, but its the term reasonable that we are unsure about. Today for instance he started at 6am that shift is meant to finish at 2pm, but he is working straight through because that is reasonable to the bosses. So after 2pm should be overtime, but is that reasonable?

**LimeSlice** · February 8th, 2013, 01:42 PM

I think it sounds like time he sat down and renegotiated his salary. If they need him to increase his hours and shoulder more responsibility than they have previously - a sudden and constant increase in his hours to save them the money it would cost them to employ the extra chef they obviously need - then I would be suggesting that he discusses the issue with his Head and the owner.

ETA: Do any of these extra hours go to time in lieu?

**beansbeans!** · February 8th, 2013, 02:10 PM

I think it sounds like time he sat down and renegotiated his salary. If they need him to increase his hours and shoulder more responsibility than they have previously - a sudden and constant increase in his hours to save them the money it would cost them to employ the extra chef they obviously need - then I would be suggesting that he discusses the issue with his Head and the owner.

ETA: Do any of these extra hours go to time in lieu?

he had a meeting with the powers to be last week where they talked about a pay rise. who knows if they will come through with that one. They have an ad running at the moment to fill a position, but they arent getting any bites that the powers to be like (wrong age, not enough experience etc)
Nah no overtime goes to time in lieu, that only happens for public holidays.

He isnt on the award, but if he pushed to get the award wage, then the base wage would be smaller but then he would have to be paid for every hour over the 7.6. So if they were to adhere to that then it would be worth while.

**chody47** · February 9th, 2013, 10:36 AM

I don't know much about the hospitality industry, but I feel that if you agreed to get $x for 7.6hrs work with some reasonable overtime but were actually working close to double that on a regular basis then its not at all reasonable and he should either not do the overtime (or at least not so regularly), should be paid for the overtime or should have an increase in his wage.

**Ms_Fi** · February 9th, 2013, 10:54 AM

I'd talk to fair work - that doesn't sound legal and they'll hopefully have some ideas how he can approach his boss about it.

**Footsteps** · February 9th, 2013, 11:48 AM

Id get advice because it really does sound like they dont want to pay for the true hours so class it as overtime. I hope you get it sorted x

**Nai** · February 9th, 2013, 12:04 PM

If he is in hospitality he is covered by an award and there national employment standards that need to be adhered to. He has to have a break, it's illegal to work those hours without a break. I would look at the contract, the award and talk to fair work.

**black_rose** · February 24th, 2013, 10:59 AM

Wow what a disgraceful employer! I know the industry has high expectations but that amount of overtime unpaid is over the top, hope your dh goes well with the new job