I think its time for some serious help

**Arimeh** · August 24th, 2011, 12:12 PM

Artechim - we are considering drugging her for a few nights to get her body back into the proper sleep cycle. of course, there is the guilt that goes along with it because she's still so young and we're drugging her.. lol

OP - I dunno how it works, I guess they could come to me, I know walker house do make house visits if necessary - but then they will find out how shocking the others sleep as well and find out that DS still needs us to sit next to him until he falls asleep, and then sees him crawl into our bed around midnight as well.. LOL

Lenny - I can't believe I've been here two years either! Definitely doesn't feel like it, but I've had two babies down here so it must be true..lol Her reasoning skills are ok I think, she's a pretty good talker for her age, and I think she understands a lot, but can't really tell us why she doesn't want to go to sleep - she just doesn't - or can't.

Cassius - I dunno, I've never had to look into it before, we just put up with it. Put up with DS needing someone there beside him to fall asleep, put up with her issues, put up with DD2 waking at all hours and coming into our bed, along with DS AND now DD3 sleeps in our bed. Seriously, its like musical beds here every night, never know who I'm going to wake up with.. lol

Jakabella - haven't heard of the rapid return, we can try it. She doesn't get out of bed though, just screams out for daddy.. and because she shares a bed with DD2, wakes her up and then DH has to get both of them back to sleep. Sometimes she comes into our room crying, and then wakes DD3 up too, and then I have to try and get her back to sleep while DH is dealing with DD1.

Too many kids all with sleep issues I think!! Should have stopped after DS

- cos since they all have issues, I guess it IS our parenting that is causing it.

ETA - Krys - she falls asleep by herself for her day naps. She is quite happy to go into aricyn's bed and fall asleep on her own, I check on her like half an hour later, and she's usually still awake, then I don't bother checking again (or get distracted by the other kids) and I think she falls asleep eventually, but we can't do it of a night time cos they share a bed, and from previous trials - if DD2 is asleep and DD1 is left in the room with her awake, she WILL wake DD2 up, pokes her or talks to her until she wakes. Then the whole cycle starts again with the two of them awake.

I think ultimately we need another room here. Cos then DD1 could have a room to herself and put herself to sleep or talk herself to sleep or something.. lol

**OceanPrincess** · August 24th, 2011, 12:17 PM

Too many kids all with sleep issues I think!! Should have stopped after DS

- cos since they all have issues, I guess it IS our parenting that is causing it.

Stop that!!!!!! Silliest thing I ever heard

Have you tried talking to the child health nurse about it? See what they think of the drugging idea? I hate the word "drugging"... but anyway.

Would you be prepared to take her to a residential place? Just the two of you? Could that work with the others? Prob not...

How long til you move back to Brissy? Can you get a house up there with more BRs? Sounds like it really might help...

**Artechim** · August 24th, 2011, 12:21 PM

MNB, my two both have all the sleep issues possible. Just as soon as one thing clears up, the next problem appears.

Just this morning DH was raving about how good night time has been in the last week - with DS only waking 1-2 times each night and DD 2-3 times, but easy resettles. Except for the other night when DS was wide awake at 2am and got up for the day, followed by DD at 4am.

Crap sleepers, or crap parenting we will never know. I just hope like hell that they outgrow it eventually!!

Don't feel too bad if you do go the drug route - it is only for a short time and can make a world of difference long term if she starts getting the sleep she needs xx

**onthefly** · August 24th, 2011, 01:12 PM

It's not parenting. It's genetic. Passed down on the paternal line.

**lilima** · August 24th, 2011, 01:30 PM

Could you try letting her have her own room, and putting DS and DD2 in together?

I

**RhiChiChi** · August 24th, 2011, 01:34 PM

I have a program called Sleep Sense, if you want a copy. My gf gave it to me but I never used it. gf says iIt is very hands on but my gf used it with her DS and he now is a good sleeper. I haven't used it with our DD b/c she is erratic - sometimes she sleeps, sometimes she doesn't, so I am not at the end of my tether. If you PM me your e-mail addy I will forward it to you - use it if you want, if not just discard the info.

**Arimeh** · August 24th, 2011, 01:39 PM

OP - I don't actually go to a child health nurse.. see.. more evidence of bad parenting.. lol I was thinking of taking her to a GP though and seeing what they think is the best course of action. We move at the beginning of next year, but we will be staying in one room at my brother's house, so that should be interesting. Probably have to drug everyone.. including me!!

Artechim - thanks

Jakabella - it might work, but usually she wants DH to pat her until she goes to sleep. Whereas, and this is funny, if its ME, she never asks me to pat her, cos I just don't do it, and she knows I won't do it. I find it too distracting for her, but DH does it cos he doesn't want her to scream and wake up DD2.

Mad - so I can totally blame DH for it? And his family? lol

Lilima - argh I dunno. We did try that once before and then DS wanted his own room cos he's the only boy and sick of sharing everything with his sisters. He's at a tough age too - mr know it all at 4.5 years. I'll discuss it with DH and see what we can come up with. Maybe DD2 can camp out in our room for a little bit and DD1 can have the double bed to herself and see if that helps.

Thanks for the suggestions guys, its truly a sucky situation, and I'm so jealous of people that have kids that sleep through, or have been sleeping through. In 4.5 years now, I've had one full night's sleep - some random night when I had 3 kids all of them decided to sleep through. I don't mind getting up for the baby, thats a given, but I feel sorry for DH getting up every night for most of the night (we don't usually get to bed till 11.30pm and he's up at 6) and he's starting to get really grey.. lol

**BrightSparkles** · August 24th, 2011, 03:55 PM

I feel your pain!!!! Neither of mine a good sleepers (DD1 is the same age)
I have been known to give polaramine for 3 nights in a row then not again for a while to help her and us get some sleep. Also helped me to work on getting into a new routine.
Things we have done....
- background music
- necklace that has "special dreams" of princesses and fairys etc
- special dream oil
- JB's rapid return
- a special teddy that only sleeps in bed
- water bottle
- let her choose her own sheets/donna cover etc
- let her sleep on the floor when she refuses the bed
- star chart and incentives
- baby gate
- let her take books to bed so she can read to herself

umm. i'm sure there is more but that's all i can think of atm. i'm sure you've probably tried many of those already though?

**Artechim** · August 24th, 2011, 04:53 PM

Another thing that might just be coincidence, but I started giving the kids florodix vitamin supplement in the past week and they have started sleeping better - I know a symptom of low iron is trouble sleeping. And some B vitamins might be helping too. I really have no idea, but when you have been so long without sleep any straw to grasp at will do lol

**Ca Plane Pour Moi** · August 24th, 2011, 05:27 PM

Not read all the replies, but I hear you loud and clear! That was my DS too. Up 2-3 times a night for hours at a time, me trying to get my teaching assignments sorted, DH never doing the night shift unless I had a breakdown... it is awful. I'm about ready to collapse just thinking of it. I couldn't do it with another three younger than him, don't know how you do it! You are a star. I'm also a bit jealous that you get all the sleeplessness over in one shot and I have years of it more to come.

I found the solution to our problem shortly after Easter time this year. DH was away for a week, I had a huge assignment due in and couldn't spend 2-3 hours getting Liebs to sleep, so every night was a film night in my bed (he insisted I join him at 9-10pm, but I had done some work at that point). Liebling was up until 11pm-1am all week, later than me some nights, Nursery for 8am and the most well-behaved he has been for ages.

So we moved bedtime back an hour. He tells us he's tired before bedtime and puts his own pyjamas on. I read him a story at 8pm (he is welcome to get into his bed and "read" to himself before then), put on his "singy" (a Fisherprice lights and music toy that plays for 15 minutes) and he goes off by himself. At first I had to go in and re-settle and it took him an hour, now he's asleep in about 10 minutes. He sleeps through a lot more now too. We've just come back from my mother's house, where he doesn't go to sleep so easily and is indulged (ie juice after lights out, food at 4am if he feels peckish...) but home, straight back to routine.

**MrsFabuloso** · September 3rd, 2011, 08:56 AM

I have no wise words for you hun. You know my kids have the same sorts of issues. Though they do sleep more than 7hours. That is such a small amount for a 3yr old.

Too many kids all with sleep issues I think!! Should have stopped after DS

- cos since they all have issues, I guess it IS our parenting that is causing it.

This is partly why I'm reluctant to get any kind of professional help. If I fix one, I still have the other two to deal with anyway, plus I must be doing something wrong for the 3 of them to all be such terrible sleepers. Until I can work out what that is, they will continue to be terrible sleepers!

I hope you can work it out babe, I know how torturous and damaging to relationships lack of sleep can be

ETA have you thought about allergies or sensitivities to additives ect? I think DS1 is probably sensitive to additives and all 3 to dairy, though to be honest I have been too lazy to try to fix it because it's so much effort, and I'm so tired, lol! I should go to an allergist or naturopath or something, though they cost money too, which we don't really have right now....