Scientific Link to Autism Identified

[entreat]

An interesting article that discusses two papers that analysed websites regarding vaccination information...
Immunisation gets bad rap on internet › News in Science (ABC Science)

The researchers also used the Google search engine for the term 'vaccination' until they found 100 'anti' sites, each of which was then examined. They concluded that these sites attempted to present themselves as legitimate, scientifically credible authorities, often using implied official status and extensively 'referencing' their claims to imply there is a mass of data on the dangers of vaccination.
On checking the references, the researchers found that they were dominated by self-published works on the dangers of vaccination. Referencing was frequently incomplete and included letters to the editors of newspapers and television interviews, usually authored by the same small pool of writers.

"It is virtually inevitable that anyone searching for vaccination information in the internet will quickly encounter florid anti-vaccination material," they write. "With many such sites masquerading as official scientific sites, some web users may not question the veracity of such material."

I can see (and saw from the moment I joined this thread) that it is extremely difficult to be educated on the issue if one doesn't understand the material they are reading. It's very easy to present a webpage as scientific & professional, when in fact having no credentials of relevance at all. This is my sole issue with this entire thread.

Yes, I am certain many of you have seen dominantly normal children 'change' after vaccinations & become Autistic to varying degrees. But there is also a large portion of people not represented on this thread (and indeed forum) that have seen children suffer severely or fatally from infection against the diseases that can be vaccinated against. Don't forget those facts - the diseases may kill a child, or permanently damage them, at a much higher risk rate than vaccination may damage them. That's why vaccines were invented in the first place. I doubt any of you know someone with disability from polio these days. Travel to a third-world country & you may just see that. Small pox - the last outbreak was in 1972. 8 years before I was born. That killer disease was responsible for one third of all blindness in Europe in the 18th century, and killed over 80% of the children it infected. Small pox was declared erdicated by the WHO in december 1979 through extensive vaccination programs in the 19th & 20th centuries. I can happily say I am extremely pleased that myself & my family will NEVER be at risk from blindness & limb deformity from this particular disease. And one day, I would like to see other diseases added to lonely list of eradicated diseases.

Again: your choice is your choice, but critically analyse what you read & research by checking those references - ensuring the references are numerous, current (younger than 10-15 years), from a broad variety of authors, and are pulished credible, peer-reviewed journals (not blogs, not letter to the editor, not websites). And are not solely emotive & anecdotal. Sad stories are pulling... but are definitely not the majority.

[Lulu]

Your decision about this vaccination appears to be that you are prepared to risk your children dying of chickenpox rather than risking them getting a mild rash or fever. Clearly the rash is much more common, but death is rather more drastic. I think your decision is very obviously the wrong one.

Maybe you should go back and re-edit too?

[Nelle]

It seems to me like we're not going to change each other's mind. It sounds like we've all done our research, made our decisions based on that and don't see any reason to shift from our views. That's fine I think, but personally I think that we probably can't say anything more to each other that would be helpful. That whole 'agree to disagree' thing. xo

[tenar]

It seems to me like we're not going to change each other's mind. It sounds like we've all done our research, made our decisions based on that and don't see any reason to shift from our views. That's fine I think, but personally I think that we probably can't say anything more to each other that would be helpful. That whole 'agree to disagree' thing. xo

I think you're right about this Nelle.

Actually I'm now so upset about this thread (hey, maybe it's also hormonal stuff or whatever - online things don't usually get to me so much but this surely has) that I think I need to take a break from BB for a while at least. This interaction is not doing me any good.

See you all later, maybe in the new year.

[Inanna]

Well I have bitten my tongue and tied my hands behind my back...

I too am confused Bec at why you are think that varicella, measles, mumps are all things that should be prevented but autisim not so... Wow that one is a really really loaded road & I don't think I want to go down there. But please think about what you are saying. Autisim is rather more difficult to manage than Aspergers. I can't even go there with you but please think about that. Think about what it might feel like to parent & love a child with Autisim...

for all those that do deal with Autisim every day - the road is not an easy one...

[christy]

I find it hard to comment on this, in fact I read some of this thread and cried....

I wouldn't replace Matilda for anything else in the world, I want her to enjoy being her... I don't want her to have to "fit in" I don't want to change her... but I wouldn't wish is on anyone. The frustration she feels, the anger... the emotional pain she is in a lot of the time because the world doesn't "fit" her.

If I had a choice to take it all away from her.... I would. If I could take the sensory issues where noises make her physically painful.... I would. If I could make food textures edible for her.... I would. If I could make people understand her, rather than deal with bullying.... I would.

If not vaccinating her would have done that.... I wouldn't.

[Inanna]

Christy

I have had the same reaction in reading this thread. Words can be like steam rollers sometimes...

[maz]

FWIW - I have had my eye's opened big time.

[Mum2SweetCs]

I have been following this thread closely as it is a really good reading both sides of the argument.

Throughout this thread I have seen one thing in common with all you ladies, either you choose to vaccinate or not, the fact is you are trying to prevent you children from suffering.

I am not a scientist, nor someone who has been personally affected by autism but I am a mother and being a monther I would never ever ever wish the slightest wound on my DD, let alone life long suffering.

Huge to all you ladies and please don't get upset over each other as the world would be so boring if we all agreed!

sorry my two cents worth.

[entreat]

wow - I swear that's the best thing posted so far.

[Fleur]

Mum2OneSweetBun...

I just want to say, as someone who has never had the benefit of this kind of discussion before... I really value the fact that I can come on here and read all of this.

My children are vacced becasue I did not know any different.

Now I am not saying whether I regret that or not, or whether or not I would choose differently after reading all this.

BUT it is a wonderful thing to have a forum like this where I can come & hear different opinions & experiences...it's what it's all about, isn't it?

I don't have to agree with you to find your opinion interesting & valid...the world would be a much poorer place if we were all the same & thought & said the same....

Thank you to everyone who has shared their stories & experiences.

[murraysmum]

my murray is fully vacinated but i dont think the vacine contributed to his autisim
but i have exspressed the vacne debate with my pead and he said with this bub if im concnered or confused to come in and call and he will talk me through it

i understand with measels and mumps but if a vacine is going to make him worse ild like to know before hand so i can deal with it

we all have diffrent opnions as some of us a bit more passionate as we live with it daily

and reading what u wrote brang a tear to my eye christy its so true

[Traveller]

I have been following this thread from the beginning and would like to share a little of my reasoning behind me decisions with regards to vaccinations.

With DS1 I fully vaccinated. Everything that was on offer, so great was my belief in the medical line. I thought that parents who did not vaccinate were putting their children at unneccesary risk, and also putting other children at higher risk.

DS1 never reacted to any vaccination in a negative way. A few weeks after the MMR my best friend's son got chickenpox so I asked my GP if DS1 could be vaccinated straight away, and he agreed. At this point my son was talking normally for a 15 month old, gave eye contact, went to strangers happily, smiled constantly, etc.

That all changed within a few weeks. By 20 months his speech was enough of a concern that his hearing was extensivly tested but my GP was confident he was not autistic. By 2 years we were using sign language. By 2 years and 4 months all eye contact had stopped, he stopped any speech (could not even say Mum, Dad, Baby, etc, words he had said frequently at 15 months)

I did not blame this on vaccines, I thought he was maybe autistic but we had no proof as the GP was confused by the fact at 20 months he still interacted with his baby brother and had said definitively "not autistic".

For a completely different reason (his knees) we took him to see a chiropractor. After a few visits, and being held by his dad, he finally allowed her to make one small adjustment on his neck (she could not treat his hips, he would not let her and kept screaming). Within 10 minutes he said "Dad". Within a week he spoke a sentence. Within a month he looked me in the eye and told me he loved me.

What has that got to done with vaccines? Possibly nothing, but my chiropractor explained to me that the toxins in vaccines can sometimes make the body react like this. I do not believe vaccines cause autism, I do believe however that they can make the body shut down in certain ways, like any other drug. I think this reactions is often confused with autism, which has existed for as long as humans have.

DS2 was fully vaccinated except for the varicella, because as an educated woman I have decided I would rather take the risk of the disease. My twins have only had the 5 in 1 (whooping cough, polio, tetanus, etc). My GP is refusing to give them any other vaccine because I did not give everything that was recommended when it was recommended. I want my children vaccinated with most vaccines but one jab at a time please and only when they are bigger, stronger, and more able to deal with the side effects. Does this make me a terrible parent? Some might say so.

FWIW I keep them away from my friend's daughter, who has a compromised immune system.

I am not telling this story as another vaccination anecdote, more a plea to those of you who think we should all vaccinate because we are told to, to try and understand why parents choose not to vaccinate. I feel sick when there are measles outbreaks, I fight with myself constantly over my decisions. The decision to partially vaccinate and delay vaccination is, IMHO, a much harder one to make than the decision to vaccinate. I wish so much I could go back to a much simpler time when I believed everything like Tenar does, but life has taken me a different route and all I ask is that I am respected as a parent to make my decisions myself.

[Bumperstump Cummerbund]

I've been thinking about this thread all flamin day! One thing had me wondering - someone said to only trust scientific evidence, not anecdotal stories. But, why would scientists do test on things just randomly? Wouldn't they test in response to a large group of people concerned about the same thing?

So, while anecdotal evidence may not be 100% trustworthy, surely it has its place?

[Mummato2]

And if you don't, then thats fine too but please do not call them ill-educated or tell them that they are wrong and their children are more likely to die - that is just sick and you should be ashamed.

Well said,

Tenar, I haven't bothered to answer your request of picking out those stats. I took the time to read and make INFORMED choices based on a lot of factors. Some medical, some personal and just plain old gut instinct.

If you are interested - go ahead and take the time to read through them and take from it what you will.

I am not even going to bother with retaliating to the comment you made about my choice potentially killing my children. It's a low blow and I won't crawl to your level.

What I will say is if there weren't people that didn't go against the grain and not vaccinate, there would be no further research done or progression to a safer option.

[Nelle]

So Traveller - are you saying that the chiropractor sorted out your son's issues? How is he now?

[Traveller]

So Traveller - are you saying that the chiropractor sorted out your son's issues? How is he now?

He is now a very communicative, intelligent, articulate 5 year old. One of the top in his class, in fact. The change in him since he saw a chiropractor was extreme. I do not believe though that she cured autism, but she certainly helped break down the barriers he had which were causing autistic traits.

[Inanna]

Traveller thankyou for sharing your painful story.
I understand the courage it takes to stand up and say no... It's really tough in the face of "scientific fact"...

I have heard stories such as your own before - & it interests me greatly. However, interestingly these "scientists" poo poo it all as "coincidence" "nervous mother" etc etc...

I know a woman in the town in which I live who has a son who had a similar reaction to a vaccine & she used craniosacral therapies, chiropractic and something else that I cannot remember right now... I will remember & come back. However, she has had amazing changes with her son. So much so that they have moved away & are travelling around Aust.

There is much we don't know - there is much that we dont understand. To believe that a scientific test or study gives all the answers is in my humble opinion extremely flawed - to say the very least in the very nicest way!