Breastfeeding (or lack of) at hospital - debrief...

[AliBaby]

Hoping I am not going to be judged for what I am writing here as I feel like "I should have known".

I didn't realise how angry and upset I was about this until a friend was telling me about her experience with bf at hospital at hospital and how wonderful it was.

Long story short... (actually it didnt turn out to be short...sorry)

I had DD at 3:12am, first feed was at 5:30am.
Had no idea what I was doing and I didnt think it was working. I asked the midwife how do I know when to feed DD? I was told that "babies dont actually need milk in the first 24hours as they still have all the nourishment in their bodies from the placenta". I was also told "dont feed DD unless a midwife is there to make sure attachment is correct".
Left delivery and into maternity at 7:30am. Big changeover of staff because of time of day.
Visitors, doctors, midwives come and go through the day, I do a physio class, the day just flies by and it all seems to be a bit of a whirlwind.
Had another visitor at about 4:30 who asked me when I had to feed DD. I said I have no idea! No one has come and told me. I hadnt fed her since the morning. She was in shock and said I needed to feed her and went and got someone.
The midwife then came in and looked at my notes and seen I hadnt fed her. People had been checking my notes all day & not said anything.

I feel so stupid now as its common sense but it really wasnt explained to me and even when I asked this midwife how often to feed her she said every 5 hours, another said every 3 hours. I was just so confused!!!! It wasnt until I saw the LC at hospital that I got the right info and felt better about breastfeeding.

Oh dear, so embarrassing...I know this sounds really dumb but I had no idea how often a baby needs to be fed, I was sleep deprived after 63hours awake and not using my brain and DD was sleeping all the time so I just didnt think that I needed to wake her. After all I was waiting for them to come and tell me it was time.

I am just really angry that this happened. I was lucky that I really was determined to bf and gained alot of support and info from BB and we are still going well on our bf journey but it is devastating to think about that first day.

I didnt complain at the time because I felt embarrassed (still do a little bit but needed to get this out).

I dont know about midwifery courses, but it seems that there needs to be more consistency with the information that is given to new mums. Every time a midwife changed shift I was told something different..

Thanks for listening. Sorry its a bit rambled. No replies needed. Just needed to get that out as I have been holding it in for a while.

[Sterla]

Oh Ali, that's awful! Don't feel embarrassed - you were a new mum! I was completely clueless with DS too!

I wasn't overly impressed with the b/f 'advice' I was given in hospital. I was never told or shown how to get DS to properly attach. Because I'd had a c/s, I had to buzz the midwives whenever DS needed a feed anyway, as I couldn't get out of bed. Only problem was, the midwives way of getting DS to attach was simply to force his head and my boob together . Before I had DS, I was told in the antenatal classes, etc, about how breastfeeding friendly the hospital was - but I really don't feel like I was offered much support. There seemed to be a bit of a 'work it out yourself' attitude.
I've found midwives are generally not much help when it comes to b/f - but LC are absolutely wonderful!

Sorry you had such a bad start - but look at you now!!!

[*TripleJ*]

similar story here but there wasnt much forcing but not a lot of help i got a cracked nipple after the first feed i met an LC too little too late i was already discouraged and it was enough to make me wanna stop after 5 days coz of the pain

[AliBaby]

Thanks so much Sterla. You are so lovely.
I think that alot of hospitals want to say they are breastfeeding friendly and they might encourage women to breastfeed but dont help to educate them. Like you, having a midwife thrust DD's mouth onto my boob didnt teach me how to b/f, in fact I found it quite the opposite.
It would just be good if all midwives were trained to be lactation consultants as well just to get women off to the best start that they can.
Thanks again for your kind words

[AliBaby]

similar story here but there wasnt much forcing but not a lot of help i got a cracked nipple after the first feed i met an LC too little too late i was already discouraged and it was enough to make me wanna stop after 5 days coz of the pain

Thats terrible as well. I didnt get to see the LC until the end of my second day . I also got cracked nipples from hospital even though it was the midwives that were the ones attaching DD.

[ladybird11]

Very similar cicrumstance happened when I had DS too hun - it is dreadful isn't it?

I actually lodged a complaint due to the lack of support when it came to b/f. Post natal care is just as important and sometimes it doesn't seem like its a priority (well certainly at one hospital which shall remain nameless ).

Hugs hun.

[Visitor3]

Oh no hun that's terrible ! No one is born with that knowledge so don't even think for a minute you should have just known what to do, when and how. I was only a little opposite to you. I thought I was doing everything right in the hospital ! Not one midwife or LC came to see me or check if I actually was even holding DD correctly let alone if she was latching. I went to a 3 hr breast feeding class through the hospital before I had DD so I thought that's was everything I needed to know ? I also didn't know how often to feed? By the third day when my nipples became so sore and cracked I told a midwife that I didn't think DD was latching properly because now I was really sore and she grabbed DD and my boob and pushed us together like she was playing the cymbals !

It's hard when there is such little focus placed on guiding new mums on how to BF, milk supply, correct latching etc. You're not alone and you certainly can vent about it. On the upside look at you now...Good that you're one of the lucky one's to be able to BF successfully.

[~Raven~]

I think that sometimes we are so unsure of what to do and if we get a midwife that isn't quite so good we can be terribly let down. Being told different things creates awful confusion I agree!

One would also expect for bubs chart to be checked and questions asked about input and output so as for it not happening by any one of those Drs or midwives throughout the day isn't good enough on their part. I had no idea that they would be so concerned about that stuff as a first time mum.

It's so overwhelming and you didn't do anything wrong OK!

[Barb Glare]

Hi, Ali,

What a difficult time you had of it. It is a complete credtit to you that you have persisted.
Sadly, what you describe is common, but still inexcusable.
For any other woman expecting a baby there are 2 things you can do to make sure your early breastfeeding experience is a much more positive one.
Join the Australian Breastfeeding Association, and go to one of their breastfeeding classes - held in most areas. I'm starting to think of it as "your baby's first immunisation against stupidity". (Other people's stupidity!)
There are a galaxy of uninformed people who deliberately or inadvertantly will derail your breastfeeding experience. Having sound research based knowledge, and quick access to supportive people will do much to circumvent this.
The second thing is to make sure you are giving birth in a "Baby Friendly" hospital. This is a World Health Organisation and UNICEF accredited scheme and means that certain standards including staff education must be followed

[ss_storm]

Sadly it was the same for us...I had no idea what i was doing and DD wasn't attaching properly. There were a couple of midwives who were excellent and did help a lot, but I think I needed consistent help not just every time that midwife was on shift. Before we were discharged they wanted to see that she was feeding properly so told me to buzz them every time she attached properly...no one turned up until 30 mins or so later, so of course by that time she was back asleep again!
I feel embarrassed, like I should have known better...and I do think it is one reason why we are now FF.

[Arcadia]

you poor thing. Stories like that make me feel so, so angry!!!

I know homebirth isn't for everyone, but at least I got 6 weeks of post-natal care by the same midwife, who was also a LC! The hospital system just doesn't compare and that's what our taxes are supposed to pay for!

Where is the post-natal support in this country?? Every woman should get their own midwife/nurse for 6 weeks who comes to the hospital/home, so at least you get the same advice!
Grrr...you poor love!

[STARRYSKY]

Im so sorry your BF experience started out so horribly, I feel for everyone in this thread who has been through the same.
I was lucky and had a good BFing class that I attended a week before birth, I was glad I did, else I wouldnt have had a clue either.
The MWs where I was were ok, some very bad, in the end, I just "got on with it" without their help, like I said though, I was lucky (and very grateful) that its been a relatively easy ride for us.
But for my friend, who rang me from her hospital and asked me how many hours between feeds for a 3 day old baby, as she couldnt get a straight answer from anyone there, I was shocked at some of what she was told.
like, dont wake him to feed, I asked how long he had been asleep, oh about 6 hours now, she said, I told her to wake him up and feed him. I then told her that all I did was put him on everytime he made a noise, everytime he woke up. etc.
I think its sad that this seems to be such a common thing, Hope eveything is going well now. xx

[shellbell3]

Ali don't blame yourself, I find sometimes that some midwives forget that new mums don't know what they're doing. Its all a blur those first few hours.
Its never too late to put in a complaint. It doesn't have to be an official one if you don't want it be but you can find out who the patient rep is at the hospital and write him/ her a letter on it. You never know maybe others have had the same issue and they can start looking into it to improve for future mums to be.

[~Saram~]

Same thing happened to me!

Tried to get DS on the breast after birth - no interest. Was told not to worry some babies are very sleepy for the first 24hrs and DS was 4 wks early. Was told he would cry when he needed to feed. Pretty much the whole day went past without a lot of feeding, he would go on, fall asleep so I would put him down. Another 24hrs later I mentioned he had crystals in his urine - was this normal that's when everyone started freaking out! I was to wake him every hour, I was pumping in between (getting nothing and being belittled for not being able to express more than 5 mls) Jaundice set in so he was even sleepier, given formula becuase I wasn't making enough milk, tube feed cause he was so sleepy and had no suck reflex.

One midwife would come in and say attachment was fine, yes of course he was getting enough, next one would be in saying no he needed another formula feed. Ped came in and said no more formula (thank God for him) put us on a supply line with nipple shields every two hours - we went home 5 days after birth soley expressing.

7 days after birth my milk came in and we went on to use nipple shields for the next 9 months and by 3wks he was all breastfed without expressing as much.

With DD she was on the breast within 30 min and I spent the rest of the time in hospital feeding her whenever she stirred :-) I then got in trouble for feeding too often LOL to which I replied I didn't mind and would rather get my milk in and have BF established then worry about how often she was feeding.


I agree there needs to be more consistent advice. Even though at times it is nice to get the different experiences and ideas (like one midwife showing me how to feed lying down etc and different positions) I think that for new mums it would be nice if there was some continuity of info given. When my SIL was pregnant I got her a subscription to ABA and the book "breastfeeding... naturally" which comes with the subscription and she said it was reallly helpful to have had the chance to read that before birth so she knew what was normal.

[fourthontheway]

That sounds like what I went through. It seems to me that if they're serious about promoting breastfeeding they should ALL have lactation qualifications, or not give advice about it! Some of the advice I got was total garbage, and it all contradicted what the last person had said!

Don't feel embarrassed about it, it's not YOUR job, it's THEIR job and they clearly did a bad one. Definitely worth a complaint letter!

[Gigi]

i was planning to bf, if possible, and this is what i did during pregnancy.

Join my local aba group, met the people in it whilst i was pregnant. Listened to their meetings, heard what they went thru (which was a revelation to me) and good education for what i was about to go thru.

Signed up for the 3hour ABA bf-ing class (with your partner) that you do when in your 3rd trimester (that was MUCH more helpful than the hospital bf-ing class).

signed up for ABA subscription which means you get sent their two monthly mag called ESSENCE. i read this from cover to cover each time it arrives - so practical.

From the aba group, and reading posts on bellybelly, i was always warned that the midwife help with bf-ing is very random and inconsistent, so to get around that, i went with the Group Midwifery Practice part of the hospital. That meant i had the same midwife thru pregnancy and for six weeks post natally. I knew she would be there visiting me (home or hospital) so i decided to either ignore or just listen to the midwives in the hospital, and wait for MY midwife to arrive, because i wanted consistent supportive info and i knew she was very positive and pro-bf-ing. In the first few days, she came to see us multiple times a day, it was such a relief to have that continuity. (this is in a public hospital).

we had a complicated labour and i fought after two epidurals (in a breastfeeding friendly hospital) to be allowed to feed my baby 2.5 hours after the complicated c-section. We definately didn't get immediate skin to skin, due to baby being delivered unconscious.

There is SO MUCH mis-information out there, including people you EXPECT would know what to do (medical people working with pregnant women and babies).

Search out private lactation consultants, independent midwives.

online
la leche
australian breastfeeding association

i found in the first two years of my child's life, ANYTHING that went wrong with her, medical people would FIRST say "oh, well stop the breastfeeding and it will be fine". Like it was a stock standard answer, to any baby malady (like reflux, or not sleeping well).

THe WHO reccomendation of feeding until two, and beyond - most medical people i spoke to thought three months or six months was the time to breastfeed for.

Breastfeeding is a time consuming thing to do, although super convenient on many levels, and doing it, made me aware of how UNCHILDFRIENDLY our society is.

There are SO many health benefits to breastfeeding, many that will help my child's future health throughout her life. i reminded myself of that, each time someone tried to talk me out of bf-ing her.

I was pressurised to put her on formula from five months of age (so i coudl have a life apparently). Nevermind that we had actually gotten to a stage where bf-ing was working well for us, my baby was healthy as anything, my supply was fine, no reason to stop at all.

i felt no-one (apart from the ABA) understood how important it was that i keep bf-ing (while i could). i was happy with my choice, but felt pretty alone (in real life) about that choice (everyone else around me ff-ing). Luckily my child's father had gone along to the aba bf0ing class, and has been a good bf-ing cheersquad, you NEED someone in your corner. Our r'ship has dissolved, but at least he has kept supporting the bf-ing r'ship btwn me and my DD. He learnt the benefits and sees them in her heath everyday.

i'm sure i've gone WAY off topic, but by god, this topic gets me fired up. i have no idea why i've had to FIGHT SO HARD to do something positive (bf) my DD.

[MantaRay]

Ali hun, as you can tell from the responses, your experience is all too common. Please don't feel bad. I am so glad that you have posted because it might help someone else who hasn't had their baby yet.

I was the same too when DS1 was born. I thought I didn't need to know any more than we learnt at ante-natal class because the mws would help, and there was an LC at the hossy. How wrong I was!!! The mws really didn't give me the right bfing info at all, and did so many wrong things when trying to help. The LC was one of the mws on shift who happened to have studied bfing and had no time to see me because she was busy with her own patients.

Now I know that you can't rely on the hospital staff to help, that you are far better off having done an ABA Breastfeeding Education Class first, and that the ABA helpline and counsellors are a fantastic source of information and support. I really wish I'd joined when I was first pg!!

[Miss E]

Just wanted to pop in and commend you on starting this thread! I also had a very similar experience, I didn't know how often to feed and was told 'until your milk comes in it's just about getting to know each other so don't worry too much'. As a result of that advice I didn't feed DS for 7 hours (nobody told me how often I should be feeding) on day 2. He ended up with jaundice and on formula. I remember feeling like such a fool, how could I think that he didn't need to be fed. Anyway, just wanted to say that I was just as embarrassed, only difference is I didn't have the courage to start a thread like this. So good on you honey, hopefully you will be able to help a lot of other ladies avoid the same situation.