Breastfeeding (or lack of) at hospital - debrief...

[Gigi]

i was planning to bf, if possible, and this is what i did during pregnancy.

Join my local aba group, met the people in it whilst i was pregnant. Listened to their meetings, heard what they went thru (which was a revelation to me) and good education for what i was about to go thru.

Signed up for the 3hour ABA bf-ing class (with your partner) that you do when in your 3rd trimester (that was MUCH more helpful than the hospital bf-ing class).

signed up for ABA subscription which means you get sent their two monthly mag called ESSENCE. i read this from cover to cover each time it arrives - so practical.

From the aba group, and reading posts on bellybelly, i was always warned that the midwife help with bf-ing is very random and inconsistent, so to get around that, i went with the Group Midwifery Practice part of the hospital. That meant i had the same midwife thru pregnancy and for six weeks post natally. I knew she would be there visiting me (home or hospital) so i decided to either ignore or just listen to the midwives in the hospital, and wait for MY midwife to arrive, because i wanted consistent supportive info and i knew she was very positive and pro-bf-ing. In the first few days, she came to see us multiple times a day, it was such a relief to have that continuity. (this is in a public hospital).

we had a complicated labour and i fought after two epidurals (in a breastfeeding friendly hospital) to be allowed to feed my baby 2.5 hours after the complicated c-section. We definately didn't get immediate skin to skin, due to baby being delivered unconscious.

There is SO MUCH mis-information out there, including people you EXPECT would know what to do (medical people working with pregnant women and babies).

Search out private lactation consultants, independent midwives.

online
la leche
australian breastfeeding association

i found in the first two years of my child's life, ANYTHING that went wrong with her, medical people would FIRST say "oh, well stop the breastfeeding and it will be fine". Like it was a stock standard answer, to any baby malady (like reflux, or not sleeping well).

THe WHO reccomendation of feeding until two, and beyond - most medical people i spoke to thought three months or six months was the time to breastfeed for.

Breastfeeding is a time consuming thing to do, although super convenient on many levels, and doing it, made me aware of how UNCHILDFRIENDLY our society is.

There are SO many health benefits to breastfeeding, many that will help my child's future health throughout her life. i reminded myself of that, each time someone tried to talk me out of bf-ing her.

I was pressurised to put her on formula from five months of age (so i coudl have a life apparently). Nevermind that we had actually gotten to a stage where bf-ing was working well for us, my baby was healthy as anything, my supply was fine, no reason to stop at all.

i felt no-one (apart from the ABA) understood how important it was that i keep bf-ing (while i could). i was happy with my choice, but felt pretty alone (in real life) about that choice (everyone else around me ff-ing). Luckily my child's father had gone along to the aba bf0ing class, and has been a good bf-ing cheersquad, you NEED someone in your corner. Our r'ship has dissolved, but at least he has kept supporting the bf-ing r'ship btwn me and my DD. He learnt the benefits and sees them in her heath everyday.

i'm sure i've gone WAY off topic, but by god, this topic gets me fired up. i have no idea why i've had to FIGHT SO HARD to do something positive (bf) my DD.

[MantaRay]

Ali hun, as you can tell from the responses, your experience is all too common. Please don't feel bad. I am so glad that you have posted because it might help someone else who hasn't had their baby yet.

I was the same too when DS1 was born. I thought I didn't need to know any more than we learnt at ante-natal class because the mws would help, and there was an LC at the hossy. How wrong I was!!! The mws really didn't give me the right bfing info at all, and did so many wrong things when trying to help. The LC was one of the mws on shift who happened to have studied bfing and had no time to see me because she was busy with her own patients.

Now I know that you can't rely on the hospital staff to help, that you are far better off having done an ABA Breastfeeding Education Class first, and that the ABA helpline and counsellors are a fantastic source of information and support. I really wish I'd joined when I was first pg!!

[Miss E]

Just wanted to pop in and commend you on starting this thread! I also had a very similar experience, I didn't know how often to feed and was told 'until your milk comes in it's just about getting to know each other so don't worry too much'. As a result of that advice I didn't feed DS for 7 hours (nobody told me how often I should be feeding) on day 2. He ended up with jaundice and on formula. I remember feeling like such a fool, how could I think that he didn't need to be fed. Anyway, just wanted to say that I was just as embarrassed, only difference is I didn't have the courage to start a thread like this. So good on you honey, hopefully you will be able to help a lot of other ladies avoid the same situation.

[~Kaz~]

Ali. It's really not good enough is it? I don't think you should feel bad at all. You did well to function after being awake that long!

I had a similar experience - although our first feed happened within an hour or so of Js birth, later that night the mws were telling me I didn't need to feed him (I did insist and needed their help as I was flat on my back and unable to lift him) and the next day they were telling me it was my fault he was unsettled because my milk hadn't come in and "we'll take him for a while so you can rest - you don't have any milk for him". To my eternal shame I let them take him for a couple of hours. I wasn't thinking straight either after a difficult birth and heavy PPH. When they brought him back and I asked if he'd slept, they said he'd been awake and screaming/crying the whole time. I was mortified and kept him with me after that and fed him whenever he woke up which was often. The advice for me to not feed him as often could have been devastating, because of my blood loss, I actually needed all the help I could get to ensure my milk came in. I didn't even see a LC at all and only had a handful of feeds observed. They told me he had "textbook attachment" but he was pulling back regularly on my nipple (frustrated at slow let downs I think) and he managed to do a lot of damage that way. I was annoyed too. I'd done a lot of reading but you don't know what you don't know.

I have a mate who has a one week old girl - she ended up cracking it at her mw's because of all the conflicting advice she got every single shift. It's so common.

Anyway, that's a bit of a ramble, but I wanted to put my 2 cents worth in to say you're definitely not alone. Put in a complaint if it will make you feel better darl. If enough women complain, they will have to start training their staff more.

[AliBaby]

Thankyou all for you replies.

I am so sorry that so many of us had bad experiences at hospital. With all the publicity about breastfeeding being so important to start babies off on, they are letting women and babies down by not giving the correct advice to begin with.

So many of you have had such great points.

Miss E- thanks hun It took me 9months to get it out but am kind of comforted IYKWIM that I am not alone although it shouldnt happen to anyone, I just dont feel like it was my fault as much.

Kaz- that is terrible. I am so sorry you had that experience.

Shanti- I know you had a really tough time to start out with bf DD and you have done such a wonderful job to get through all that. It was great that you were so determined as that rough start could have easily made you give up had you not been. It would be great if every new mum saw a LC on day 1, just like a doctor comes round to check the baby and mum, a LC should come and check out the bf and help, explain and answer questions.

MR- It is scary to know how many women like me were given incorrect information and advice from trained hospital staff who you would think would know.

Gigi- I have been told by some people it is time to wean so I can have a life! I mean WTF kind of comment is that! I like you had just got to the stage where DD's and my breastfeeding realtionship was going great and I havent felt like my life is restricted at all!. I told them I have a great life thanks!

fourthontheway- Couldnt agree more! They are sending the wrong message and so many women like some ho have posted in this thread have then as a consequence had to go to formula.

Shell- after reading all of this I might just put in a complaint. I would like to have future children at the same hospital as apart from the breastfeeding I had a wonderful experience so it cant hurt to tell them how they could improve their care.

Raven- I really thought they would have said something since they were checking my charts why nothing was said.

Wish I could respond to everyone as you have all said such valid things and I really do thank you for sharing your experiences with me. It has taken a massive weight off my shoulders.

[Jennifer13]

hun, thanks for sharing your story. It's really important that mums-to-be are aware that they need to be proactive in getting bfing help before and after birth, because unfortunately, not only is your situation common, it's the NORM!

I did the bfing class at the hospital and I had BB to educate me before birth. I was very focused on getting bfing right - it was my main concern since I was having a c/s due to placenta praevia. I didn't get skin-to-skin straight away and I was away from DD for half an hour (or more) while in recovery. DP brought her in to me as soon as I got back to my room and asked. I got her out and put her to the bb straight away. I did all the things I learned/read about, without any MW or LC there. I wasn't prepared to wait, I was hell bent on having DD on the bb within the first two hours of her birth. She bf beautifully.

A very shocked MW came in as we were bfing and told me I should have waited, but took one look at her and left me to it. They did come and pay attention to me when I bf for the next few hours, but she was taken to the nursery until early am when I could get up and walk about. (They did bring her into me when she woke up, but I really wish I hadn't been pushed out to the last c/s of the day so I couldn't just keep her with me.)

Despite our relatively good start to bfing, the one thing I really didn't like was the MW the following night. DD and I were doing really well and she 'expressed' my colostrum for me to syringe feed DD. There really wasn't any need and I don't appreciate the way I was manhandled. Even though I'd been so proactive and confident in my advice and ability to bf, I still got 'bullied' into doing something completely unnecessary and quite confronting. Next time, (if I don't get my home birth!) I'll put my foot down even harder.

thanks again for sharing your story.

[Cassius2]

Hi there!

Wow, so many girls have had similar experiences!

i count myself 'lucky' that the midwife who attended my birth was pretty savvy with the whole b/f thang, so DD and i got off to a good start...

BUT on the 2nd night i was harangued by an over zealous LC who yelled at me because i was 'evidently' dehydrating my baby by not feeding her enough. she failed to read the notes on myself and DD that we were on a fairly strict feed schedule because DD was low birth weight and had respitory issues. she demanded then and there (waking my baby up!!) that she needed to get on the boob and not stop. ANYWAY, DD began to feed again (after only having had a full feed 10 mins prior). what resulted was that she became sooo full of milk (mine came in early) that her belly just couldnt cope (when bubbas are born their bellies are the size of a marble so imagine!). after almost 4 hours of solid feeding (and screaming from DD and tears from me) i walked out of the room hysterical with DD in my arms and searched out another midwife (i had buzzed previously only to get the LC back in the room yelling at me, and telling me not to annoy anyone and keep quiet and keep feeding). the midwife that saw me immediately saw teh agony that DD was going through and she had to be taken to SCN for 24 hours (and put on oxygen all over again). i felt like a monster having done that to my baby. up until that point i felt really cool and comfy with the b/f...after that i would experience moments of panic if DD coughed or guzzled on the boob as it brought back that horrendous night.

[Rosie's Mum]

I am so sorry you had that experience! It would have been so easy to end up not breastfeeding after that. You should be very proud that you pushed through.

I had a weird experience, I fed for the first 2 days and then my milk didn't "come in" and they said my baby was hungry and gave her some formula and then before I was discharged I had to go and learn how to make formula. I didn't really take it in because I had an emergency c section and I didn't know which way was up. But I remember feeling devastated that my baby would be formula fed.

Then that afternoon my milk came in and I could have fed an army for a year, my baby never had any problems attaching etc and in hindsight I think, "I can't be the first person whose milk took awhile to come in, why dicount breastfeeding so quickly?"

I should have joined this website BEFORE I had my baby!

[Barb Glare]

H

I think the answer lies in your baby. Her growth rate seems pretty normal. Is she happy and content? You've got to love that long stretch over night.
There are just some general parameters that guide health professionals dealing with babies. They don't apply to all babies - babies haven't read the rule books. When a baby follows a bit of a different path, it's just worth having a close look to make sure all is well. If you then conclude it "aint broke" there's no need to fix it. But most babies do feed according to the ABa information - and on the other side of the coin many mothers feel that their baby is not normal if it feeds 8-12 times per day. It is!
Just as a guide, babies usually lose around 10% of their birthweight in the first days after birth (yours lost less) and then regain their birthweight by 2 weeks, then put on 150-250g therafter for the first 12 weeks. They usually have one longish sleep in 24 hours. And one time of the day when they are grumpy and unsettled and want a cluster of feeds. And otherwise, they are just babies - sometimes they sleep, sometimes they don't, sometimes they cry for no reason, sometimes they don't
Have you considered joining the Australian Breastfeeding Association and getting along to their meetings? It's great to get out and mix with other mums and babies - see that they come in all shapes and sizes and with all temperaments and they are all....normal. And there are always breastfeeding counsellors available to chat over any issues you are having

[coffeegal]

thank you that is reassuring. I think she is happy and content. sure she can scream just like any baby, i think she suffers pains and lots of wind. mostly she is fine and her unsettled/cluster period is btw 6-10pm. When she's screaming it can normally be resolved with a big burp and sometimes burp after burp. Last night she wouldnt stop crying so I kept feeding (maybe growth spurt i fed on the hour!) with lots of burps and she flaked 10pm and then slept til 3.30am back down 4.30 and awake again 7am. Day hours she is happy and content IMO. When she is awake too long then she gets grizzly. So her times of unsettled behaviour I can normally pinpoint to hunger, pain, nappy or tiredness.. If she grizzles strait after a feed I take that to mean she wants more and I put her back on to finish, I dont count this as another feed I just count it as finishing off the other. She doesnt seem to be putting on 150-250g a week though. I have thought of the local meets, I might go next wk esp if I cant get appt with the council LC