"With Choice Comes Responsibility"

[*Ali*]

Society NEEDS each new generation to have learned responsibility and care factor.

This is something that I am passionate about- the younger generation and learning about being responsible for their actions and realising that there are consequences behind their actions. My classroom behaviour management is very much centred around this philosophy ie. you can choose to stop calling out and there will be no problem, however if you continue to choose to call out the consequences will be you will have to go to time out. Or you chose to punch someone because they called you a name, rather than walking away and telling the teacher, and a consequence of this is a detention.

The issue I am becoming more and more aware of is that parents make excuse of their children's behaviour and try and pass the blame off on someone else- "My child only got into that fight because there are not enough teachers on duty and I dont believe in consequences for actions like this" or " yes my child said/ wrote/ called someone a nasty name, but that is only because YOU are unfair/ biased/ racist and I think the consequences recieved are unfair" or " yes I know my child can be off task in class is far behind where they should be for their age, but all my other children aren't very clever and we are much to busy at home to do any extra reading/ spelling/ maths"

These attitudes infuriate me to the ends of the earth, because how are we ever going to teach our children to own their behaviours and be responsible for the consequences of their actions if we go around making excuses for them, rather then using it as a learning point. There comes times in life when we have to let children make mistakes, because sometimes the only way to learn is through dealing with the consequences that comes with the choices they make. And while it is hard to have to watch your children go through tough times, we really are not doing them any favours by always cushioning from consequences or making excuses for their behaviour.

All of this from somebody who has 4 types of cereal in the cupboard because she can never make a choice

[Dollyroux]

I wrote a well thought out response to this earlier this afternoon and the bloody computer ate it. Argh!

Anyhow, I have been thinking on choices/responsibility in relation to Pointing Out That What You Said/did Is Not Okay. So, I have the choice of freedom of speech, so I belive that I have responsibility to point out when people are using that freedom to impinge upon or marganlise others.

IRL this means that when someone makes a sexist joke/comment, I feel I have a responsibility to point out that the comment is not funny and not okay. I struggle with for a few reasons, even though I believe it is the responsible and human thing to do. These include:
a) Feeling/being labelled as a party pooper/downer/nagger (why should this bother me...a whole nother thread!)
b)Trying to do this in a manner that doesn't make the commenter feel overly defensive and opens up a dialogue and not an argument
c) Fear that I may 'wreck' the social event, especially if it is someones elses event, such as a birthday, by making people uncomfortable.

So sometimes I make the choice to let such a comment/action slide. I'm not proud of that choice, and I take responsibility for that, and the consequences it might have. I hope the important bit is that I'm working on changing the choice I make in these types of situations.

As for the choices and responsibilities regarding childbirth. I am still upset about my birth and I understand that I made choices that helped lead towards the birth I had, I'm not ready to take responibility for them...It's still to raw...

[Oorki Galoorki]

"Choice is not always a product of will or desire. Choice is sometimes no more then an escape bid, which means that the place where someone ends up is wrongly regarded as his or hers favoured destination"

i found this in a book recently and it has hit SUCH a cord with me. We often make choices in a hurry with no thought of the consequences and not ready to take responsibility of those choices(even though the choice may be informed) so when the destination isnt what we hoped, thought we realise although one part of the decision making process was informed the other part was not. That part is usually the emotional side, rarely do we not know what the physical 'side effects' are.
So at what point does informed choice change to sole responsibility?

our care providers do have responsibility to us to INFORM us at every point. Product advertisers have a responsibilty to provide us with information yet they all Choose what information to give us.

[Arcadia]

Great thread Bath, and great posts everyone!

OG I totally agree with this sentiment. In fact I would argue most of the time 'choice' is an illusion, or a perception, and hardly the 'freedom' that we often think it is. So often we feel bound to make a decision, because the circumstances are stacked against us...think screaming kids in the supermarket, or wrt birth choices, some of the fear tactics used to induce women.

This plays into what Nelle (and some others) were saying about values being a huge driving force behind the idea of choice. And values change, often frequently. Which in part explains why we feel disappointment about our choices...because the values that informed that decision have now changed. Either through experience or research or really anything.

Responsibility for the choices we make is a tricky one, because, if you see choice as something tied up in a multitude of variables, it is difficult to see how we can take responsibility for all the variables. Especially if you feel forced into something, it is easier to see it was the system, or the old "I had no choice" dilemma.

I don't know. I think there is no much emphasis placed on individual choice and responsibility, and while I think this is fine wrt our feelings and emotions, it is not fine when it comes to products where the 'choice' to buy unethical products for reduced price is given. Why can't all products be made ethically (just an example). Or wrt birthing culture, why don't all women have access to the knowledge that birth is safe most of the time? I would argue having a hospital birth isn't even a choice for many women, its just a given...how can it be one woman's resposibility to 'choose' the birth she wants and take responsibility when the system is stacked against some of the preferences she might make...

Hmm...my head hurts...

[skeetaboat]

WRT birth choices, I agree that it is our own responsibility to set things up for the birth that we want to have, but I also find it very sad that it does take such physical and emotional energy for a woman to set that up, when she herself may be under many physical and emotional drains on her time, energy, finances, etc. I feel sad that support systems, advocacy, community knowledge, and the ability to trust care providers are so lacking in the arena of birth.

[Inanna]

Great posts everyone with really good points. Lots of things have come up for me so this might be a ramble & I might repeat what others have said... Forgive me!

Skeetaboat I also lament that if a woman currently preparing for birth doesn't arm herself with loads of knowledge that she can face problems having a positive birthing experience.

However, a large component (I believe) of the lack of birth choice is the way "we" seem to hand over our care to others. We are not responsible - we give over the hard decisions to others. We defer to the knowledge of others rather than seeking out information for ourselves.

We don't listen to our bodies, learn to be "friends" with our bodies. Our bodies somewhere along the track became a mystery to us - one that can only be solved by "the specialist"... Women cycled with the moon, celebrated their Womanness, felt inside their bodies, listened to the subtle clues. Now, that knowledge has all but died in a great many of us. How do you "feel" isn't as important as what the blood test says or the u/s or the ctg. With all the machines that go beep we have saved some lives no doubt - a wonderful thing. But we have also taken with it the innate knowledge that Women had/have.

We trust in drugs before herbs, support & trust. Of course there is a time for medicalisation - I love science & medicine. But we have to learn when to invite it in.

Someone mentioned we take a lot of time to make decisions like marriage etc. I know for me I didn't really... I listened to my heart - but ignored what my head was screaming! I wonder how many of us did that? I didn't weigh up the character I was truly seeing. I had projected on to him what I thought he could be - what I saw sometimes... I ignored the very distinct character flaws that were very obvious... How many women marry men or have children with men who drink excessively, gamble, take drugs, can't commit to jobs/family/friends, have large debts...

None of the above make one a "bad person"... However surely they should raise alarms. But like in my experience (where I ignored my partners ability to just walk away/lack of commitment/blame of others) we project what we think we see, or what we want to see. It's not real it's projection. So really its our responsibility when we are shown what was there all the time - but without the flowers & sexual excitement of those early days of a romance...

I know that's tough stuff but it's something I have had to face over the last year or so. That my marriage failed because I married someone who showed me who he was - but I chose not to believe it!

Nelle brought up interesting points about choice with purchases - to choose organic free range eggs is respomnsible consumerisim (IMO) yet it may not be responsible to the family... I struggle with this at times also.

Anyway no doubt I will come back and add to this!