Controversial thread : Sex after baby

[Glamourcide]

You guys must have awesome husbands. If mine did all that for me, I'd probably be putting out too! Truth be told, he'll do it - if I can't cope any more. But that's not really a situation condusive to romance (or even throwing a leg over, because romance is far too tiring!) (gee my DH is sounding a bit awful right now... not true! but he's still not getting any!)

Lol Entreat, I have to wonder if such guys actually exist... ha, mine quit with the romantic back rubs about 5 minutes after the POAS came back +ve! I like to think we have a really equal relationship, it's just that our definition of 'equal' would leave some people with mouths gaping... that's okay, they don't need to understand the ins and outs of how we run our lives together because they're not a part of it

Sleep deprivation IS a medical reason. WTF's wrong with putting your own physical requirements (sleep) ahead of your partners sexual ones. an hour of extra sleep, to me, is worth more than the goofy smile he gets on his face post-coitus.

Orrr, from my POV - I can go to bed at midnight, have a quickie and be fast asleep by 12:20... or I can go to bed at midnight and argue for 45 minutes about how I'm really just too tired tonight, babe, can I please just go to sleep and we'll try again tomorrow? And then by the time he gives up, I feel like a cow for dragging it out for so long when I could have just told him, 'Okay, but don't expect fireworks tonight' and had it over with in 15 minutes!
Again, that's just us DH has a habit of treating sex like a sleeping pill anyway so there are nights we DTD even when neither of us is particularly fussed about it - it just helps us both sleep better.

ETA: Hope you get that goofy smile, girl! I actually find that if I don't put up a fuss about it when I'm not into it, DH actually does try to get me off and at least half the time, he's successful... so give it a shot even if he's been a bit of a prat that day and you're generally feeling like there are a thousand things you'd rather be doing - it could just pay off for you both! x

ETA2: And I'm off to take one for the team, ladiieeees I dare all of you who are physically and mentally capable to do the same tonight! Demand satisfaction!

[HotI]

Orrr, from my POV - I can go to bed at midnight, have a quickie and be fast asleep by 12:20... or I can go to bed at midnight and argue for 45 minutes about how I'm really just too tired tonight, babe, can I please just go to sleep and we'll try again tomorrow? And then by the time he gives up, I feel like a cow for dragging it out for so long when I could have just told him, 'Okay, but don't expect fireworks tonight' and had it over with in 15 minutes!

That's a bit sad if they are your only options. Do it or fight your partner off.

[alish]

i know when we were trying to fall pregnant we both had sex even though somedays we didnt really feel like it, i bet most people have done the exact same thing when ttc, so whats the difference after the baby is born?
to me i sometimes look at SOME women and think did you just have sex to have kids or what?
dh and i have always had a healthy sex life, and ive found ive been more sexually aggressive than he has, there is sometimes when im not totally in the mood and vice versa but we still do it, imagine if you said no everytime each one was tired, when would you ever be intimate?
i know so many women that knock back their husbands and really, i wouldnt blame them if they strayed.. sex is so important to stay connected to your partner

great thread!!

p.s i havent had a baby yet but ive been through a couple of things that took me a while to heal

[Yeddi]

... i bet most people have done the exact same thing when ttc, so whats the difference after the baby is born?
to me i sometimes look at SOME women and think did you just have sex to have kids or what?

That's actually a really good point. I would be fairly confident that some women have asked for sex when he didn't really feel like it but they've done it because they "HAD to" in order catch the right time, but then once the bub has come along have not made concessions when they haven't really felt like it? Sounds like a bit of a double standard...

[Just Me]

i know when we were trying to fall pregnant we both had sex even though somedays we didnt really feel like it, i bet most people have done the exact same thing when ttc, so whats the difference after the baby is born?
to me i sometimes look at SOME women and think did you just have sex to have kids or what?

i know so many women that knock back their husbands and really, i wouldnt blame them if they strayed.. sex is so important to stay connected to your partner

great thread!!

p.s i havent had a baby yet but ive been through a couple of things that took me a while to heal

I was scared to DTD after my first baby and it took a while for me to be ready and longer again for things to go back to normal ... healing from a birth can be very different to healing from other kinds of injury. Having people poke and prod you down there and having second, third or fourth degree tears can leave you feeling very vulnerable. Birth shouldn't be like that, but for a lot of women it is and it takes time to recover, not just physically but emotionally and mentally. Even if the physical scars are healed, the memory of pain can still be there too which can cause all kinds of problems.

I don't think that not having sex is an excuse for a partner to stray. Every relationship is obviously different and each couple has to set their own boundaries, but in my relationship, we take each other as we are, where we are at. We are committed to each other as people not just to each other as sexual objects. I don't see sex as a need that absolutely has to be filled ... it is enjoyable certainly, but not essential or a god given right. Many relationships exist without sex because people are connected and committed to their partner's mind, heart, the substance of who they are as a human being, not just their body.

I think it is healthy to encourage a healthy sex life in a relationship - but the definition of healthy is very subjective. What is healthy for one couple could be very different for another couple. Things like life experience, past abuses, children, length of relationship, type of relationship, personal sense of worth, personal happiness, connectedness, general health and wellbeing etc all play a part in what would define healthy for relationship as well as the personality of the each partner.

TTC is a very different story to sex after a baby. I am incredibly stretched after I have a baby - I have a baby and toddlers touching me all day long - and sometimes I just want my personal bubble, my boobs leak at random intervals, physically I feel different about myself, I am physically exhausted from being up all hours of the night and then not able to sleep during the day. My DH is incredibly supportive and I do value our sex life but everyone's priorities are different.

I don't think there is anything wrong with a thread that encourages women to feel empowered to have sex for themselves and make an effort if they will benefit from it emotionally and physically. I do think that it is wrong to say that women should be having sex with their partners because their partners NEED sex or because they might stray or because there is a suggestion of a double standard. I don't think it is right to tell anyone else what they should and shouldn't do in their relationship. Telling women to do something for themselves is very different to instilling fear and guilt and passing judgement. I don't know about anyone else's relationship or situation so it is best to leave these things up to each individual couple to decide for themselves.

I do partly wonder, why does it matter how much sex other people are having? It is not really a social issue with consequences for wider society. I really don't believe that relationships break up because there isn't much sex going on usually it is because of other issues (which in some cases may lead to the lack of sexual activity not vise versa).

I posted a link on another thread about enthusiastic consent ... I reckon it is worth a read - The (Nonexistent) Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad Consequences of Enthusiastic Consent «

[misty]

i know when we were trying to fall pregnant we both had sex even though somedays we didnt really feel like it, i bet most people have done the exact same thing when ttc, so whats the difference after the baby is born?

The difference is the sheer exhaustion. The complete fatigue. The huge emotional shift. The pain. The memory of pain. The support (or lack thereof) from your partner through all this.

dh and i have always had a healthy sex life, and ive found ive been more sexually aggressive than he has, there is sometimes when im not totally in the mood and vice versa but we still do it, imagine if you said no everytime each one was tired, when would you ever be intimate?

Being 'tired' and being completely and untter exhausted are too very different experiences IMO. Generally, if someone is just 'tired' but still interested in sex, then sex wins. The problems arise when the interest level isn't there, and then 'tired' becomes the 'excuse' not nessecarily the reality - they may actually be feeling unloved, unsupported, uncared for, angry, scared, hurt or any other range of emotions. Exhaustion on the other hand is real. And I know that I am often so exhausted when I get to bed time, that I fall alseep as soon as my head hits the pillow or I have just burst into tears at absolutely nothing.

i know so many women that knock back their husbands and really, i wouldnt blame them if they strayed..

Completely disagree. NOTHING justifies cheating. All the excuses in the world (no matter how valid they may be) excuses being unfaithful to your spouse and betraying their trust like that. If there is no sex is a marriage, I think it is generally the final straw, it is certainly an indication that the marriage has bigger problems then just sex.

sex is so important to stay connected to your partner

I would suggest that is not the case, rather 'staying connected to your partner is so important to maintain sex'.

I have been with my DH for 12.5 yrs, living together for 10yrs, married for 6yrs. In my experience, if your relationship cannot survive for periods of time without sex, it will not survive. All relationships have their sexual peaks and troughs. Of course if it is lacking from your marriage you should try to address the issue (or more likely underlying 'issues'), but if sex it the thing to break a relationship 'in and of itself' then that was a pretty crappy relationship to start with.

[alish]

i know youre all tired, im not saying youre not, do you not think youre husbands are tired after they get home after a massive day at work? then they are expected to play with the kids etc etc, its the same thing! they work just as hard too and get in trouble when they just want to sit down and have a beer and relax for 5 after work!

how can you sit there and say your partner gives you no support? if he didnt want a child, he would have participated in getting you pregnant! he works all day to bring you and your child money home so you can all survive, how is that not support? just because he dosent make a fuss over how youre feeling? most men arent programmed that way.

no one in this thread is taking away the fact that having a baby is hard on a woman physically and mentally and that looking after the child isnt hard work, i just think that SOME women need to think about their partner also, who said anywhere about having sex a day after the baby was born? everyone knows it takes people different amounts of time to heal, i know after my ectopic & losing another one i couldnt have sex for 2 months, and thats not my fault! my dh knew that, that didnt mean he went without though, i did things for him. whats the harm in it?

dont get on the defense immediatly like youre being attacked, everyone is allowed to have a point of view, this thread is controversial, dont get so upset about it, no offense to anyone, but if youre going to attack someone about their comments, maybe you shouldnt have taken part in this thread.

misty - just because i havent had a child, you think i havent been "utterley exhausted" (as you put it) after what ive been through?
everyone can be so tired that they can burst into tears or fall asleep as soon as their head hits the pillow, i still found the time to be intimate with my husband, even if i was emotional or "exhausted".

motherhood is a wonderful thing and i cannot wait to go through it for myself, the good things and the bad, i just know that I PERSONALLY will find the time to still be intimate with my dh, because i love him and without him i wouldnt have the beautiful life growing inside me that i do.

[mummydreamer]

I have been with my DH for 12.5 yrs, living together for 10yrs, married for 6yrs. In my experience, if your relationship cannot survive for periods of time without sex, it will not survive. All relationships have their sexual peaks and troughs. Of course if it is lacking from your marriage you should try to address the issue (or more likely underlying 'issues'), but if sex it the thing to break a relationship 'in and of itself' then that was a pretty crappy relationship to start with.

that's a really good point. right now i guess you could say we're going through a 'trough' but we're still very much in love and very supportive of each other. yes sex is very important for a relationship i think, but i also think the relationship has to be strong without it as well.

[Freya]

i know when we were trying to fall pregnant we both had sex even though somedays we didnt really feel like it, i bet most people have done the exact same thing when ttc, so whats the difference after the baby is born?
to me i sometimes look at SOME women and think did you just have sex to have kids or what?
dh and i have always had a healthy sex life, and ive found ive been more sexually aggressive than he has, there is sometimes when im not totally in the mood and vice versa but we still do it, imagine if you said no everytime each one was tired, when would you ever be intimate?
i know so many women that knock back their husbands and really, i wouldnt blame them if they strayed.. sex is so important to stay connected to your partner

great thread!!

p.s i havent had a baby yet but ive been through a couple of things that took me a while to heal

I will be very interested to see your revised reply 6mths after you've had your baby. The tone of your post and your viewpoints make it quite obvious you dont realise the full extent of being a stay at home mother with a child (or two or four or six) every single day, year after year. But thats lack of experience. Sure, my husband works 5 days a week from 6:30-4:30. Unlike alot of other men my Dh's job is our LIFE, we never leave it at the door, it dictates everything we do. Ive had to birth babies and go through all kinds of hell without any support but Dh, and he's been pretty crap at it. But he will be the first to tell you MY job looking after the kids 24/7, and studying, and working two nights a week, and dealing with military life, is INFINITELY harder than anything he'll ever have to do. He's realised that now, esp after I give him a good dose of my reality by going away for a long weekend. By the time I get back he is champing at the bit to go back to that tiring work he does. And as for exhaustion; motherhood exhaustion is an entirely different breed to non-motherhood exhaustion. Ive been beyond tired too, pre kids, but I can tell you the one difference thats made it endurable - I could sleep whenever I wanted. I could sleep in, sleep 12 hours uninterupted overnight, have a nap. Im lucky to get 3hrs of decent sleep a night and have done for the last 5 years. I dont get to nap because my 4yo doesnt nap anymore. So essentially my brain is working 21hrs of 24hrs in a day. Humans arent meant to run like that. The only job I can think of that compares to that is someone working in a hospital/emergency services, but even then there are workplace regulations that enforce only a certain amount of hours being worked before rest must be taken. Not so with mothers.

And I think allowing an unhappy sex life to be an excuse to cheat is just a cop out for being a loser. If sex is the only reason you stray then your an idiot. Why? Because if sex if the only reason your unhappy then your relationship and life mustnt be that bad to start with. Well apart from the obvious selfishness of the person cheating.

The ONE thing my Dh will admit to is that if his only problem with our marriage is the discrepancy in what our idea's of 'enough sex' is, then our relationship must be better than we realise. He would NEVER cheat. Ever. Not even because of the not enough sex thing. And Ive told him many a time to feel free to do it if he's that hard done by. If ruining a marriage is worth it for something as unimportant as sex in the overall picture of things; then I am better rid of him. He's never gone anywhere!

[alish]

my husband would never cheat either, but ive seen what a sexless marriage is like with my friends and family. and i know whats happened.

when did i ever say in any of my posts that i wouldnt have a hard time coping etc when i have a baby? i know i will, and you know what? i look forward to everything that motherhood throws at me.

when was i ever attacking anyone? im allowed to have a point of view, its your choice if you choose to get offended, obviously ive hit a nerve, and im NOT apologising for having an opinion!

my husband works those exact same hours as well so i too will be on my own!!

motherhood isnt a 24/7 job, its a PRIVLEDGE!!!! some people dont get that blessing in their life!

[Yeddi]

*Putting target on back...*

I understand that some women don't feel like having sex with their partners after having a baby, but I think you should own that. I can see some very obvious ego-centric views here, where what sex means is weighed and judged by what they think and this is meant to be the measure by which everyone should judge it, including their partners. Sex to some people (generally men) makes them feel loved and appreciated, why is this any less valid than you feeling loved and appreciated by him doing things around the house or helping with the kids? So, you'll only show love and appreciation if he does first. When did showing each other you care become a tit for tat? I would think in a successful relationship BOTH would need to successfully communicate their affection and appreciation in a way the other needs them to, and you can't dictate what methods a person needs to feel that way, even if you think it is silly or in the scheme of things unimportant.

Freya - I think it is a little presumptuous to suggest alish will revise her reply in 6 months time just because YOU would have. She may very well not have decreased sex after baby, particularly when she thinks along the lines she does. I know for me, the amount of sex my DH and I have has increased since having children (which includes a 6yo child with ASD/SPD with all her appointments, a 6 month old who is on the go crawling, and studying full time) but having been in the military myself and having to do things like be awake for 72 hours straight I have a very different definition of exhaustion - I have a sex battery like some people have a desert stomach. Everyone is different!

[Fleur]

Coming back to this thread after so many replies, I can't address all those I want to individually.

I never took the OP, or the point of this thread, to be about women who have reasons - I was going to say, valid reasons, but really any reasons - for not wanting sex beyond the 'I can't be bothered'.

Freya, I'm really sorry that you feel this way, I know there have been some posts that might have been more senistive - but most of us I think get the difference between certain situations, and reasons for differing sex drives. What you are saying doesn't make you selfish, or unappreciative or anything else - hell, I'm one of those 'can't be bothered' women and I'm not going to label myself selfish or unappreciative!

I got 'orders' last night - be in bed on time or else (all a bit tongue in cheek of course) - it had been too long, and it was really only that I have been working late at home, doing crafty bits & pieces, generally going to bed too late. Not that I was avoiding sex, but I certainly wasn't putting in the effort to get to bed on time.
That is what I took the OP to be, that sometimes if there's no real reason other than it's a bit of an effort, then it might be worth making the effort. That's all.

I agree with BG, I find our intimacy in other areas definitely increases when we are having (or have recently had) sex; DH in particular seems to be more affectionate. I don't know why, I think maybe it switches on for him, it's all connected. I know one of the reasons he 'needs' regular (or semi-regular) sex is that for him it is all about intimacy, it's how he gets his needs for love & affection met.

Orgasm; I don't know... maybe it would make a difference but I don't think so. I think it's more about how your mind works. DH rarely lets me go without O'ing, so I can be pretty certain it's going to happen for me but it doesn't do much to increase my libido. I think - for me anyway - libido is about head space, I need to be relaxed & most importantly, switched off from everythign else to get in the mood. He seems to be able to switch on like a light. I wish I could!

As for the comments about infidelity - I'm not even going there, suffice to say, I hope that anyone who has been there doesn't read that & feel like it's 'your fault'.

And Rory, rofl at the mad rabbit on heat, that gave me a visual that made me laugh

[HotI]

again Freya, I didn't mean for this to be an attack on women who don't want to have sex due to extremely understandable and valid reasons. no-one should have sex or feel they have to put out to keep their man "satisfied".

i think that is the issue- who gets to decide what is an understandable and valid reason? I believe it is the woman.

[Fleur]

i think that is the issue- who gets to decide what is an understandable and valid reason? I believe it is the woman.

I agree - it's one of those things that no-one can know unless you have been her ... there is so much tied up in such an intimate thing it is impossible to fully know how someone is feeling unless you are them.
And a lot of times, I would guess that a woman herself might not fully understand why it is that way. I went through a period a few years ago where rather than just being lazy about sex, I was actively avoiding it, and it took a long time to even start to work out why & to resolve it.

[Smoke Jaguar]

Would be more helpful to remain emotionally mature, I reckon. The majority of posts in here have been considered, heartfelt and empathic. Let's keep it that way (BB-wide!).
I think, in summary, I am questioning the "can't be bothered" assumption here, and saying that even if someone says they can't be bothered to make the effort, I would suggest there are other things going on to create that scenario; that if she "can't be bothered", there is probably some kind of support she's lacking and needing. Because, given the right level of support, most women I know WOULD be up for some sexiness, if other factors weren't taking away from the energy that would otherwise go into feeling sensual and sexual again.
I just don't think it's as simple as "can't be bothered", unless the woman has a pathology of emotional abuse (and even then, it's not just CBB, it's about feeling a need for power and control for another whole host of possible reasons!) towards her fella. It's a throwaway line that should serve as the canary in the relationship!

[misty]

Freya - you took the words out of my mouth.

Alish - I am sincerely interested to hear back from you on this topic after you have children. It doesn't make your opinion any less valid now, but I do wonder just how much this opinion will change later on down the track, if at all.

The sheeer exhaustion I am talking about, I really don't think you have experienced it. There is a reason they use sleep deprivation as a toture technique in the army. Not everyone reaches this stage - but alot of people do, with the introduction of a child or children into their lives. It is an ongoing experience, something that can go on for weeks and months on end. There have been times I have had to pull over while driving, because my eyes won't stay open, no matter how much I force them, but there is very little in the way of sleep for the entire month, because at least one of the kids is awake and needs help / comfort every hour of every day and night. I had been exhausted occaisionally before having kids, but there is NOTHING that could have prepared me for the reality of having a non sleeper, a sickly child, and constant feeder and not enough helpers. I might add that my DH is a FANTASTIC support and will get up to look after the kids at night rather then me, once they are no longer breastfed. Even my DH at times has been too exhausted to have sex. Both of us have fallen asleep mid way at least once.

no one in this thread is taking away the fact that having a baby is hard on a woman physically and mentally and that looking after the child isnt hard work, i just think that SOME women need to think about their partner also, who said anywhere about having sex a day after the baby was born? everyone knows it takes people different amounts of time to heal, i know after my ectopic & losing another one i couldnt have sex for 2 months, and thats not my fault! my dh knew that, that didnt mean he went without though, i did things for him. whats the harm in it?

This was exactly one of my points. And in a strong relationship, if you have an understanding partner, then going for lengths of time without sex is not going to harm a relationship. But in my experience, if it is not a purely physical reason not to have sex, then there is another deeper emotional / mental reason. And it is the underlying reason, not the sex itself why a marriage fails.

I will add for the record, that at this particular point in time the only thing that interrupts and restricts my personal sex life is my morning sickness - but that we are still managing to have a 'reasonable' amount (although I KNOW my DH thinks it's not enough, but hell even when we are DTD every day of the month he has complained because I don't happen to want it when he does). But life happens, sometimes your sex life is great, sometimes it's not - but when its not, it is rarely just about sex, their is always some other reason why it's not happening.

how can you sit there and say your partner gives you no support? if he didnt want a child, he would have participated in getting you pregnant! he works all day to bring you and your child money home so you can all survive, how is that not support? just because he dosent make a fuss over how youre feeling? most men arent programmed that way.

You have no idea about an individuals relationship. I am lucky. MY DH is the MOST supportive man I have ever met. I have FABULOUS support. But I have friends who are military wives, they have no support for 9mths at a time, when their partners have disappeared for their work. And often when their partners are back they are no support because they don't have any experience or even desire in some cases, with how to 'help out'. I have a SIL who's husband is so dissengaged from her life and their childrens lives - they share a bed and have sex, but that is the extent of their time and communication together. She only remains their because she feels trapped, she doesn't know how to leave and it has been this way for so long it is 'normal'.

[mummajj]

Alish, if you feel like you're sex life is going to continue the same after you've had a baby, then make sure it happens.

dont let anyone tell you how you're going to react after having a baby, just because thier experiences have been different.

i know this is a "controversial" thread, but why attack someone for having a positive view about sex after baby. you dont need to have sex to stay intimate with your partner. there are other ways to please each other. Understandably,women need to wait a bit longer, but why should men wait to be satisfied when they havent had anything happen to them. or is it a case of "if i'm not getting any,neither are you"...

and as for exhaustion, for me, i havent felt that yet. sure iv been really tired, and iv accepted that im not going to have a solid 8 hr sleep for a while, but thats being a mum, so its ok. ask me in a few yrs, after a few more kids and i might have a different point of view though. lol.

[PollyA]

I just want to throw one more idea into the debate.
I had some very sore bits after my first and worried that I would, in fact, never be able to have enjoyable penetrative sex again. The result,some tears, some honest discussion realising that my DH loved me no matter what and 6 months or so of exploring our intimacy which exponetially improved our sex life. Now is retrospect I am, in most, ways glad for the whole experience which allowed such a wonderful new dimension to exist in our relationship.
I would have had similar feelings on the matter as Alish pre baby which may be one of the reasons we made lemonade with our lemons so to speak.