Does happy mum REALLY equal happy baby?

[paradise lost]

I am still loving this thread!

Maya when i read your words that all mummies were not created equal it got me to thinking. I actually know several women who by dint of their personalities really really don't/aren't going to enjoy being SAHP's. It's not a failing, it's not a value judement, it's just that unless they change a great deal (which they might, what else changes us like our kids do?!) the things that my days revolve would make them completely mental and very quickly miserable. Sushee your posts have made me realise what a sacrifice it actually WAS for you to be a SAHP for the early years, and also how much more of a contribution to a happy world you're making by balancing your life in the way you need to. And how lucky i am that i DON'T have that dichotomy, that it's NOT a hard choice for me to make. I'm glad that i naturally felt as strongly as i did when i was leaving XP, and i see now how many hard decisions it has saved me facing.

I also have several confessions to make which are relevant because they're the bits of me i sweep aside most of the time (not in a martyry way, but in a factual way, i'll expand in a second...). I occasionally do freelance work for a few friends. Do i love it? YES! Would i want to give up being a SAHP and do it in a full-time or even more fully part-time way? No. Not yet. It isn't stimulating, not like the tasks i set myself are, but it is externally driven, rewarded work and having just a little of it in my life is the sauce which flavours the meal i have made myself as a SAHP. Also though i LOVE having DD and doing as i do with her, i will admit i am really looking forward to having another baby. One kid just ISN'T a full-time job. I have before now cared for friends kids and when you have 3 there's no struggling to find free time because you just know you can't get any - i am for some reason absolutely rubbish at giving up theoretical free-time and perfectly wonderful at accepting there genuinely ISN'T any to be had, does that make sense? So i feel i would be happier if i had a little more freelance work (which i hope to have soon) and another baby (ditto ). But at the moment i see it like i see my height - i'd like to be 5cm shorter, but i can't be and that's that. I'm not a martyr to my height or my lifestyle and i certainly don't feel i'm UNhappy, even if i am aware of things that might enhance my life.

Snacks - you didn't offend me at all! The thing about my BFing journey is that at the time i beat the crap out of myself because BF mattered SO SO much to me, and in retrospect it's hard to offend me over (accidentally especially!) because i did what i could and it is what it is. In some ways it was a lesson i needed to learn, kwim? DD WAS a brilliant feeder from birth and aside from a bit of high BP i had a perfect pregnancy and birth, got it all the way i wanted it. I really needed to be tripped up to learn a bit of compassion. Before it happened to me when a woman said or posted "I had to stop BF" i used to think "no, you CHOSE to stop BF or you didn't learn enough about BF" and now i have LIVED that it is not so easy to judge without knowing the precise circumstances. So now when a woman says that and expresses sadness and asks for advice i will actually ask the pertinent questions - how old was bubs (it is almost ALWAYS the 6-week growth spurt which leads women to doubt their supply, supp with FF and actually lose their milk), how was mums health (moderate to excessive bloodloss at birth and post-partum thyroiditis are both medical reasons which are often glossed over but which can both make establishing and maintaining supply very difficult) and so on and so on. My own trip-and-fall on the road of mama-ing has left me far more sympathetic to the scrapes and brusies of others and who wouldn't want that!? I have been a bit of a perfectionist all my life. I love nothing more than being the best and making it look easy and unfortunately (for my personal development) it can mainly come easily to me. But not with parenting. With parenting i have been taught that my best sometimes ISN'T good enough and sometimes not-good-enough just needs to be enough anyway. That was a really hard one for me!

So back to HB=HM and vice-versa... I think it is a platitude. And like any platitude it can be harmful, harmless or helpful, depending on the woman and the circumstance. In a situation like mine, when a woman is NOT happy and is told re: her circumatance or decision which she is unhappy about "HM=HB" it is dangerous - she might then stop talking about how she really feels, because admitting she is unhappy will be like admitting her baby must be too. She might "give up" striving to be the mum she wanted to be if she is made to feel that her idea of not-good-enough is all she is capable of. She might lose confidence as a mother in her abilities and feelings. In my situation (when i had to stop BF) it made me feel like i wasn't being heard. I used to read it and think "But aren't you listening!? I'm NOT HAPPY!" However, in a situation like, i don't know, say with my SAHMing but being poor - if someone said it WRT that, i wasn't offended or cheered. Even though my life wasn't perfect, i was still pretty happy with it. So a platitude just slid off - at the most i might have thought "wasn't that nice, they took the time to see how i am doing". I haven't lived it, and nor am i that kind of person, but i can imagine that for some women the decision they have made IS MADE and someone validating it for them might give them some feeling of confidence back.

So for me, i suppose this thread has made me think that in any situation where a mum is making a decision or facing a dilemma that makes people use the HM=HB platitude, i'm going to try to look to the heart of the WOMAN, not just the basic situation, and rather than give the platitude (which i don't think i have...but i might have, i don't know!) i'm going to try to help her TRULY rationalise what is happening so that she can be sure of her decision and move forward with it with confidence in her heart and not defeat.

Bx

[LoveKnowsNoBounds]

I am truly baffled when I come on here sometimes. How can someone say I don't believe in the phrase happy mum = happy babies when you are all on the internet on BB obviously seeking to share your ideas on the net and to have an outlet away from your baby? Whether it is work, socialising, BB, we all have different outlets that make us happy. It is a flippant phrase and it is true to a certain extent. If a mother is truly miserable the baby will suffer. Some things bother some mums more than others, it a balancing act and I am sure alot of marriages suffer if a mother becomes a martyr and puts herself last all of the time. Where will it lead to? At the end of the day the family needs to be happy as a unit and however that happens is up to them.

[BeautifulMadness]

i think a happy mummy means a happy baby. they pick up on you're feelings. my son knows when im upset and he gives me a hug, and when im a crappy mood so he is.
But i also think its case of a happy baby means a happy mummy.
no ones happy unless baby is lol

But i also think mums need to put them selves first sometimes. The world doesn't revolve around my son.


Thinking about it, when im sad my son makes me smile and when he is sad i make him smile.

so i guess we balance each other out

[sunshine_sieben]

Sweetpeajan, I think you misunderstood our point a little bit. Of course, if mummy is truly unhappy, baby is not gonna be all that happy either. But just because mummy is happy, doesn't necessarily make the baby happy. Some people believe things make them happy that are very destructive. Like drinking (huge amounts, not the occasional drink) or even taking illicit drugs. That definitely won't make baby happy.
And of course, if mum always comes last (or never), it's not going to work out all that well. Being a martyr is never a good thing. Even though it might make you happy at the time (because you believe you're doing the right thing). Just because some of us mention that baby's needs come first, that doesn't mean mum's needs are completely irrelevant. It is all about balance.
My needs often come last. But that doesn't mean they're not met. Like for example, in the evening, I would like to sit down with DH and have a conversation. Or watch something on TV. But DD needs to be fed and put to bed. So, I feed her, put her to bed, then sit down with DH. So, my need or want came after DD's, but it was met.
Yes, in some cases it is an either or situation. And there we need to prioritise what is more important. Like when mum needs a medical treatment that will require her to wean. Well, if it is important, then baby's need for BM comes after mum's need for health (and to be honest, baby will benefit from a healthy mum). If mum doesn't want to BF because she believes it will make her boobs saggy, then maybe (and I said maybe, because some cases of body image issues are severe) baby's nutritional needs are more important.

Saša

[Smoke Jaguar]

That's how I see it, Sasa

[Neenee Jellybeanie]

I am truly baffled when I come on here sometimes. How can someone say I don't believe in the phrase happy mum = happy babies when you are all on the internet on BB obviously seeking to share your ideas on the net and to have an outlet away from your baby? Whether it is work, socialising, BB, we all have different outlets that make us happy. It is a flippant phrase and it is true to a certain extent. If a mother is truly miserable the baby will suffer. Some things bother some mums more than others, it a balancing act and I am sure alot of marriages suffer if a mother becomes a martyr and puts herself last all of the time. Where will it lead to? At the end of the day the family needs to be happy as a unit and however that happens is up to them.

Did you read the whole thread? I think what you're saying has been addressed quite extensively in the other pages.

[Ca Plane Pour Moi]

I think we've actually come to a consensus here - only posters don't read far enough in to see that consensus!

Can we add a post in, right before the first one, to say something like:

The current vein of the thread is as follows:
Mothers should be happy: not martyrs, but not ignoring the needs of their child. If the mother knows she is doing the best possible thing for her children in her situation and she is at peace with this, it is the best thing.

"Happy Mother = happy baby" is a statement too often used to just fob someone off without really listening to her problem or wanting to help, despite asking about it in the first place.

Does that seem about right?

[Neenee Jellybeanie]

I think that's right. It might be a bit too controvercial to say that 'HM = HB shouldn't be used as an excuse to ignore the needs of a child' and/or 'Mothers shouldn't feel the need to justify their decisions with HM = HB in the first place' though I think those conclusions were also reached.