IVF sceptic? Looking to hear from others with similar experiences.
Dear all,
Here is a overview of where things stand for my wife and I and given this is a post on a topic I haven?t seen before on this forum, I hope that it?s allowed and can be responded to by other members who have experienced multiple failed OR successful IVF procedures; the outcome is irrelevant.
My question is unusual and I would ask only people respond to it who agree with my proposition because they have experienced similar treatment I?m about to describe. I think it is pointless to be responded to from people who have been happy with what they?ve received from their IVF providers.
If you were, good luck, it doesn?t necessarily mean that your doctor was any good; it could just means you were happy with them.
So, here we go ?..
My wife has undertaken 4 stimulated cycles; 2 each at 2 large Melbourne clinics. My question is unrelated to whether we?ve been successful or not, it?s completely to do with how these businesses have treated us as individuals regarding:
i. standards of communication
ii. as patients in terms of medical protocols she?s been subjected to
iii. the demeanour and mindset of the staff.
I stress the word ?business? as I contend that this is what they primarily are ? businesses, with their key concern being to increase earnings for shareholders and if you think I?m wrong, look at the acquisitions of IVF clinics in the last 5 years. They are being bought by utterly unrelated, non-medical businesses for the simple reason that they consistently post excellent returns and their annual growth is impressive.
I have very often read forum postings here from women where a they basically say: ?I love my doctor, they are really nice?. Or they are ?Cool but professional? or ?They have a picture of their kids on their desk?.
I think these observations are pointless, whether the doctor is really nice or not is utterly irrelevant and in fact I believe that the ?nicer? they are can act as dangerous diversion from my main contention which is this.
Ask yourself ??.
At any time, during any of your procedures, did your doctor state the anything like the following in plain, unequivocal English?
? ?You are here because you can not have a child.
? There IS a reason/s why this not happening. Not ?Luck of the draw? or ?Some women have difficulties? but an absolute, tangible, biological reason you can not have a baby.
? Therefore, as your doctor, my promise to you is that I will find out what this reason/s is, tell you what the treatments are and then we will together, follow the steps that I believe are best suited to correcting this problem in your particular case.
? And when I find the reason and I will, and if it is not able to be corrected, I will tell you that too.
For readers of this post, whether you gave birth after your first treatment or are still at it on your tenth, ask yourself: Has your doctor ever told you anything even vaguely resembling this?
Or have they instead been completely incurious regarding the crucial starting point of infertility, which is ?Why??
Why can?t you have a child?
If someone can?t even identify the problem, then if you have a baby after repeated procedures, it is attributable to one thing only.
And that?s luck.
Consider; your car has broken down. You take it to the mechanic and you say it?s not working and naturally the first thing you want is to know why. Is it the clutch? Is it the electrics?
?Mr Mechanic, it was running yesterday and now it is not. The first thing I want to know is why it does not work and after we know that, then we can fix the problem?.
Naturally you haven?t heard anything other than: ?Of course, I will find the fault first?. No-one hears otherwise, it just doesn?t happen.
Imagine however his response is:
?No, this garage doesn?t do analysis; we do not recognise it as a principle. What we do is put a new alternator in your vehicle and if that does not work, we will then keep putting another 6 new alternators in.
And only then and if you kick and scream will we put in a new starter motor and see if that works. We will not analyse the cause of the problem, not tell you what it is, not fix it or tell you if it can not be fixed, we will just do the same thing over and over and it may one day run again. Maybe?.
No car repairer would ever say this, no plumber, absolutely no-one we deal with on a practical level where there is something that is not working, would ever say this.
But in my experience, IVF doctors do.
So, here?s my contention:
In Australia, IVF doctors and their highly lucrative practices are fuelled by 2 things; a huge level of taxpayer funding and desperation on the part of infertile couples.
I suggest that these doctors are on a massive personal wealth gravy-train that is effectively incapable of derailment from funding cutbacks and their behaviour basically immune from public or government scrutiny as they have the twin excuses of: ?This field is too scientific for the layman to comprehend?.
And: ?How dare anyone question our methods, every woman has the right to be a mother?.
Quite simply, I believe that many IVF specialists are running little more than a scam that Bernie Madoff would be proud of.
If you don?t know who he is, look up his name on the net, he?s the greatest Ponzi scam creator in history who took the best and brightest for US$60B. Currently he is into month 4 of a 150 year sentence only because one person said:
?This man?s business is endemically rotten? ?? and it was.
So that?s my opinion based solely on what I?ve experienced and researched; that a very significant proportion of the IVF sector in this country that is endemically rotten, is motivated disproportionally by greed, is protected from scrutiny via the threat that the science is beyond the layman, is fuelled by taxpayer largesse and is underpinned by infertile couples desire to have children.
If airlines were run in the same outrageous and deplorable manner that we as a couple have experienced, 2 in 3 planes would crash, as these are broadly the ?success rates? that IVF clinics achieve. And the IVF clinics don?t even have to state why their figures are so woeful.
Only: ?It didn?t work for you?.
To conclude, what I would like to read are comments from those who have suffered similarly to us, the key reason I believe begins with the fundamental point that their doctor never asked which is: ?Why? Why can?t you have a baby??
If that is not asked at the very start, then the problem can not be solved and what they do instead is ?Throw spaghetti at the wall?, as they know that enough of it will stick, an approach that is outrageous, immoral and also tantamount to taxpayer fraud.
They send women back and back for more and more procedures, knowing that for some of them it will work and that?s where they get their statistics from, the statistical third which will give birth to a child.
But for the rest, it?s ?We?ll bleed them financially until they?re tapped out, their relationship fails or they just give up and go away and then it?s ?. Next patient please?.
I?d like to read others views that have experienced this callous and unprofessional treatment and also if it?s permitted by the forum?s administrators, I?d like to be Private Messaged to meet others in Melbourne who have suffered from this behaviour, to hear their perspectives.
And if anyone thinks I?m ?crazy?, consider this, if the population of United States is 15 times larger that Australia which it is, how is it that Australia has 10 times, I repeat, 10 times, the number of IVF procedures carried out each year?
And please, don?t tell me that it?s just the price difference.
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