Polscope with ICSI in Perth

[NAT025]

Hi All
I was curious to know if anyone has used Polscope while doing ICSI and has noticed their fertilisation rates are better? And if anyone has had this done in Perth. I am currently at Hollywood Fertility Clinic and they have never mentioned this procedure to me before. I will query them with this tomorrow

[butterfly_warrior]

Hi Nat. We have used polscope, but are in Sydney.

Brief run down of our experiences... first cycle, 26 eggs collected which resulted in 4 blastocyst embryos being frozen. I had OHSS so we were unable to have a fresh transfer. They noticed that we had a lot of fragmentation issues, so polscope was suggested if we had to go again. I got two transfers from those four embryos which resulted in two pregnancies and two miscarriages. The other two embryos failed to thaw.

Our second cycle produced 32 eggs and resulted in 7 blastocyst embryos being frozen. Once again I had OHSS so there was no fresh transfer. The scientists found that two thirds of my spindles were in the wrong spot, and we got much less fragmentation with the polscoped embryos. Again, we got two transfers, one pregnancy, one miscarriage, one BFN. Five embryos failed to thaw.

The stats don't look great, but our FS thinks that it's mainly down to the hyperstimulation (I have severe PCOS) and our dodgy, mutant sperm. We're just starting on our third stim cycle, with me doing everything I possibly can (mainly watching my diet) to avoid OHSS this time. The FS has taken a different approach with my puregon dosage and is introducing an anti-OHSS drug as soon as they start. He also has DH on vitamin C and folate and has given him instructions regarding daily ejaculations when I start stim injections to ensure that we not only get the best possible eggs, but also have the best possible sperm.

From what I've been told, polscope is mainly indicated when ICSI results in fragmentation during embryo growth.

BW

[NAT025]

WOW 32 eggs and 7 Blasts thats fantastic. I battle to get one Blast!
I hope this cycle is the one for you!! I will be chatting with my embryologist when they phone with my Day 3 results to talk about this. I just dont understand if they can't find anything really wrong with me or DH why are they dropping off

[butterfly_warrior]

I'm told the drop off from day 3 to blast is normal. First cycle we went from 12 to 4, second cycle we went from 18 to 7 - all in that day 3 to blast step. My FS is big on blast culture - in his words Not all embryos are capable of becoming a baby, growing them to blastocyst is the first step towards filtering out the bad ones. If they don't make it to blast, they were never going to get you pregnant. That said, he still does some day 2/3 transfers in women who don't get many embryos at all.

He also says that freezing them and thawing them is another step in filtering out the bad ones. He told me that all embryos that failed to thaw turned out to be defective when they checked them. I haven't found a reference for this study, but I'd like to think my FS is telling me the truth!

Good luck with everything, Nat. We may have had 7 blasts, but they turned out to be fairly crappy blasts! I'm pretty much at the point where I'm going to see this cycle as a success if I can just get to have a fresh transfer - regardless of what may happen after that.

BW

[Mon]

Hi Nat, I know how dissapointing it is when you get low numbers of embies. On both my cycles I only ended up with 1 to transfer and none to freeze. My first cycle I had 25 eggs, 14 fertilised and after 2 days they were all fragmented except one. BFN. Third Cycle (as second was cancelled prior to EPU due to OHSS risk) produced 11 eggs, 10 fertilised and again only one made it - this time to blastycyst. When we went to our FS on Monday asked whether it was due to dodgy eggs or sperm and he said it wasnt that, that it just happens. Of course its not the answer I want to hear and I wonder if there is anything else to improve the outcome.
Its great that BW's FS focuses on the improving health in conjunction with IVF. The more you move forward the more you learn if anything.
Nat not sure if your doing ICSI because of male factor infertility, but I have been reading that if there is damage to DNA structure of sperm that procedures like IVF/ICSI wont necessarily overcome this problem and means that although embryo's fertilise they dont have the genetic information to grow beyond blastocyst. I didnt challenge my FS about this and will next time to see what they think, but I am guessing seeing IVF is all such a business they probably wouldnt admit that would they. I mean if they can get you to blasty then they have done their job. But I am really dissapointed that we never end up with more than one embie per cycle and none to freeze to give my body a break.
I was also reading that in regards to treating male infertility, we are ten years behind treating female infertility. Great!!!
Anyway best of luck, I will also make sure to ask about Polscope!
Mon

[NAT025]

thanks Mon. I am frustrated as all of us are who are going through this journey, but I feel like there are no answers. My DH has had a SCSA test to show fragmented sperm and that came back normal. My DH trys to tell me its a numbers game with us and it might take us longer but we will get there. I really hope all that are experiencing some sort of infertility overcome this and beat it!!
I am definetly going to be asking about Polscope. Good Luck Everyone