Federal Budget tonight....

**AnyDream** · May 14th, 2014, 08:43 AM

I'm confused, are there still GPs who bulk bill? I've had to pay $70 every time I go to the GP for a long time - I wish it was only $7! Unless you hold a HCC or other concession card you pay $70 and claim back your medicare rebate - so it still ends up costing $35 or more.

Yes, this. But apparently there are loads of bulk billing doctors around the place, and some of them are located in relatively wealthy areas too. The vast majority of consultations (numerically) are bulk billed. Often doctors charge everyone but bulk bill people with concession cards & for children. But people with concession cards (ie, elderly and those with disabilities & chronic health conditions and disabilities) are massive users of the medical system, so these people will be hit the hardest.

There was a quote in there by Joe Hockey about people needing to "take responsibility" for their health. As someone who has been through the cancer wringer, I wish I knew what kind of ****ing responsibility I needed to take to prevent all of the doctors visits involved in that.

**AnyDream** · May 14th, 2014, 08:47 AM

Also I think alot of the media focus on broken promises - misses the point a bit. Really we should want a government to do what is right for the time irrelevant of what they have promised in the past (I don't think this government has done the right thing).

Without having read any of the budget document, it doesn't come across as having much of an evidence base.

**RainbowRiver** · May 14th, 2014, 09:10 AM

Gp I go to bulk bills kids and hcc holders. Everyone else is $68.50, they do your Medicare refund on the spot though, so no need to head into an office to claim it.

I find the script fees a bit wrong. $5 extra for everyone, but hcc only get 80c tacked onto their medicines.

They're the only 2 issues I understand. The rest are to over my head to grasp

**~TT40~** · May 14th, 2014, 09:20 AM

Our gp doesnt bulk bill, so cost 70. Except does bulk children. So does that mean i now have to pay 77? Or just 7? And what does.it mean with rebate? Im confused (not thaat its hard to do)

**wysiwyg** · May 14th, 2014, 09:41 AM

Without having read any of the budget document, it doesn't come across as having much of an evidence base.

Yes that is what I mean, I wish I was seeing more stuff on FB feeds, media etc. about the lack of evidence behind it rather than the broken promise angle.

Because if it was based on evidence and good policy and not short term focused it wouldn't bother me what promises had been broken. I don't know the broken promise angle seems to buy into the 'buying votes' which doesn't encourage looking at the whole picture.

I have always been mega confused by bulk billing, where we go it doesn't bulk bill in general, so we pay and get the half back, or more if hit safety net, but occasionally we wouldn't have to pay for a kids appointment and I never really worked it out. Currently I can live with that as don't have to go that often so can afford it. Lots of friends go to other doctors who bulk bill, even for things like routine vaccinations which you can get done free at the council and round here are offered at a massive variety of times and locations. I always wondered why bulk billing wasn't done based on some measure - seems a bit wrong that now the people who really need it will have to pay instead of tightening up on who can bulk bill - but maybe it isn't that easy?

**Cass72** · May 14th, 2014, 09:42 AM

We will be affected by the universal things such as the GP payment and petrol prices etc. We have never been entitled to FTB or any other payments except the Child Care Rebate so no changes for us. I was very worried they would means test the CCR and we would lose that. Thank goodness they didn't!

This was my greatest fear too! Paying $480 per fortnight is so much more managable than $960. We don't (and never have) received FTB payments.

The Uni HELP fees do not affect existing students and DS1 will be finished his degree in 2017 in any case.

Yes, the petrol and medical will be a pain, but all in all, our family seems to have gotten off lightly.

**Rouge** · May 14th, 2014, 09:46 AM

(Off topic - related to bulk billing)

People who can't afford gp's use hospitals. That's why bulk billing super clinics were started to take the burden off public hospitals. I can guarantee you if people can't afford $70 they will go to the hospital. And if people can't afford $7 they will too.

Our statewide locam service bulk bills too. I stopped going to our local non bulk billing GP when the head doctor kept upping the fees to cover the "long time patients" he bulk billed. And it sickened me a little that he had a new luxury car every few months. And he expected everyone to charge full fee for script renewals. I do believe some centres exploit the system. As do other medical services like private testing centres. If there was more fee regulation and less of a gap I wouldn't have a problem.

**wysiwyg** · May 14th, 2014, 10:02 AM

We will be affected by the universal things such as the GP payment and petrol prices etc. We have never been entitled to FTB or any other payments except the Child Care Rebate so no changes for us. I was very worried they would means test the CCR and we would lose that. Thank goodness they didn't!

If they had done that would have really made no sense, I don't think was ever on the cards. The current situation currently makes working more than 3 days a week if you are both middle income earners (say 70 000) not financially beneficial. If they removed the CCR or means tested it, it would be a massive disincentive to working and that wouldn't be in line with other policies, which seem to want to increase the workforce. The fact the CCR is not increasing in line with childcare costs is enough of a problem.

I haven't seen anything about CCB so assume that it is staying the same but frozen?

**AnyDream** · May 14th, 2014, 10:14 AM

(Off topic - related to bulk billing)

People who can't afford gp's use hospitals. That's why bulk billing super clinics were started to take the burden off public hospitals. I can guarantee you if people can't afford $70 they will go to the hospital. And if people can't afford $7 they will too.

They built one of those super clinics in our area - except they couldn't get any doctors to staff it. So now there's a dentist & a physio etc there and no bulk billing and no late night service. And the emergency room at the hospital is just as full as it always has been. My point: there are structural problems that are not going to be fixed by copayments.

**TeniBear** · May 14th, 2014, 10:24 AM

On bulk billing again - I've been astounded at the amount of people I've seen saying similar to ausgirl, that they have to pay when they see a doctor anyway. Every doctor I've been to in my entire life, aside from some private specialists, has bulk billed. Maybe it's a location thing? I've only lived in the suburbs... To me, paying anything is strange.

Swaying back to the topic - perhaps for non-bulk-billed places, the $7 is on top of the usual fee?

**AnyDream** · May 14th, 2014, 10:29 AM

I'm fully in the burbs, have *never* been routinely bulk billed. Ever. And we have lived in 5 different states. So I'm astounded to hear that it's even possible to pay nothing ever.

**Khaleesi** · May 14th, 2014, 10:30 AM

I saw somewhere people who pay to see a GP already will be charged an extra $5 on top of their normal fees.
So $75 instead of $70.....

I've never had to pay to see a Dr either..

**RainbowRiver** · May 14th, 2014, 10:33 AM

Aren't they also going to charge you to use the hospitals (as opposed to your gp or super clinic) for non essential visits? Or is that just a rumour I've heard making the rounds?!

I think the $7 thing is, fee + $7 on top, and for bulk billed places it's just $7

**Amaunet** · May 14th, 2014, 10:35 AM

I read somewhere (SMH?) that people who go to emergency when they are sick and could/should have gone to a GP (ie not an emergency) will be billed the $7 as well.

**wysiwyg** · May 14th, 2014, 10:58 AM

I have always paid since arriving in Australia - is about $35 out of pocket for normal hours appointments more like $55 for out of hours. In England was free, but could wait ages to get an appointment, so I just thought it was ok seeing as here I could pay but get to see a doctor when I needed one (My budgeting software tells me that the past year that equates to $375 on GP visits for the family - so just over a dollar a day). I would rather pay like this when I can afford it knowing that it would be free if I couldn't.

This is why have thought that some of the initiatives to reduce doctors visits are a good idea compared to paying - e.g. I can get a referral for my endocrinologist for $20 - instead of having to waste mine and GP appointment just to get the note - I can do it online for $20 which saves me $15 and medicare $35. Getting a doctors note from a pharmacist for $20 is also a good idea in my book (only having to have two days off work to require a sick note is ridiculous in my opinion - is a waste of time and money - it should be a 5 working days - 2 days encourages people to go to the doctors when a doctor is not required). If you miss a swimming lesson where DD goes, you need to get a doctors note to get a replacement class, I always thought that was ridiculous, paying $35 to get a note for a replacement class worth $14, now I understand that people can go bulk bill - it makes more sense (although I think is a silly system - encouraging people to waste doctors time to get a note saying yes the child has a cold etc so can miss swimming class).

**briggsy's girl** · May 14th, 2014, 11:22 AM

My employer allows us five days of "undocumented" personal or carers leave all year. After that it is deemed unauthorised leave and becomes leave without pay. And can impact job security. I have no choice but to go to the doctor if myself or dd are sick as I need medical/carers certificates. I hate wasting everyone's time when I have flu or gastro, for which I know there is no treatment but rest and fluids (not to mention the risk of infecting others!) but I have no choice! It's not a case of two or more consecutive days require certificates. It's pretty much every absence. Five absences without evidence sounds like a bit of leeway, but when i have a small child and they are ill with gastro, and i KNOW I sit very near someone who is quite immunocompromised, I adhere to doctors quarantine suggestions, so it takes very little for is to have a need to see a doctor for a certificate.

I am reluctant to believe that pharmacists issuing evidence certificates won't be abided. I know doctors certificates are already abused, but I think pharmacists will be further abused....

No comment on the rest of the budget stuff given I have a migraine and haven't read. Just wanted to comments in the certificate situation

**Lenny** · May 14th, 2014, 12:02 PM

I'm fully in the burbs, have *never* been routinely bulk billed. Ever. And we have lived in 5 different states. So I'm astounded to hear that it's even possible to pay nothing ever.

I'm fully in the burbs too, and there is no clinic around here that bulk bills. I would have to drive a long way and even then, they only bulk bill children.

**Olive** · May 14th, 2014, 12:10 PM

We have lots around my area, they're always hard to get into.
I don't use them often as my normal GP most times bulk bills the kids and quiet often DH and I as well, they choose who they bulk bill.

With FTB do they automatically both cut off once youngest is 6???