Gina Ford Contented Baby book

[mandy_kye]

Howdy gals and guys
just thought I would start a thread on anyones thoughts on this book.
Anyone followed it?
Anyone hate/love it?
I personally have read it and in four weeks going to give it a try on my second child.
I just tried the website for extra info and couldn't believe membership was 50pounds! Nothing else really on website unless you joined!
Three cheers for bellybelly for having both non-member and member info!

Anyway, love your views on this

[BellyBelly]

It's not a book I would recommend but I would definitely recommend these which do not require membership costs, do not interfere with breastfeeding and the authors are not childless nannies (who most sleep experts seem to be, conveniently unattached hormonally!):

Science of Parenting by Margot Sunderland (covers sleep, tantrums - the whole lot great investment)
Sleeping Like a Baby by Pinky McKay
Helping Your Baby to Sleep by Anni Gethin

[MantaRay]

I have a friend who followed it to the letter and swears by it. But it isn't for me. I found it easier to adjust the boys routines to their cues - ie put them to sleep when they are tired. It takes a little while for a new mum to know the cues and get used to the routine the baby leads you into themselves, but after a few weeks it is so easy. And then it is easy to fit in going out around sleeps etc, although babies will often sleep everywhere anyway. If I followed Gina Ford, I would never have gotten out of the house. ALso it would never have worked for baby 2 as it just wouldn't have fit in with the toddler's routines. That's just me though, as I say, I have a friend who had success, so we are all different.

[Bathsheba]

I bought this book before I discovered BB. The only reason I am glad that I have read it is to know exactly what people are talking about when referring to this type of parenting.

It would appeal to mothers who are used to a high degree of control in their lives and/or a fear of ambiguity. Maybe I used to be this way but I've certainly done a 180 degree turnabout since discovering BB (but that's not to say my way is right for everyone). Just my opinion though, I'm sure like Melanie said, some women swear by her methods. To me a lot of it appeals to my head but not my heart.

[AndiE]

Hi guys,
Just to add my two cents ... I have two friends who followed the book and absolutely swear by it. Both really do have happy, contented little babies. One of these friends had quite a traumatic birth (emergency C-section under a general), and several weeks after bringing her baby home she was feeling rested and relaxed ... she put it down the routines in the book which provided her with reasonable rest time.
I'm now reading it. I agree its routine sounds strict, but I'm definitely leaning toward giving it a go based on the fact my two friends thoroughly recommended it.
Certainly sounds like the author has polarised opinions though. Would be interested to hear further thoughts on the author's methods. I guess at the end of the day, we all have our own thoughts/ideas on how we want to raise our bubs ... and it doesn't mean any of us is right or wrong. That's what makes this web site so interesting!
Andie

[Bathsheba]

How do your friends go with incorporating BFing into the routine Andie?

[~Saram~]

I read this book along with a swathe of others in my quest for my own contented little baby :-) I did take some info from it but never went into the whole regimented routines. i think this book like every other book should be used to help you gather what works for you. I would be interested to know if those who did find the book useful if they followed it to the minute or if they were a little more accomodating.

[AndiE]

Hi Bathsheba,
I've been off line for a few days, but in response to your question, both friends breastfed their bubs without any problem, and using the routines as their guide. They both also supplemented with a bottle feed (expressed breast milk) as per the routines in the book too. Not sure if that tells you what you were wanting to know ... ?

[Bathsheba]

Hi Andie I just found that it was hard to not BF overnight... we also co-sleep from about 3am during which time I give at least 2/3 brief feeds before we get up at 7am. Especially in the early days I found that I couldn't sleep all night without feeding as I would get uncomfortably full and leak. I certainly didn't want to be expressing in the wee hours either. Anyhow I just found that Gina didn't really work for us overnight as she doesn't believe in co sleeping or feeding on demand. I've since heard that small breasted women (like me) need to feed more frequently than large breasted women so trying to tell all women to BF at set times isn't going to work.

It's great that your friends had success, don't get me wrong, but I personally found her routines too limiting for successful BFing.

[AndiE]

Hi Bathsheba,
Bottom line for me is that each mum has to do what's best for her and her bub. Yep, it's great the book worked well for my mates ... and I still think I'm going to give it a go and see what happens ... but it doesn't mean the book is going to suit every mum ... and neither does it have to.
Ahhh - for all I know I'll throw the book against the wall within the first week or two!!
: )
Have a good one, Andie

[mum2ollie]

Hi ladies, I'm new to this site, and only because I came accross this thread and felt I had to reply. I can speak from experience about this book and absolutely swear by it. I used it to raise my son who is now nearly 15mths old. The book reads scarier than it actually is and to be honest in the early days life with a new baby is chaos regardless of what book you do or dont follow. I BF for 11 and a half months and expressed one feed a day to let daddy have a turn. BF'ing wasn't impacted by the routine at all. The feeding was guided by the routine and worked very well. I have several friends who followed Gina's routines and have all had success. The key is to follow the advice strictly in the beginning and then you can relax a bit with it once the routine is established. I didnt find i was bound to the house but rather felt the routine gave me more freedom to manage my day and provide quality time for my husband and I while my baby got a good nights sleep. We highly recommend this book, it really has helped us to raise a contented little baby and we will be using it again with our next baby without hesitation.

[cikina]

Well I have read the book and tried the routine, but it have never worked for me as my baby never lasted the given times between feeds. She would be crying her heart out and I could tell she is screaming for food, so how could I not give it to her? Unfortunatelly this problem was not addressed in Gina's book, hence I couldn't follow her routines :-(

[Bathsheba]

Don't feel like a failure Cikina Many women I know would feel exactly the same if they had tried to follow those (I think) impractical routines in Gina's book. I think at the end of the day someone really needs to have HAD a baby themselves to understand the reality behind life with a baby. For example: which exhausted mum with next to no support other than from her equally exhausted husband would ever wake a sleeping baby to conform to a routine??? Has Gina ever experienced the kind of sheer exahustion that comes after being pregnant for 9 months and having to care for a newborn while still in recovery and getting used to the physical demands of breast feeding??? No, she has not. Her routines also do not seem to factor in caring for other children as well... often several others.... it makes the assumption that you only have to deal with this ONE child's needs. Like I said, I have read this book and I don't believe she ever mentioned the possibility of having to weave her routines into those of other children.

I know there are members in this thread who seem to have sucess with Gina's routine but I also feel that this book has probably done as much harm as good... I am sure Cikina is not the only mum that has felt even more inadequate as a result of trying to adhere to the (I think) impractical routines of this book. There is just no comfort for the mum in the pages of Gina's book... when you compare the book to say that of Pinky McKay where the mum is encouraged to nuture herself as well as her baby (caring for a carer is of vital importance). Stern matronly dictatorship writing is really dated i think... I think Gina could do well to develop a bit of compassion. I think there is no place for being firm with a baby... it implies that a baby has the ability to be "naughty" and "inconsiderate" which is obviously crazy. And worst of all it erodes TRUST. Yes babies often like a bit of predictability... but one thing they like to be able to predict is that mum will try to give them what they need... I just don't see Gina as being child-focussed... she is blatantly parent focussed and I basically feel that is selfish. Very few adults would be happy imposing such rigid routines on themselves so why is it ok to impose them on a baby? What on earth is wrong with being a little flexible?

This has turned into a bit of a rant. However I am not attacking anyones choice for giving Gina's routines go... I am questioning the philosophy of the book... not the members here... like I said, I too have bought this book and have formed an opinion which is as humble as anyone elses. I would also like to remind members that like it or not BellyBelly is a Gentle parenting forum... and perhaps if you are seeking more support for implementing Gina's routines then maybe you are more likely to find it at another forum.

[AndiE]

Cikina - I second Bathsheba's comments ... don't feel like a failure because the book's routines didn't "work" for you and your baby. The routines will suit some people, but certainly won't suit others. You absolutely have to do what is best for you and your bub - regardless of any book or advice from others.

Bath - I reckon it's horses for courses in terms of the book and its routines. Yes, they are rigid, and as I said above - that will suit some people to a T. But hopefully anyone who gives it a try and finds it doesn't work for them, throws the routines away and adapts to what their baby needs. To me, that's just common sense. You've made fair points, but admittedly I didn't get the impression that Ford thought babies needed to be treated with a firm hand. I guess I'm thinking of that horrid Truvy approach, or whatever it was, from that 'Bringing up Baby' series recently on the ABC. Now THAT was a shocking routine!

Despite my original intentions to use Ford's routines with DS, I found I really didn't need to. Fortunately, from the time DS was born, he quickly decided he'd like to be fed approx every 3-4 hours, and he slept easily day and night. Truth be told, I was blessed with any easygoing, adaptable child who determined his own little routine. In hindsight, I doubt I could have stuck to Ford's routine as rigidly as I was supposed to, and the routines don't really account for anything "out of the ordinary" happening.

I still think Ford makes some very valid points in her book - such as getting your baby used to going to sleep in its cot from the get-go; having block-out curtains so that baby's room is dark during the day; expressing so dad can give baby one feed a day, and probably the best tip of all - the longer you can (realistically and gently) get your bub to stay awake during the day, the more likely they are to sleep at night. At least, that worked for us - and I didn't have to torture DS to keep him awake and amused for an extra few minutes during the day (I'm thinking of that Truvy method again!)

At the end of the day - all mums (and dads) have to do what's right for their bubs and them. Ford's book has worked a treat for several easy-going, terrific parents I know ... equally it hasn't suited others, and they've thrown the book and its routines out the window and concentrated on raising a content child their way.

Andie

[newmumofone]

Hi Guys,

First post for me, I don't think I have ever posted on the net, but this forum hooked me in and I am compelled to give my opinion. Gina Ford is the way to go! I bought her book after my sister was given it by a successful friend. My sister started it at 6 weeks (when given it). She had immediate success and has a 5 month old contented little baby. I read it whilst pregnant and was sooooo glad I came across it. Her tireless info was all news to me, and without it i would have stumbled in the dark (in more ways then one).
As well as the routines she describes, all her other info on colic, breastfeeding, sleep associations, use of cots, colic, sleep cycles etc is invaluable. I cannot stress how much i have loved reading her info.

Now onto the routines...what a God send. I mean that, I am so thankful for this book. First of all, she doesn't start babies on a routine, except to say that newborns need to feed every three hours or less, 24 hours a day. This is exactly what the nurses say too. This is followed until baby makes the required weight gain and other health needs. My little one had a little jaundice, so if i hadn't woken her every 3 hours she would have slept and slept and become very dehydrated. I have no issue waking a sleeping baby for a feed, the other option is her waking hungry, crying for a feed - why would I want her to cry for food? The routines anticipate her feeding needs, hence a contented little baby! I can happily say my 1 month old has never cried for a feed, and is putting on perfect weight.

For me the other benefit of Ford's routines is due to my epilepsy which is triggered by exhaustion and dehydration. On Ford's routines I know exactaly when to get sleep, how much, and with the best length of time between feeds. Demand feeding lasting between 1.5 and 4 hours with no ability to predict the next feed would have me in hospital in a day! Considering how well Ford explains to mothers how to hydrate and eat well whilst breastfeeding, I have had no problems keeping hydrated either.

Incidentally, my sister said after 6 weeks of demand feeding the CLB routines were a life saver! In reply to previous posts....the book does not require a 50pound subscription, simply buy the $20 book. The website has direct contact with Ford's 'team' who offer advice which is what the subscription is for. Next, Ford being childless is as big an issue as my male Gyno never having given birth to a baby! I trusted him implicitly! Ford has spent 30 years living in with babies. I would hate to imply that parents who adopt don't know the stresses and emotions of parenthood having not given birth or experienced hormones! For the mum who had trouble with the routines due to a hungry baby, I would respectfully suggest one of the possibilities Ford suggests of low milk supply? Something she also addresses. With regards to not getting out of the house, on the contrary, I know to the minute when I can plan my outings! Regarding the comment that Ford?s advice interferes with breastfeeding, my experience is the opposite, she establishes breastfeeding and ensures that as baby can digest before the next feed (as opposed to on demand), colic doesn?t occur.

I agree that Ford's writing style can be clinical, however her advice isn't designed to be about all the wonderful developmental info about babies, like when they smile etc which makes baby reading nice. However, i find following the CLB that I am able to enjoy those wonderful moments as I have very little stress about all the other parts of parenthood. There are hundreds of other books and material to fill in those gaps.

The gaps I would suggest I missed, is info about how from two weeks babies require more soothing. I found this transition from week 2 to 3 quite pronounced and was a little lost for a day or so. We ended up going with a dummy and 10 mins or so of holding before bed which has worked no problem. Ari is quite a sucky baby, so the dummy is good, although it has not been a problem for her waking mid sleep cycle, she puts herself back to sleep, it just helps her wind down. I have called the Maternal Health line a couple of times too, they are fantastic for help and support on any topic. I have found they have affirmed what we are doing as best for baby every time.

So if you are still reading this far down (!) I guess I would wrap up with saying that I am happily and successfully following CLB, passed on from my sister, passed on from her friend and I?m not sure how far back the chain of recommendations goes ? my guess is it?s far. I will be buying a copy for my pregnant best friend and anyone else I can.

At the very least read it and take her info from other topics if you aren?t interested in the routines. If you?re unsure of routines, I would say try them and see how you go. I would be surprised to hear from people who tried it, (and applied her problem solving strategies if needed eg. increasing milk supply etc) and didn?t find it the least bit helpful even as a framework/guideline for feeding and sleeping. I have no qualms about her credentials ? the proof is in the pudding. (Incidentally, I am posting at 4am as my little one is now sleeping from 11pm till 5am and later, but I still wake up! With CLB, husband does the 10.30pm feed, so I can go to sleep from 7pm if needed!)

Good luck!

[fionas]

I didn't read it and TBH, after leaving the hospital with a strict routine recommended to me because of BF problems (attach every 3 hours, then express, then feed EBM which often took up to 2.5 hours leaving me with 30 mins before the next BF attempt) AND with instructions from the physio to ice my pelvis every 3 hours, do exercises twice at day etc. etc. I could NOT have handled any more clock-watching.

But I am finding the different perspectives very interesting.

I guess what I liked about NOT having a strict routine (after we got over the first couple of weeks and could feed on demand) is that it tuned me into DD's needs. I found it quite easy to predict when she needed and would sleep based on her physical signs. By contrast, I found that some friends who were following a routine would not pay attention to their baby's signs and try to put a baby to bed who just wasn't tired and then get frustrated when they didn't sleep. Then they got panicky if the baby didn't sleep when they were "supposed" to as that meant the routine for the rest of the day was out of whack.

So I guess I'm interested in how the sleep thing works and I'm interested in hearing from people who found that it did work.

As others have said, it does sound very appealing in theory but I'm not sure it would have worked for me.

[Bathsheba]

Thanks Starfish Yes, I was referring to the doctors well behaved children. It just resonated with me that a key focus of my upbringing was to be well behaved at all times. Children could have fun but it was still very much "seen but not heard and speak only when spoken to". It was all very adult initiated. This us why I personally do not like parenting books that advocate adult initiated caring. Yes you may eat now, yes you may play now, may sleep and may touch me. There seems to be very little child initiated aspects to routines in the CLBB and each to their own but I think if it was it would be more respectful if it did.

Newmum: I told of MY experience. ETA: and on re-reading your post you do actually sound like my mother when you call my post "silly". I had a very challenging childhood and it hurts to hear people be so dismissive about it. I hope you are more compassionate toward your child.

[MummaSue]

I really appreciate everyone's thoughts on this, truly.

I have actually worked with kids with mental health difficulties for a number of years so do realise that a well behaved child isn't necessarily a happy one. I like kids to have some feistiness about them - they are little people after all with personalities that need to be developed and encouraged and I love to see kids being a bit naughty and testing the boundaries - they need to make sure the boundaries are still there after all!!

I guess I was more scared by the fact that the routines did not ever suggest leaving the house - there was no room for weekends, outings, etc - I will not be staying in the house for the next year, I can tell you that!!
I will be taking some of the advice though, I do think that she makes some very good points about certain things. I will be adapting her routines to my bubby and what works for us.

Thank you so much for everyone's diverse thoughts - it is very interesting to hear what others thing.
Sue x