Pitbulls

**nothing2lose** · August 20th, 2011, 08:31 PM

Lashes, why did the council have your dog put down...??

**~Lashes~** · August 20th, 2011, 08:32 PM

What are the four restricted dogs? Just curious

japanese toza, dogo argentino, APBT, and ahh... shoot, will have to google the 4th.

Pitbull are only restricted, there are strict guidelines for them to be owned in the country, the other ones are outright banned, you will not find one in the country.

**~ Mylitta ~** · August 20th, 2011, 08:58 PM

There's five restricted breeds now. The three mentioned above by Lashes, as well as Fila Brasileiro (Brazilian fighting dog) and Perro de Presa Canario.

Only the Pitbull and Perro de Presa Canario are known in Australia, although I've heard that there are also some breeders claiming to breed Dogo Argentino and Fila Brasileiro in Australia, but I either doubt it's true, or they have been so crossbred that you can't even call them that anymore.

Funny story, we had someone ring the clinic to book in a vaccination for their Japanese Toza puppy. We couldn't understand how they had one in Australia, but got out all this literature about restricted breeds so they knew what they needed to do. Client then walks in the door for his appointment carrying a...... Pomeranian! LOL!! Obviously had no idea about dog breeds.

**Boo Boo** · August 20th, 2011, 09:10 PM

I have no idea why that statement would scare the bejeebers out of anyone. We have the cutest photos of my dog and my son curled up together asleep, my son using our dog as a pillow. Our dog loves the close human contact and the kids love it too. As long as the parents are there and the dog is not upset then I don't see the problem.

The problem is though, even if the parents are there, once a pitball gets it's teeth onto someone/something not even an adult can get it to release.

There is a reason pitballs are a restricted breed, that pretty much says it all doesn't it people? ...no matter how cute, how tame, how loving they are, how you think they would never harm a fly, there is a reason they are restricted, someone didn't just come up with the idea out of the blue, yeah, hey, lets make pitballs a restricted breed. As soon you realised your dog was a pitball and it had been advertised incorrectly the owner should have been reported.

And as for comparing, cats to pitballs, seriously wtf????

And to all the posters who have said to keep the dog would you be saying that if Reet lived next door to you and your kids?

**Ginger** · August 20th, 2011, 09:16 PM

i totally agree with you Boo Boo

Reet- forgive me if i've missed you answering this, but i'm still wondering if your dog is registered with your local council?

**Tinks** · August 20th, 2011, 09:18 PM

And to all the posters who have said to keep the dog would you be saying that if Reet lived next door to you and your kids?

Honestly, I wouldn't have a problem with it as long as the owner followed all the rules that come with owning a restricted breed.

**Jellybean29** · August 20th, 2011, 09:33 PM

Also, when I was a kid we got a puppy (well technically she was my sisters puppy), collie X something... Just saw a sign Puppies 4 Sale when we were driving home from swimming school. Anyway. We had her about 3 years and she was part of the family, sweet natured etc etc. One day my best friend went to feed her when no one else was with her, some of her sandwich or something, and the dog went for her and bit her. My parents put the dog down the next day.

I'm just saying, it can happen to the nicest dog, but I guess more likely with Pitbulls and they do more damage. My friend only got a little warning 'nip' but a Pitbull probably would of been a different story...

**~clover~** · August 20th, 2011, 09:38 PM

Again, pit bulls are not the only breed with a lock jaw.

Am I right that their jaw relaxes when they do? So a persons natural reaction during an attack would be to freak. But, (if possible) if a person remained calm & calmed a dog, would they let go?

& if their jaw is locked, i was also under the impression they wouldn't be able to release it to bite again?

I've seen an attack by a cattle dog on a child. She was lucky, the owner dragged the dog away, he wasn't stopping.

I will not have my kids around their dog (different dog, that one distroyed), because they allow their dogs to think they are above visitors.

I have always had bigger breeds. Staffy's, mastiffs etc. Every one of them has been raised with myself & my kids able to take food from their mouths & they don't blink an eye.

I will still never, ever completely trust a dog. Any dog, but I have seen the effects of a dog not being raised the right way.

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**Jellybean29** · August 20th, 2011, 10:13 PM

Some good info on restricted breeds and regulations in Aus...

Dangerous Dogs and Restricted Breeds - Melbourne

**YoYo** · August 20th, 2011, 10:13 PM

I actually think that the worst thing about this whole situation is the fact that the people bred them and then lied about their breed.

I am a registered breeder of old englishes, through dogswest, and although I haven't bred any yet, I had to go through tests to be registered. My sister is also a breeder of weimaraners. She recently had her first litter of puppies (well her dog had the puppies!!) and she considered everything. She would not have bred if her 'b*tch' had an issue with temperament, which some weims can have.

Reet is not where this went wrong.... It's the people that bred the dog in the first place.

I do truly believe that pitbulls are a classed the way they are for a reason, and that you'd have to be extra careful. I know I'd be careful if I was walking down the road with my dog, and my two kids if I crossed the path with a pitbull, and I would really hope that the person on the other end of the lead is in full control. As I would be of my large hairy dog! But if something were to happen I'd protect my kids, I'd let my dog go, and I can tell you now, that to a pitbull I'm sure he'd come off second best..... Which makes me feel sick just thinking about. Hell, my dog got attacked by a little terrier one day walking up the road.... Totally unprovoked.

If you think about German shepherds working with police, they are trained, with men with big fat padded things on their arms. The dog is trained to do the same thing but to a criminal....attack them. Difference is, the police have first trained it to let go when they say so.

To teach a pitbull to let go when commanded, you'd be having to teach them to hold onto something first. Your regular Joe who owns one wouldn't dare teach them that in the first place iykwim, so how could you teach them to let go?

Reet I know I love my dog like nothing else, and I'm sure you do too. You sound to me as though you're doing the best you can, and I'll say again this must be a hard situation to be in.

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- Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - I wonder what the kids are up to....Better go!

**Jellybean29** · August 20th, 2011, 10:45 PM

Reet i'm glad your pup is getting desexed next week

Under QLD regulations restricted dogs need to be desexed within 3months of the dog turning 6 months.

I also think it might be good for you to read through and bookmark the QLD legislation, so you know you rights and whats expected of you as a responsible dog owner of a restricted breed, there are high penalties for not complying http://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/LE...imalManA08.pdf

best of luck!

**2CheekyMonkeys** · August 20th, 2011, 10:52 PM

i only read up to page 6 but i just want to make these points.. and i am going to be quick cause it is late.
you may love your dog now... but by keeping him you are taking a risk and to me... (and this is gonna sound bad) you are putting your dog before your child.
imagine what it would be like if something did happen to your baby or someone elses baby. imagine the guilt you would feel! i shudder just thinking about it.
have you ever seen just a normal dog fight? it is scary.. imagine instead of two dogs its one dog and your baby!
and even with supervision an adult will find it extremely difficult to remove the attacking dog from the child it is mauling. so supervision is not going to solve anything.
i also have an issue with riding your baby on his back and laying your baby on him. i dont know why, but that just makes me feel anxious and uneasy.
i understand that you love your dog, have invested time with him, spent money on him, but there is a heirarchy and surely your dog is at the bottom! if it were me, i would get rid of him. (probably wouldnt have got him in the first place and would have reported the breeders).

do your mothers group friends realise he is a pitbull? cause if i knew that i am sorry to say i wouldnt be visiting with my children. i would consider it, if he was locked away but even then i would be nervous!

sorry if i have caused any offense, i didnt mean to. just my opinion.

**christy** · August 20th, 2011, 11:56 PM

I guess the thing is when you study animal behaviour and dog behaviour (I did for 3+years and ran puppy schools for over 10 years), you learn that 1/3 of dog behaviour is genetics and 1/3 is what happens in the first 6 weeks, the last 1/3 is the environment they are living in. Pit bulls have been bred over years and years to be fighting dogs, not house dogs. With that history, there is a large majority of them which have been brought up in homes which have 2/3 of their behaviour being totally out of the control of the owners, add to that the people who tend to be attracted to fighting dogs and you have a very dangerous combination on your hands.

Having said that, after working with dogs for over 10 years, I would say ALL dogs have the ability to bite. I learnt from a dog trainer once that ALL DOGS BITE. Its very true. I've seen dogs that you couldn't think would possibly bite, attack. Even labradors... I think that everyone needs to be conscious of this fact. Its up to you and me, as to what you decide your children are safe with. There is no way on earth you could expect a neighbours dog to come into your house and attack your children. Its unexpected, and even if I knew that I had a pit bull next door, it isn't something I would expect.

I have a labrador and a rescue dog who was abused before. Have I left my children alone with them, yes. Will I continue to do so? No. BUT I have had both my dogs behaviour tested and I myself have tested them. Now that my oldest dog is 13, I will not be letting my children alone with her, she is old and going senile and I just can't trust that what I've known for the past 12 years will continue.

I can't say how many dogs I have had to help put to sleep due to aggression towards children. Every different breed and every different sort of family... i've seen the scars on the families and comforted the tears... its a tragedy EVERYTIME. Its not the dogs fault, they are bred one way, we treat them another....

I refuse to be the one to encourage one way or another, but I just want everyone to understand that the issue is so much deeper than the 1/3 of behaviour which is breed. Would I personally own a pitbull? No, but I wouldn't judge one who does....

**Reet** · August 20th, 2011, 11:58 PM

Thanks again for all ur comments and feedback.

Theres just a few things that have stood out that I need to comment on...
The first one is Hollo asking if all the ppl that come over to our house know that hes a pitbull. This is exactly what frustrates me! Like someone said a few posts back.. this is exactly like dog racism! Ofcourse we tell the ppl that come over what he is.. we WANT them to know what he is so they can see what an absolutely beautiful breed they can be! Everyone that meets him can tell straight away that he doesnt have a single bad bone in him. We have taken him to meet all our neighbours and there dogs and we will continue to do so regularly.

The second thing i wanted to bring up is the fact that when a post says somewhere in it 'u have to get rid of it.. or.. just get rid of it' or something along those lines, I can tell those ppl dont really understand at all! This is a dog! He is a HE! Not an IT!! He was our baby along with our other ridgeback girl before we actually had our DD! Ofcourse i can see them for what they.. dogs.. but they have both given us so much happiness.. and i know they will continue to do so! We have always put boundaries on him, our dogs were allowed inside occasionally before DD was born for snuggles before bed but now they are complete outside dogs! Mainly so I dont have to clean the dog hair off the floor everyday though! We actually thought the transition from occasionally inside to always outside wld upset them a bit but it hasnt at all. My dh built them a lovely big timber house for them out on our deck which they absolutely love now. We also thought there cld be a bit of jealousy from them when we brought DD home since we used to spend so much time with them, but nope none at all whatsoever. They pretty much ignore her unless Yogi boy tries to sneak a lick of her slobbery hands or a sniff of her freshly pooed nappy!

Ausgirl- I dont really understand why u had to question why i posted this thread?? Obviously u think its pointless?? Next u will be calling me a troll cos u think im just attention seeking or something! I thought the reason was quite clear, I was asking for ppls opinions whether they think its the owner or just the dog that makes it aggressive and also i wanted suggestions from ppl about things i cld also do to try and make sure he stays the lovely happy boy he is. If i had asked whether we shld get rid of him or not then yes this wld be a very pointless thread because that has never crossed my mind at all. We bought him because we loved him. If something changes, even if it is something simple like growling at us for taking his bone off him, then yes we will definitely be considering our options!

Anyway, I have organised to meet up with the ppl we bought Yogi off tomoro down at the local creek with a few other friends and their dogs.. the mans wife had a baby girl the same day as me so i have seen her at the community centre occasionally. I am going to have a chat to the man and find out what exactly they have done in regards to registering their dogs. Oh and by the way, Yogis mum is now desexed, so no more babies

Ive gotta go to bed now, but I know there were quite a few other posts that I loved and wanted to comment on, Ill have to do it tomorrow though, way too tired now!

xx

**Reet** · August 21st, 2011, 12:00 AM

Oh and i just want to add that at the vet next week I will be asking about a dog behaviourist. I wld love some proper training!

**caixin** · August 21st, 2011, 12:11 AM

Reet this is such a hard decision to make as I can tell that your doggie is very much part of the family. If you decide to keep your dog I think you need to bring him for proper dog training so you can command control over him any time you need to. That means going to training regularly. At homeI think it is very important to teach the kids how to respect the dogs and their space. In my opinion kids riding on the dog's back is not exactly play you might want to encourage. You want let your dog know that the kids are superior to him not play mates coz when dogs play they can be so rough and tend to play bite. Not something you want with your kids. Definitely get him desexed as soon as possible as it will help with his temperament to a certain extent. If you are really worried about him biting someone when you are it even though he seems to be very sociable, you can get a basket muzzle for him when you go out. Strangers are then more likely to approach him slowly and gently. Hope you finda decision that you are comfortable with.