VBAC / EBAC Discussion

[BellyBelly]

According to the Birthrites website, the risk for uterine rupture in a VBAC is extremely low. They state, "The likelihood of uterine rupture with attempted VBAC is 0.5%. (0.2% uterine rupture, 1.1% asymptomatic dehiscence from case control studies). The risk of hysterectomy and perinatal death from uterine rupture are 0.05% and 0.07% respectively in hospitals equipped to provide rapid laparotomy. (Australian VBAC study) Major uterine rupture, before or during labour, after a classical Caesarean section is 5%." Don't forget to check out the Birthrites website for lots of info on caesareans and VBAC.

Are you looking to have a EBAC or Empowered Birth After Caesarian? Looking for some support or have a question? Post your thoughts here.

If you would like to have your name added to the list of EBAC'ers please email with the following details to *Shannon* - shannon@bellybelly.com.au or you can email Melinda - melinda@bellybelly.com.au or Kathryn - astrolady@bellybelly.com.au

EBAC'er-to-be

Forum Name:
Pregnant with: (second, third, fourth)
How many previous caesars?:
How many previous EBAC's?:
Obstetrician/Midwife:
Hospital/Home: (where, which hospital)
Birth Plans to help you with a EBAC: (support person, EBAC friendly Ob, books read)
Notes: (supportive care giver? unsupportive?)

VBAC Vets

Forum Name:
How many previous caesars?:
How many previous EBAC's?:
Birthing Order: e.g. Natural Birth, Caeser, EBAC, EBAC
Obstetrician/Midwife:
Hospital/Home: (where, which hospital)
What helped you achieve a EBAC: (support person, EBAC friendly Ob, books read)
Notes: (supportive care giver? unsupportive? tips?)

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EBAC'er-to-be

Forum Name: Cailin
Pregnant with: second child
How many previous caesars?: One
How many previous EBAC's?: None
Obstetrician/Midwife: Dr Lionel Steinberg
Hospital/Home: Frances Perry
Birth Plans to help you with an EBAC: I'll have my trusty birth attendent Kelly present & Marc of course. I plan to read as much as possible and learn as much as possible to give me the best chance I can. But for me the most important thing is that I have an EBAC, there is no such thing as a failed VBAC.
Notes: Ob is very supportive and well recommended.
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Forum Name: Deejoy17 (Deeanne)
Pregnant with: #2
How many previous caesars?: 1
How many previous EBAC's?: 0
Hospital/Home: Maitland Public or Newcastle Private
Birth Plans to help you with a EBAC: Haven`t gone into all details yet
Notes: Matthew was born via c/s due to CPD which was diagnosed via a CT scan, he was also a big baby, wouldn`t engage and I needed a crowbar to open my cervix plus he was already 6 days over due, so a c/s was decided on.
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Forum Name: Kirsty
Pregnant with: pregnancy #3, hoping to have baby number #2 out of this pregnancy.
How many previous caesars: 1
How many previous EBAC's:
Obstetrician/ Midwife:hoping Dr Chris Beaton ~ but not 100% confirmed yet
Hospital/ home: (where/ which hospital) at this stage we are planning on South West Health Care in Warrnambool
Birth plans to help with an EBAC: uuuuuuuuuuuummmmmmmmm none yet
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Forum Name: Snowgirl
Pregnant with: No.2
How many previous caesars: 1
How many previous EBAC's: -
Obstetrician/ Midwife: Dr. Herbst
Hospital/ home: Paracelsus Hospital, Germany
Birth plans to help with an EBAC: haven't written one yet
Notes: last time placenta abruptio, only 6 months between pregnancies
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Forum Name: Sanna67
Pregnant with: Baby # 4
How many previous caesars:1
How many previous EBAC's?:
Obstetrician/ Midwife: Dr Michael Koutsoukis
Hospital: St John of God Geelong
Births Plans: Working on one at moment
Notes: First 2 deliveries normal vaginal - slow progression 22hrs & 17 hrs
3rd - Emergency caeser, meconium in waters +++++, fetal distress.
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Forum Name: Juliette
Pregnant with: Not pg yet - thinking of TTC in February '06
How many previous caesars: 1 (May 2005)
How many previous EBAC's?: 0
Obstetrician/ Midwife:
Hospital/Home: Kingaroy, QLD
Birth Plans to help you with a EBAC: Just getting my head around the possibilities at this stage
Notes: Previous c-section due to FTP/CPD (PIH & induced labour)
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Forum Name: kirsty77
Pregnant with: Number 2
How many previous caesars: 1
How many previous EBAC's?:
Obstetrician/ Midwife:
Hospital: Kingaroy
Birth plans: Thinking about it again.Am going to stick to my guns next time round!
Notes: was induced as I was 7 days overdue.1 lot of gel and 23 hours of labour.Couldn't get past 9cm dilation due to they say small pelvis and Gemma's head bouncing around on my cervix, I say I was to stressed resulting in emergency c/s.
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Forum Name: gabbysmum
Pregnant with: second
How many previous caesars?: 1
How many previous EBAC's?: None
Obstetrician/Midwife: Public patient, whoever is on duty!!
Hospital/Home: Royal Women’s Hospital Melbourne (Public)
Birth Plans to help you with a EBAC: Looking for minimal intervention, I feel I don’t have a lot of choice as a public patient and will have to be as assertive as I can be on this.
Notes: previous c section due to breech which was not detected until 41 weeks, I was very disappointed that it was missed by the midwives earlier which gave me no opportunity to try to encourage her to turn at all.






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VBAC Vets

Forum Name: Trish
How many previous caesars?: 1
How many previous EBAC's?: 1
Birthing Order: Natural, Natural, Caesar, EBAC
Obstetrician/Midwife: Private Midwife
Hospital/Home: Home Sydney, NSW
What helped you achieve a EBAC: Great support network, understanding and very caring midwife, loads of research done both online and by reading books on homebirths and waterbirths.
Notes: Do lots of research and know what your options are. Knowledge is power.
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Forum Name: Mumofbundlezofjoy (Vanita)
How many previous caesars?: 1
How many previous EBAC's?: 1
Birthing Order: Natural Birth (twins), Caeser, VBAC,
Obstetrician/Midwife: Dr Simon ( vbac and csec)
Hospital/Home: Warragul hospital
What helped you achieve a EBAC: MUM, EBAC friendly Ob, lots of books, and info from websites read
Notes: WHATEVER YOU DO, _________RESEARCH
You are hiring the DR to do a job FOR YOU, and so you are in charge, More power to the birthing woman!!!!!!

[Trish]

Forum Name: Trish
How many previous caesars?: 1
How many previous EBAC's?: 1
Birthing Order: Natural, Natural, Caesar, EBAC
Obstetrician/Midwife: Private Midwife
Hospital/Home: Home Sydney, NSW
What helped you achieve a EBAC: Great support network, understanding and very caring midwife, loads of research done both online and by reading books on homebirths and waterbirths.
Notes: Do lots of research and know what your options are. Knowledge is power.


Take care
Trish

[mumofbundlezofjoy]

Forum Name: Mumofbundlezofjoy
Pregnant with: Number 4 on its way, hopefully soon
How many previous caesars: 1
How many previous EBAC's : 0
Birthing order: twins, vaginal: Emergency Caesar: fingers crossed
Obstetrician/Midwife: Midwife program through very supportive Ob Dr David Simon
Hospital/Home: West Gippsland Hospital ( Warragul)
Birth plans to help me with EBAC: Mum as support person, along with DH, Practicing OFP for the last 3 months, RLT capsules, positive support groups via internet, surrounding myself with positive vibes, read several books including " natural childbirth after caesarian, Crawford/Walters" lent to me by OB!!!

[nicole mckay]

i am assuming a ebac is the same as a vbac.i have a question.
i have had 2 c/sections.the first an emergency and the second a planned.i would really like to try for a vaginal delivery and my dr was not really supportive about the issue hence a rupture.it has been 7 years since my last and so i thought that was a long time for healing to take place.
do you think i can push the subject with him,or just take his advice and feel defeated??????
nikki

[Rouge]

Ebac is Empowered birth after Caesarean. It means basically whatever birth you have after caesarean, whether you try for a vbac and have a vaginal, try for a vbac and have an emerg c/s, choose another c/s. So long as you are empowered by your decision

According to birthrights the chance of rupture is minimal (something like 1%) and there is higher risk of rupture with an induction then there is with a VBAC, but they don't like to tell you that. I would say push it as far as you can, its your body, your right. For me I am going to try for a VBAC, if I end up having a c/s I will be fine with that because I will have had the "Labour" I wanted regardless of the birth. Having said that I would love to birth vaginally but just to be given the chance is great for me. I think every woman should be allowed the choice, whether it could end in C/S or not (thats if thats what they want). I think the rates for VBAC's is something like 70% out of those that try who go on to deliver naturally. Vanita feel free to help me with statistics here LOL!

Goodluck, and keep us posted! There are a few vets around here who are more knowledgable than I and will probably offer some great advice!

*hugs*
Cailin

[mumofbundlezofjoy]

Yes the risk of uterine rupture is less than 1% post csec, and more if you have never had a csec, and are induced, so pooey on that OB!!!
Labour is very important for the baby as it prepares for life, so even a "trial" of labour is better than just going for elective csec.

The most important thing is for YOU to decide what you want to do, and NOT the OB, you need to research the pro's and cons and make an informed decision, then find a care provider that will listen to you!!!

[Trish]

Vanita, you are absolutely right. There is a higher risk of uterine rupture without a previous c section. Alot of Ob's and even midwives will try to discourage you from having a vbac. I found that while my hospital was wiling for me to try (had no probs before) I was still offered a caesar.

As I didn't consider myself to be high risk, even though the hosp did, I wanted to use their birthing suites. Basically I was told a flat out NO. There are only 2 hospitals that I could have went to and they are both in town - too far away from me. That's when I decided on a homebirth. After much research I decided on a waterbirth, the water is said to help relax you more and also relaxes your muscles allowing them to stretch more.

Hospitals also only give you a certain ammount of time to labour, then another set time to push baby out in. Stupid I know. They put a monitor on your stomach and you are connected to the machine the whole time, meaning that you have to stay on the bed.

Of course this is far better than having to stay on a bed while they take your baby out of your stomach but I just wanted more freedom and choice in my birth than the hosp was prepared to give me.

Sorry, rambled on a bit there :-#


Take care
Trish

[{sarah}]

Cai, did you see the thing about the lady in QLD who assisted in her c/s? She had a very traumatic labour the first time which ended in a c/s & then planned to assist with her 2nd one. Once the head & shoulders were out she got to pull the rest of her baby boy out & laid him on her chest while they finished up with her. I thought this would be right up your alley if for whatever reason you end up with another c/s....

[mumofbundlezofjoy]

Well for any one who hasnt heard around the traps, I managed to have my vbac, On Tuesday night at 9.39pmI delivered my boy, Dion Michael, 4625gms, naturally, no drugs just a bit of hard work!!! The team with me, my DH, my mum, midwives, and Ob cheered with every push and were so positive that I could do this it was amazing!!! will tell more later!!

[Trish]

Vanita, congrats once again on what sounds like a very empowering birth experience. Well done sweety.


Take care
Trish

[mumofbundlezofjoy]

Thankyou Trish, cant say it was an easy experience, but worth it, ( stitches n all!!!) Had lots of labour issues, with anterior lip, shoulder distocia and the 2nd degree tear, but as I said the cheer squad were soooo supportive that when i was begging for a caesar they told me I could do this, and I did!!!!!

[Trish]

Ouchie Vanita, you certainly are a trouper. It's amazing what our bodies can do when we have our minds set on it. I think it's totally normal to doubt your bodies capability though when your having a hard time during labour or birth. I don't blame you begging for the caesar though, I was begging for an epidural and I was at home LOL.



Take care
Trish

[Ambah]

Sorry for the delay in updating your details here ladies... Trish - I have added your details in, and Vanita - would you like to update yours before I add them in?

[yennj1]

Hi

Just a newbie and I'm glad that I've found this forum. My details are
that this will be my first ebac (love that), Blacktown hospital delivery suite, midwives supportive, trial by labour - have one other bub c/s due to 2 weeks overdue, induction, meloconin (?spelling) fetal distress and dilating too slowly...I now believe it's because I was majorly stressed out all day due to my bub's heartbeat dropping continuously throughout the day, plus electrodes put on his head, plus blood been taken to test his PH...I mean I had so many wires coming out of me I don't think my body knew what was going on...I certainly didn't!! especially after all my reading on Active birth??

So my plan of action this time is to take my mum in aswell...she's good at finding out what's going on and hopefully helping make some decisions, so maybe I can just say 'what else can I do'

Haven't read too much as afer last time I read up on everything and didn't get to use any of it!! due to c/s...so these forums are about it and I'm hoping that this bub won't be so overdue so I won't need an induction. Plus I'm taking Raspberry Leaf tea and eating fresh pineapple...

Anyway, fingers crossed...I'm due September 10th!!

Jenny

[mumofbundlezofjoy]

I can highly recommend, looking into this carefully, to have an Ebac, you need to do your research there are web groups out there that focus on this issue, and can give great support, and info ( ie the stats etc)
Birthrites is the best.
The bonus of having a labour before your csec ( despite the fact that you're exhausted) is the baby's body gets prepared to be in the world, and lungs etc get "primed" which does not happen with a booked in csec IYKWIM. So babies usually adjust easier,and BF better. I mean if its not possible, dont get upset, but to plan to have some labour is really beneficial to all.

I wish you all the best in your search for the best solution for you and your bub. Good luck with finding out all you can!

[Visitor9]

Hi girls,
I just wanted to ask a question
Does the amount of time between preg reduce the small risk of tear? Or does the scar just remain a little weaker than the rest of the ulterine wall?
My obst told me after my scheduled c-sect that all future preg would have to done the same way..hmm now thinking next time I wanna give it a go!
He is supportive of most things I suggest, but under the impression because he deals only with high risk preg it might be his way or the highway.
Bec

[mumofbundlezofjoy]

My Ob gave me the impression that 12 months in between babies was important for the optimum scar healing. If your Ob wont go for it, get a new Ob! You are paying him to do a job, YOU are his boss, dont let him give you terms IYKWIM. You wouldnt pay a mechanic to fix your car, and accept him saying, " now Im going to only fix the clutch but not the brakes, coz thats too time consuming"

AND If you had a cut on your leg, and had it stitched up, would it come open when you run?? Well to the uterus labour is natural, and the Ob is doubting his own stitching abilities if he doesnt think the scar will hold together.

Make sure you run the show, this is your baby, and your body!!!!

[Trish]

Theresa,

I have posted my VBAC story although I didn't much write it like one. I'm not really sure on how to put a link to it but it's in the birth stories forum called Tehya Makezies Home waterbirth (or something like that). I think if you do a search for it you will find it.

A VBAC is very rewarding, I found that some Dr's, but not most will try and encourage a repeat C section. Generally and quite often this is completely un necessary. The line you will usually get is about Uterine abruption, the chances of your uterine wall spitting is actually higher to a woman who has never had abdominal surgery (eg, c section) than what it is for one who has. Do your research, Birthrites is an awesome site, knowledge is power.

Good luck.

Take care
Trish