Islam and MaccaDees?

[AnyDream]

Thanks for the explanation, Chloe.

BTW, I'm assuming all the McCafe beverages and cakes are Halal and they haven't squirreled some beef fat in there somewhere? Like Sherie, I'm not sure I want to know why icecream cones need to be halal!

[Phteven]

I all the cakes and beverages are halal but the chips have a pretty nasty additive in them (I can't remember which but there is an additive alert thread somewhere).

BTW, Astrid, we have Muslim friends in your town and when we last visited (2005) they were buying their meat from the local supermarket because it was getting it from the halal abattoir nearby.

[Indadhanu]

Chloe, you're right...
My mum studied vetinary science, and they learnt a lot about the slaughter process and what different religions do, and she was really disgusted at how animals were slaughtered in non-halal/kosher abbatoirs.

I have heard many Buddhist monks who talk about eating meat (not all Buddhists are vegetarians) and suggest that if you eat mean then eat halal or kosher meat as the slaughter is done in a way that is respectful to the animals.

Though I don't know much about what happens afterwards... not sure if you saw my other question but just wondering if there are things that have to be done to keep meat halal... I *think* I heard it has to be kept and cooked separate from any pork... is that to keep it halal?

[Phteven]

Alisia, if it gets mixed with non-halal meat then it's no longer halal. Also there are some food additives that are derived from non-halal sources (gelatine from pork for example) so if those additives are used on the food it isn't halal.

[Heaven]

I hope I didn't offend anyone!! I wasn't saying it was inhumane, I don't think it is, I think I read another one of your posts about it somewhere Chloe. Was just wondering if Astrid didn't agree with how they were killed iykwim.
Thanks for the information though, you're always a wealth of knowledge!!!!

ETA- Where would I find that additive thread do you reckon? Wouldn't mind checking it out, I'm pretty clueless about those things.

[rurumummy]

Hi alisia,

Yes the halal meat should be kept seperate from pork and should not be cooked on the same grill,pan,etc..as pork until it has been cleaned of pork product

ETA-me and chloe answered at the same time lol

[Astrid]

It is the prayer and the ritual aspect I object to mostly. For me eating meat ritually killed in the name of a religion I am not involved with just does not sit well with me. I have the right to know if the meat I am eating is killed that way or not. I will be incredibly disappointed if the local supermarkets are selling halal meat unlabeled, I have since found out that it happens with some chicken. Basically it is still my choice what I eat.

[Heaven]

Thanks Astrid! Sorry for being nosey, lol.
I never thought about meat being halal or not, I just assumed it wasn't.

[rurumummy]

Also just a note that Kosher meat is also permissable for muslims because it is slaughtered the same way and it has the name of god recited upon slaughter as well

[Phteven]

ETA- Where would I find that additive thread do you reckon? Wouldn't mind checking it out, I'm pretty clueless about those things.

**Alert** food safety for kids

Astrid, may I ask if you have the same objections to eating kosher meat or sharing a meal with a Christian family who say grace or a wiccan who does cooking rituals?

[Astrid]

**Alert** food safety for kids

Astrid, may I ask if you have the same objections to eating kosher meat or sharing a meal with a Christian family who say grace or a wiccan who does cooking rituals?

My main objection is to meat that I would be purchasing for myself and family either at a supermarket, butcher or restaurant. I am respectful of the beliefs of those that I visit. If I know that I am in a Christian household I will always wait for them to say grace, if I was in a Jewish home I would understand that the meal I would be served would be kosher etc. I just wish to have knowledge when I am purchasing food, as stated in a previous post that I understand that if I am to eat Turkish on Sydney Rd that the meat will be halal. I do my best to buy free range eggs, but there are times where it is not possible or out of my control (eating out), just because I eat one cage egg does not mean that I do not have the right to purchase free range eggs in the future. I prefer not to eat halal, but I do realise that sometime I will have no choice. I respect there is a need for halal and kosher foods etc, I believe that the respect should also go in the other direction, respecting others choice to not eat it.

It is only in the past year that I have made the effort to actually find out about halal, before I was quite ignorant about it meant. I believe there should be choice in food and correct labeling in food. I always thought that halal meat was always labeled, I have since found that not to be true and I am surprised that labeling laws allow this.

[{sarah}]

Astrid, I hope you didn't take my question the wrong way. I have no issue with you making the decision to not purchase Halal foods etc I was just curious as to what was the reasoning behind it.

[Astrid]

No issue Sarah, half expected the question when I first posted.

[{sarah}]

Cool, just making sure that you didn't think I was being disrespectful.

[Trillian]

I think that they wouldn't have different labelling because essentially the end product is still the same, it's just that the way it got there was different. I would rather it be labelled simply because it would be easier for someone wanting halal meat to just see it on the label and buy it instead of having to find someone to ask them and then deal with the vague blank look on their face when they say they don't know.

I'm not bothered by eating meat that is halal or kosher because I don't have a religion so to me, meat is meat.

A few years ago here there was a huge influx of o/s workers during the construction phase of the Cowal Gold Mine and they wanted halal meat and the local abbatoir actually arranged for someone to come and do a halal slaughter for them. Halal meat isn't exactly the easiest thing to come by out here LOL.

[Yael]

There was a post somewhere i did also explaining that kosher slaughtering in the most humane way to kill an animal. I don't know about the intricate laws of hallal, but from the brief post of Chloe's it sounds like there is a similar ethos. I will try and hunt it down.

Also just a note that Kosher meat is also permissable for muslims because it is slaughtered the same way and it has the name of god recited upon slaughter as well

Ok, don't quote me on this, i'll have to check with DH when he gets home, but i don't think a prayer is recited when they do the actual schetting (slaughtering). But i have never actually seen it, or learnt a huge amount about it, so i will have to check it out.

Hey, Chloe or Rurumummy - what is the price of hallal meat as opposed to normal meat? I just know with all the special supervision etc for kosher meat, it makes ours about double the price of other meat out there. Is it the same with Hallal?

I wish i could have that kind of take -a-way. I think in South Africa there is kosher Nando's, or in Israel you can get chain store kosher food (depending on what level of kosher you keep, it wouldn't be one we eat at anyway ). I think i miss the convience of it, rather than the actual food though.

[Trillian]

Yael, when they did the slaughter out here, the meat was a lot more expensive than normal due to the expensive of getting someone out to do it properly. They didn't mind though apparently, they were really happy that it could be done for them.

[Phteven]

Yael, I'm not sure about the relative price. TBH I never pay much attention to the prices of food unless I'm shopping with coins and don't want to be embarrased at the checkout.
The chicken at my local supermarket is halal and about the same price as the ones next door without the sticker. I live across the road from a wholesale butcher so I get pretty good prices compared to my old butcher.

Astrid as far as I know the chicken brands that are halal certified include biaida (that includes the lilydale freerange), redlea, cordina, most of the inghams and lots of the steggles are but they won't guarantee it. The reason is because the slaughter process in their factories is the same for halal and non-halal. It requires a Muslim to oversee it and an inspection to make sure the premises are clean and humane. From an economic point of view it would be silly to exclude yourself from the market (both local and export) when it costs nothing extra to be able to access it.
FWIW if a Muslim were slaughtering in a non-halal abbatior and said Bismillah before each slaughter and cut their throat that meat would probably be halal too.
I think that they don't bother labelling it because the end product from a physical perspective is pretty much the same - it's not the same as having a food additive in it that could cause an allergic reaction or cancer or organic or GM which have ecological implications. They only label for physical ingredients not spiritual charcteristics. Halal labelling is entirely voluntary if an organisation wants to label not halal then that would be ok too.

Also when it comes to labelling there is a 5% loophole. There is unfortunately lots of stuff in our food that isn't labelled.