Starting to get depressed about DS's sleep (a bit long) WWYD?

[*Danni*]

willow! I actually got a random 6 hour stretch from my little man the other night!! That has not happened since he was like 6 weeks old lop cheering except i was awake for half of it hmm. I totally wake up every 2 hours regardless as well. Im hoping your DS sleeps more and more for you soon hunni! You have been so patient over the years... You & kaz!

That is really interesting re the weaning kaz - I'll definitely be keeping that in mind and as inspiration to keep going over the coming YEARS (most likely - I don't ever see this baby weaning in the forseeable future lol). Totally feeling you on the randomness thing. I really hope it gets better for you... Sorry I don't have any answers.


Sent from my iPhone more than likely while I should be doing something else!

[willow5]

Kaz it's so frustrating when they're up for that long through the night. Last night must've been the night for it DS only woke 3 or 4 times but they were to have some milk then roll around play with my hair, my nose my elbow look around try to get up and go out to the lounge to play with is brother (he's 17) he got home from night shift at 1.30am and DS could hear him in the kitchen getting stuff to eat ...Actually was it a full moon last night lol I thought I heard someone say it was that could explain it!
He usually settles much quicker than hat but occasionally he does the extended wakeful episodes and the boobs just don't help much.

Yay for 6 hours Danni, pitty you weren't asleep for the whole 6 though, always the way with us too. Sometimes DS does his long stretch the first time he goes down so it's not until I've done the dishes, some washing tidied up that I realise he's been asleep for 3 hours or so and I missed my chance for some sleep then he'll wake every hour or 2 after that

[~Kaz~]

Danni - whoot for the 6 hour stretch! I'm sorry you didn't get the same sleep but its great that he did it.

Willow - the 90 min wake up at some point overnight is pretty standard here lately. So much so that i'm wondering if its relayed to brainwaves and the sleep cycle so we're waiting for the next wave of sleepy to hit and it takes 90 mins???? I totally get you on the frustration of chirpy play behaviour in the middle of the night too. Getting bopped on the nose or ear or having my hair pulled in the wee small hours is very unfun!

DS just went off to sleep now partly my fault as we were running late so the whole dinner, bath, bed routine was late which is unusual. Was hoping he'd crash but that's crazy thinking in this house

I've decided that if he's still waking for long periods in 6 months time, (be over 3 then) i'm taking him to a sleep clinic for overnight brainwave assessment. Don't care what it costs, I'm going to need more than theories to keep my sanity by then LOL.

Hope you all have restful, sleep filled nights tonight

Sent from my phone.

[willow5]

I've decided that if he's still waking for long periods in 6 months time, (be over 3 then) i'm taking him to a sleep clinic for overnight brainwave assessment. Don't care what it costs, I'm going to need more than theories to keep my sanity by then LOL.
Sent from my phone.

Ok I'm only full of loose theories at the moment So what does the assessment entail and what could actually be the outcome? And can we come too LOL??!! But seriously I hadn't looked that far into it to know this was even an option so please tell me all you know, or point me in the direction of the info

[~Kaz~]

Ok, we're awake again. Have been for about an hour now

Willow, lol I don't actually know that much about it but I have a contact who does sleep research in a clinic. I'm almost certain they look at kids as well as adults but not sure of the minimum age. For all I know it could be 7 or something! That was an off the cuff remark but I think I will look into it because I can't keep doing this. I feel like i'm ever so slowly sliding into depression. I'll send him an e-mail tomorrow and try to find the clinic on the net. I think its attached or affiliated with a major city hossy and a university.

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[~Kaz~]

So, after my last post I got another 4 hrs sleep. Less than 5 all night we're going away today too and need to drive for hours

Sleep clinics look at heaps of issues relating to why people don't sleep or have a sleep disorder like sleep apnoea or sleep walking etc. You turn up in the afternoon, and leave early the next morning. They monitor you visually and also hook you up to monitors that check all your vital signs, respiration, brainwaves etc. Then you get a report about what happened, what your body is doing overnight and what you can do to treat or better manage it.

I thought there was only one anywhere near me but seems there's a few in my closest capital city. Their websites mention Medicare coverage and referral thru a GP. I'm on my phone so they were hard to navigate to see age range or criteria. I'm pretty sure my contact does research on child sleep (and daytime behaviour) so i'll look into that one.

Not sure where you are but if you Google sleep clinic and the name of your nearest capital city and/or health service/region you should get some hits.

Sent from my phone.

[willow5]

I think we had the same sleep last night I'm no t driving for hour thank god, but I'm so tired I feel sick today so I'm about to drag my ass to work. Only a short day luckily. I'll check out the sleep clinic info thanks for that.

[willow5]

Drive safe Kaz! Even on my 15min drive to work I questioned if I was actually alert enough to be driving I can't imagine having to do a long haul drive.

[*Danni*]

Hey kaz I've been thinking about you... Especially the last few nights as my little man has decided that waking up every 2 hours to be fed isn't enough anymore... Now he's decided he's going to wake up between 1am & 3am and not sleep for another 2 hours. OH. my. god. What the hell?! I am turning into a grumpy short tempered Mummy as I don't do well sleep deprived like this! Anyway.. I just wanted to check in to see how you are going, if things have improved and if you have advice for me this time as I am really getting desperate now. I am so worried he is getting bad habits and not sleeping enough so really want to make some changes but don't know where to start oh, the joys right?!


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[~Kaz~]

Hey Danni, thanks for thinking of me!! and great big for your night time adventures. It truly sucks and I really know exactly where you're at with the long wake ups!

I was playing relaxation music at bedtime which DS got into for a little while (week or two) and it seemed to help calm him down and settle him faster - sleep took just as long but he wasn't bouncing in and out of bed or rolling around etc quite so much. My most recent CD purchase was a set of brainwave relaxation CDs. One is for sleep. Others are for concentration and creativity etc. I think they're designed for adults but a brainwave is a brainwave right? He is not so fussed on it and has only heard part of it once Lately he is just as likely to not want the music on as agree to having it played anyway. Was worth a try.

We have also tried reading at bedtime - sometimes this works, other times it turns into a massive drama. We have pushed his bedtime back to 7:30-8pm but I still have to sit in there with him for at least 30 mins and he often doesn't go down until 9pm!! He is still waking every night. We have had some better nights in there where he re-settles in like 5 minutes but if the re-settle doesn't happen fast, then we're up for hours. The other night (Sunday) I was up for 1.5 hours with him until he let me go back to bed and stayed in his own one. No idea how long he stayed awake for but he would have been lucky to have 8 hours sleep that night and I had much less. I totally lost the plot and just sat in his room crying for ages I am really struggling with losing my evenings and also having to be up overnight too. Last night we co-slept after the second wake up and he gave me a sleep in until 7:30am!! My sleep was pretty broken by him but I got way more than if I'd sat up with him. Psychologically I'm getting to the point where I just can't do it anymore. It's been 2 years and 8 months of pretty regular, nightly waking and I don't know when it will end.

Sorry it's such a downer post. I haven't been back in here much lately cause I'm not pg, TTC or wanting to talk much. This stuff is so depressing for me. My only advice (and biggest regret that we didn't do more of it when DS was a baby) is to co-sleep. It's not my ideal as I don't sleep as well but at least I am horizontal.

ETA - Thinking back, DS's sleep got really revolting at around the 1 year mark. I ended up night weaning him as I wasn't coping with the 2 hourly waking and getting in and out of bed all night to feed. I really regret weaning him and wish I'd started co-sleeping at that point instead. Not saying you should feel the same, just my experience Could your DS be teething atm? There's a pretty massive developmental leap at 12 months. The lights really come on IYKWIM? It's like they suddenly understand absolutely everything going on around them. I would try dropping a day sleep somewhere (if possible) or shortening them perhaps to see if he then gets tired enough to resettle faster at night. I'm possibly the wrong person to ask though hun lol because that's the age that DS started his long wake ups too and we're still stuck there so clearly I don't know jack

[OceanPrincess]

Kaz, I do not know how you are still functioning. I tip my hat to you and offer more of these

[Rach83]

I haven't read back on all the posts but for 3 months my daughter 18mo at the time was waking from 3-5 every night. She had started child care and was constantly sick and slept a lot during the day. After she was better she continued this pattern until I cut out her day sleeps. The waking didn't stop immediately but over the course of a week it did.


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[onthefly]

I agree on the co-sleeping - it certainly beats getting up. I had a similar experience with night weaning also - only stuck with it as I wanted my cycles to resume. Will not be doing that this time. DH is starting to pester me about coming back to sleep with me. I say sure, but you have to sleep with DD too. He grumps that then he'll get woken up. poor baby.

It's a really long time for you to be dealing with this Kaz. My DS went through a long phase of verry looooooong winddowns at bedtime - 2-3 hours - so I understand how fecking awful that is. Finally got better when he was about 2, though.
I'm sorry, I can't remember the earlier parts of the thread - have you cut out screen time and checked dietary stuff? Do you ever just bring him straight to bed with you?

[willow5]

Hey Danni DS went through a stage of the 2hr waking and wanting to play and chat etc. It actually was a phase and didn't last more than a few weeks, although there were about 2 lots of it.

Kaz sorry you're still struggling too. We have actually taken all food additives out of DS's diet, and it does seem to help! We've gone from 5-8 even more on bad nights, to a pretty steady 2-4. Still not perfect but omg such an improvement from 5-8! I really think the mix of high brain activity and the additives was a bad combo. I think there is some hidden stuff in a few things he's eating and because I'm still BF and eating stuff with numbers he's still getting some. But there's a definite an improvement.

[kateo]

Hi,
Sorry to hear about your sleep issues.
I have a 12 week old who has a pattern now that is 10pm(ish) feed and sleep, 3 or 4 am (ish) feed and sleep with sometimes a settle of about 1/2 hour then he wakes for a feed about 7 am (ish)
I know this is pretty OK but I have been reading here because it's possible the wheels may fall off!
As a behaviour management teacher may I suggest a couple of ideas.
First DIET! I would look at the amount of sugar/additives your little people consume in a day and what time prior to trying to settle for sleep. Remember sugar in fruit and drinks. I imagine this is not a new idea but food then sleep immediately is sometimes a problem leading to no sleep.
Second TRACKING make a list of your day - note times for awake, food, settling and sleep. This may not help immediately but you might see a pattern that can help you make changes. It is a common management tool and perhaps will give you a focus also for looking at what is happening instead of worrying about what to do about it for a while. You might combine a food diary with a sleep diary and see if there are correlations.........if nothing else it'll give you something to do while one hand is patting your little one to sleep!
Know also that normal sleep is in 40 minute cycles. I am probably teaching my grandma to suck eggs here but it's useful to know in terms of being ready to settle a little person instead of being annoyed they have stirred.
I know how it feels to constantly have your sleep disrupted. I have done foal watches with alarms going off at all odd times and I have been a nanny to a badly sleeping baby.
My experiences pale into insignificance when compared to some of the stories here but I have felt a tiny bit of whats going on for you.
Good luck and perhaps the writing down of what's happening might help you find an "eat play sleep" pattern that will help.
In my experience with little people I have found that sleep helps sleep. In other words if you can encourage some good daytime naps they might help with night sleeping.
I so hope you don't find these comments annoying
Kate

[*Danni*]

Thanks so much for that response Kaz! And thanks for your words willow5. It really helps hearing all this from someone who knows just how I feel and is going through it. About co-sleeping, my DS has done this with us part-time since birth. When he is not in with us (which is less lately as he wakes at my EVERY movement and i feel so restricted with the way I have to sleep, so he doesn't fall off the bed and tbh sometimes I just like my freedom at night which is why it isn't all night long, but I do love it at times) he sleeps in a baby hammock by our bed which is designed until they're 3 if you're keen lol. No cot sleeping for my little man - he won't have a bar of it (and would attempt to get up like a mad man lol)! And he was never the type that liked to be rocked in my arms for some reason so it's only always been feeding and if that fails (which it sometimes does) then it's rocking to music, in a gro bag in the hammock (not calming music mind you, he likes the lively stuff LOL).

But lately all of it has started to fail. I agree re this developmental stage, but he has always been so tough and had phases of nothing working, no matter how creative the attempt. Yes I think he could be teething, we put back on his amber beads yesterday, and last night was a bit better then the last few nights, but like you I really find it difficult not having my nights or proper sleeps anymore! DH is still trying to rock him to sleep, he doesn't like going down before 10pm these days but we try! And there is no sign of teeth, so I think it's still a few weeks until they cut, god help us lol. I am definitely not going to wean him as hard as it gets BFing every 2 hours overnight, hearing that you regret your decision makes me feel even stronger to push on

Sorry to make it about me in this post, its just really nice to have someone talk to that understands, as I don't have that generally! I totally hear you on things working for a week or 2 then fail, my DS is so like that. He gets over things super quick. I think we just have very active, spirited babies don't we!?

I am sorry to hear things haven't gotten much better for you kaz. It's nice to hear from you & I just hope the worst is over for you! I do know there are some sleep experts that can come in house that don't do controlled crying, hard to find but worth a research if you're desperate...


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[Chrispe]

Hey Kaz,
My DD was similar to your DS,
she's now 5 and sleeping through most nights, although every now & then she wakes & wants me to 'put her blanket on' then she goes straight back to sleep. If you are talking to your DS & telling him what needs to happen & he laughs & says 'no' it might be a little more than a sleep problem. He might not think you will do what you say, I have had issues with the same, I had to learn to tell them & stick with it. It is hard but it does pay off! As they get older it gets better.

[~Kaz~]

Wow this is a really old thread but was one of the last ones I was active in before taking a break from BB!! Wish I could tag you all like you can in FB to find out how your nights are going now over 6 months later!!

I am really over the moon to report that DS is now 'mostly' sleeping through each night We still have wake ups a few nights a week, sometimes more, sometimes less. He comes in with us and unless it's 5am he will go back to sleep - sometimes even straight away In terms of the bedtime routine, it still takes longer than I'd like and he always chooses lots of stories. We are big into books and initially I put a limit of 3 on him but DP will read more than that so it's hard to stick to. Sometimes I read for an hour or so but as soon as the stories stop he is straight to sleep Usually he is down between 8-8:30pm. We sacked the daysleep at daycare which helped. Screen time varies but has been quite low lately and he usually watches none during the week and then a little on weekends but we've stopped it in the late afternoon too. Not sure that made much difference but I like that he is playing more with toys and craft and us!

Hope you guys have had similar improvements in your LO's sleep habits.