Does happy mum REALLY equal happy baby?

[Smoke Jaguar]

no one likes hard work.

Ooooh, I'm ALWAYS up for a challenge Pushing comfort zones is what I'm comfortable with LOL! Then again, I'm usually a 'full tilt' or 'no tilt' kind of person, living my life passionately interested in what I'm doing, on some level, or out for the count.
My firefighting is very important to me. If it weren't, I'd have opted out when DS was little. This is the one area of conflict in my life, akin to Rory's one with work. I have been trying and trying and trying to make it work. I've been making compromises on it and my firefighting has suffered a LOT. And as I'm still passionate about its role in my life, I haven't given up on it yet. However, with the current and foreseeable male-interest-oriented nature of fire brigades, no-ones going to help me integrate firefighting into my mothering experience (yes, I do believe I could be better accomodated and supported, including by my partner who is also a volunteer), so whilst that's the case for now (don't worry, it's something I'm working on...I can chip away at the Old Guard slowly to make it easier for someone else to knock down the wall!), my boy is better off with my letting fire brigade take a back seat. I don't need anyone to tell me this and I don't think it would at all help if someone said "Go on, go on a Strike Team and take your pump with you - it will make you happy and HM=HB", because DS would be VERY upset with me being gone for 24 hours in hot weather when he wants some boob! Not compatible, I made my choice and whilst my hand is forced for now, the compromise is necessary to meet DS's needs. And that makes me happy and fulfilled in its own way.
ETA:

It confirms and validates your approach to parenthood in just the way you need.

No, not for parenting, for life in general I love this quote. It's my reality check. Everything passes, it gives me perspective when I think something is huger than it really is.

[*Efjay*]

I've just glanced back over this thread. Have to say I am hating how defensive everyone seems to get on BB these days.

Ooooh, I'm ALWAYS up for a challenge Pushing comfort zones is what I'm comfortable with LOL!

Thats great! Im more of a "its gotta be done" kinda person. Like a couple of years back I had to pick the car up from being serviced. To do it, I had to catch 2 buses with 3 kids (one being 6 weeks old) on a really hot day, it took an hour of travel to get there. That was hard work, I didn't like it but it had to be done. You just get on with it & do it.

[Smoke Jaguar]

That was hard work, I didn't like it but it had to be done. You just get on with it & do it.

Yep, and sometimes you might end up 'liking' it because of the sense of achievment from doing it - even if you didn't like it at the time. I would have felt pretty potent having made that trip, FJ - like "I didn't think I could and there, I proved that I'm super-capable of daunting tasks"!
Like me with BFing - it WAS bloody hard work and I did it knowing that I'd look back and thank myself for putting my own comfort way below DS's, because it would eventually be my own comfort, too. So, there's HB=HM & 'this too shall pass' all rolled into one scenario!
I definitely understand that not all mummies are created equal in the resilience stakes and need a leg up and need compromises. They need to know they're compromises, though, and not be told that HM=HB as if all decisions have equal weighting. Admitting you're having difficulty and asking for help is a tough thing, and to be told it doesn't matter which you choose because all roads lead to the ivory tower is misleading. And, sometimes, it is the only thing you can say as a stranger who doesn't know the person asking well enough to feel comfortable pushing them into a new zone of expectation of themselves.
Sorry if that's convoluted - I've just made another batch of playdough (thanks LuluHB for the idea you gave me, even though you're not here anymore! It was great hot day inspiration ) in bright purple and it's probably affected my reasoning :P

[sushee]

I definitely understand that not all mummies are created equal in the resilience stakes and need a leg up and need compromises.

Sorry Maya, but this is an example of what I mean - I see this as an insinutation that by compromising their child's needs to achieve their needs, they're not resilient.

Now I would make clear that I personally am not defensive about that. I believe I'm as resilient as the next person, if not more, for the compromises I have made. I just wanted to point out though, that this is the kind of phrase that gets people's backs up.

[sushee]

Bx,

I agree with you. I agree with almost everything you said. Because it was what I was trying to say too: I think fulfillment is something only the mother can find, because she's the only one who knows what it means to her.

As far as the HM=HB thing goes,I've already said I don't think it's necessarily true. I may have been unfulfilled as a SAHM for those first two years my son was here, but my son was a secure, happy baby. I was a good mother despite not necessarily being fulfilled. And I believe the decision to stay home those first years with him was a sound one, and one I would do again without hesitation if I had to live my life over.

But I guess I couldn't do that forever. It's not like I hadn't done it before (I was a SAHM to my first three kids for 8 years) and at some stage, I had to attend to my own needs, and have my son compromise with me so that we both could be happy. It's not exactly HM=HB, but it's definitely a compromise.

Which is do believe departs from the topic, which refers to whether the phrase is bandied around too much to appease guilt for the mother not necessarily doing the 'best' for her baby ('best' is in quotation marks because it's a subjective measurement). Yes I do think it is bandied around too much. I think you can be in pain, not get enough sleep, be generally unfulfilled and, as a result, have a secure, happy baby.

That's why I think the rather flippant phrase of HM=HB is NOT the same as discussing fulfillment. And I think bringing fulfillment into it muddies the waters, and perhaps is what brought this thread off-track. I think it's okay for someone to say 'I'm unfulfilled as a SAHM' - all it proves is that you DON'T have to be a happy mum to have a happy child. That sacrifices made sometimes, at the mother's expense, pays dividends in your child.

But in the end, everyone balances out how MUCH sacrifice they're willing to make. And I agree, that when someone comes in here looking for validation, the HM=HB phrase thrown around doesn't do a lot more than appease that person, without pointing out how, sometimes, trying to work out the problem, taking a different tack, looking for pofessional assistance or even giving it time, might present a better outcome for baby after all.

[*Efjay*]

"I didn't think I could and there, I proved that I'm super-capable of daunting tasks"!

too true, I had never looked at it that way. but then I wouldn't have thought "I don't think I can" simply because I know I can do anything if I put my mind too it.

[Smoke Jaguar]

Sushee, I think we got caught up with the fulfilment thing when another poster brought it into the fray a few pages back and we've been fleshing that one out WRT to the statement ever since! In a good way, I think - it's been very interesting and stimulating conversation ever since
ETA: I meant 'resilience' in the psychological way, I should have clarified - it's a term used in personality assessment. I didn't mean it as a value judgment - very different things and I'll clarify it next time