I think with sleep school if you call them crying that you are a single mum and that you are desperate and that you may do something irrational if you don't get help soon they may be able to get you in earlier (but you didn't hear that from me...).
If you can't get in earlier I think it is best to get DP out of the way and really focus on the issue. The change of routine and bedroom thing to start all over again from scratch and implement a new program as PurpleMumma suggested might do the trick.
Bugger about Dp Lulu. Maybe that's what is stirring her up and she's getting conflicting messages then about what is acceptable at night time - like she thinks it's OK to be loud when Dad is loud kwim? Jodie has some super ideas too.
Also, what time *ideally* would you like to see them into bed? maybe it's a bit early for them? A friend of mine had shocking issues with her eldest trying to get him to go to bed, but she was putting him to bed at 6pm - as well as forcing (yep, I did mean force) him to have 2 day sleeps and would complain about his terrible sleeping habits to anyone that would listen but the poor kid just wasn't tired! She finally worked out that if she put him to bed 2 hours later and dropped a day sleep (mind you he was 3!) that he went down for both his arvo and his bedtime sleep without a fuss.
Wow, hows this! I got an SMS from them saying they had a cancellation for 17/12, then another call just then saying they had another cancellation so I can have the assessment call for tomorrow 3.30!!!!
I think 7 - 7.30 is the right time for them both to go to bed and Beth is buggered by that stage. She only has sleeps when she has been up all night. She really dropped daysleeps at 18 months like her brother...
They both wake up well about 7 to 7.30 am unless its been a 'big night'....
Last night she went down (after no sleeps) after a boob YAY. Wakes at 12.30am off her head. she keeps saying I neeed to get out, I wanna get out (of the bedroom). She hit me if I came near her, then cried when I sat back on the bed. Seemed like a night terror first up, and she settled when she followed me out of the room for a drink. She was screaming the whole time.
So she has a drink we wander back to bed together, then she demands boobies and starts the screaming and kicking all over again. I by this stage have my head firmly under the pillow trying to ignore her. I don't want to keep feeding her and now she is refusing to wean and she is 2.5.
I hold fast for awhile, then lose the plot after she headbutts me and storm outside to take a deep breath. She cries at the back door for 2 mins whilst I do so. Breath taken and hackles down I talk calmly to her cuddle her and take her back to bed. She stops on the way and looks at me like I'm an alien and wont go any further, clutching her drink. I talk gently to her, worried she is still dreaming and then I see it..........the face she gives when she is pretending the world has ended, the bottom lip and all. It occurs to me that she is putting the WHOLE thing on.
I cave in give her the boob - after 45 mins of tanty, she goes to sleep happily in my bed and doesn't stir when her brother wakes yelling at 2.30, 3.30 OR when he hops into bed next to her......
How do I deal with this? The screaming (remember she is 2) at 12.30 is awful, but the poor kid who lives next door must be going nuts too. The windows are close and the wall on that side of the house is thin and unfinished. Its not fair on her, and I'm going to send the neighbours a present for being so bloody good about this. Its been going on forever...
I can't tell if she genuinely is frightened/dreaming or just going right over the top to get what she wants. So I feel like I can't address the problem. nor formulate a plan. It seems I only have enough brainspace to breath, blink and drive.....
ETA: She would do this maybe once or twice a week, but over the last 3 weeks its been nearly every night.
Last edited by Lulu; November 26th, 2008 at 06:33 AM.
Lulu. I'm sorry you're having a tough time. We don't get much sleep in this house either, though I don't think it's as tough as yours! I am lucky enough to have good support from DH (when he's not working...).
The only suggestions I can think of is to use some relaxation techniques, like a bath, massage in low lighting and oil burner in her room, with a little relaxing oils burning. And a strict routine, and bed time EVERY time she goes to bed.
Good luck, there's nothing worse than that horrible tiredness every single day.
what Calm drops did you get , because im am having similar sleep problems with DS who is 2 ... last night we had an early night at 9:30 pm ... BUT those brauer calm drops do not work on my misunderstood erratic sleeper !!
also too at night before we even attempt to put nixon to bed , we make sure ALL the windows are shut , because it sounds like we are hurting him .. i wish i could go back to sleep school ( have been once already) but DH wont let me ..
Lulu, big and all the best for the assessment interview today. I really hope they squeeze you in ASAP. BTW I know exactly what you mean after I spent 3 months of hallucinatory sleep deprivation and then I lobbed up at the Centre and there was a woman who'd got in after 3 weeks and who was there because her to rather-well-fed-looking toddler kept chucking their(very unappealing) food off the highchair tray.
Another big and I think you're doing a wonderful job in desperate circumstances.
Gosh - she is so much like my DD1. Brauers drops only kind of helped sometimes I so remember the screaming, infact we still get it. If she is fighting bed or wants mummy she screams. If she wakes in the middle of the night, she screams (which is occasional now), she wakes in the morning she screams.
As much as I hate to admit it, weaning was what got her sleeping better. It did take DH's help to do it, he did most of the night time routine, we just had to keep the boobies away from her.
Lulu i dont know alot about it but i will try find out for you. I know someone who has had similar issues with there toddler and she took her to a naturopath, i am not sure of the specifics but i know the child was lacking in something and also had other issues. Anyway she now has i think it is like a calming/relaxing syrup (mixes in yoghurt) that is given an hour before bed. I know there are other things the family changed also but as i said i am not sure of specifics, i will do my best to find out asap and get back to you.
Can the council offer any support?
Can queen Elizabeth centre offer any help before addmision?
What about local DHS office, can they provide in home support for you?
SJL - already working with the council. Initially I wanted it to be about how Dp can understand the effect he is having on DS, it got him thinking but of course he doesn't feel it a big enough priority to continue. I refuse to follow up for him but I still go to vent my frustration and its helped me see the (really CRAPPY) dynamics going on here.
They do provide in-home support but they are packed to the rafters and I can't get in for that now.
Talk to QEC today, she offered me a place at the residential unit for 5 days in January. TBH I don't know if I'll need it, cos changes need to be made now and it looks like I'll be doing it on my own. Thats ok though, I'm finding strength again already (thanks BB!).
So tonight - told DD she needs to be a 'proper' girl ( I can't use the word big, she doesn't like it!), and go to bed properly for a sticker in the morning. Did the routine, she fell asleep but woke up about an hour later. Put her back to bed - she wandered out 11 times and I just put her back, soothed her and BY JINGO she has stayed there. 11 times isn't really much, considering it took nearly 30 times when Dp was here and it still didn't work.
I consider the fact Dp hasn't been here since Monday for this. I know it ain't gonna be plain sailing so soon but my confidence has come back immediately. I was always quite strict with DD16 and I know thats what gives her security now. With Dp here, always noisy, talking LOUDLY and clumping around in his fricken steel caps on hardwood floors just does my head in and literally saps me, then I'm too tired and anxious to face a stubborn 2 year old.
So I live to fight another day! Liz, you were so right I will be able to work this out
Glad to know it is getting better Lulu. I remember now a friend of ours had trouble with his DD when she was little. He only visited a couple of days a week and those nights she would be feral. They worked out that she did not want her daddy to leave, so she was deliberately staying up, as he would leave once she went to sleep.
I thought I was doing the right thing letting him stay over rather than drag the kids off hours away, but he has absolutley NO respect for the kids needs or me. He keeps saying he wants to spend as much time with them as possible and hates that I won't let him live here (why would I??????), so HE keeps us all in a constant state of chaos. I'm sure on some level he doesn't want this sorted because I wont need him here. Can you tell I'm getting angry now I have had time to think about it??
Lulu, good on you. Actually, you have made this about you and her Dad (which it is), rather than put the problem squarely at her feet. I don't mean to pick on you BTW! But you're right, with some children, a strict routine is what they need and it's up to you (and her father - haha) to provide that. Sounds like it's tough to expect it to all fall on your shoulders, , I guess that's life sometimes. You will reap the rewards in the long run.
11 times isn't so bad for the first time. You will probably have setbacks even once she gets into the swing of things, but once you get on top of it you're right, your confidence will enable you to get right back on the horse.
GREAT JOB - You sound like the strong woman we all know and love once again!
Hey Lulu, wanted to drop in and let you know I'm thinking of you. I have nothing to suggest to you, but it sounds like you are working it all out anyway.
Did you have the assessment with the sleep school? I was wondering if you expressed your concerns about the effect DP's antics have on the kids to a councellor, and then they spoke to your DP and suggested he get it together that he may take it more seriously, KWIM?
In any case, I really hope things sort themselves out for you one way or another. Dealing with crazy bedtime antics is nooooo fun at all.
Oh man, that sounds hard, hard, hard but glad that you're seeing light at the end of the tunnel and FWIW, I would take the sleep school option even if you might not need it by then and treat it as a bit of a holiday - you bloody deserve it.
I to am wondering if the issue is with her room (rather than sleep as such) and also if sometimes Dp is not there when she goes to bed but then she can hear him later so gets up? So perhaps to her, it is worth getting up after a few hours sleep cos Dp might be there? Dunno. Maybe the day sleep is not so much of a problem because she knows that Dp isn't around during the day so she's not going to miss anything.
I am sending you a virtual bottle of scotch and a funnel!
Oh firstly big for you hun. Some kids are tough but you are doing a wonderful job because you are doing all you can for her ok.. dont ever forget that.
Not sure if anyones mensioned this or not, but is she old enough you can maybe try a reward system with her? Even maybe (if you havent and can afford to), let her pick out some new bedding.. maybe do her room up.. put some of those glow in the dark stars on her roof.. i know you can get some pretty good ones these days. Does she like massages? DS doesnt as hes too ticklish but i know they can put me to sleep.
Otherwise im not much help hun other than to offer your a big and pray for you that things start to pick up soon.
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at 2.30, 3.30 OR when he hops into bed next to her......
Lulu. I'm sorry you're having a tough time. We don't get much sleep in this house either, though I don't think it's as tough as yours! I am lucky enough to have good support from DH (when he's not working...).
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