Atheism/Agnosticism General Discussion #1

[Nai]

You put it better than I did but that's just my personal opinion and I'm sure other people see it differently.

[Rouge]

I guess the way I see Agnostic is as someone who believes in a greater power but it is nameless and not specific to any religion.

Whereas with Atheist they don't believe in any god or gods. "Anti-Theism"

[Heaven]

I think DH is agnostic then. He kinda believes there might be a greater power but has no proof of what it is?

I'm sorry if the question offended anyone too. I didn't word it very well at all. I just wanted to know why people believe what they do but didn't want to imply that anyone's beliefs were right or wrong, I'm just a little nosey, lol.

[Aimz]

I also do not think morality is necessarily apart of any particular religion. Even though I am an Athiest/Humanist I am an incredibly moral person and just because I am not religious/spiritual that does not leave me devoid of the common morals and values that most christians live by. Just because I reject the notion of a God does not mean that I do not hold the common and complex morals or values. My dad always taught me to admire those who strive to be good human beings because they believe that is the way it should be - not out of fear of hell. There is no spiritual gain involved - it is more selfless to want to be a good human being out of a want for a better life rather than a need for fear of the afterlife.

I think it is worth stating that in MY opinion, to me, striving to be a good human being while we are alive is far more noble than striving to be a good human being for when we are dead.

[Bathsheba]

I totally agree you can have a strong set of morals and not be religious. For me personally though if I didn't believe in a greater consciousness/God then i wouldn't have a reason to think about my "stance" on a lot of issues. My God is a challenging God... He demands I think about things in a way that take me way outside my comfort zone. I am not lured by Heaven. To be honest I am scared of Heaven because it's not going to be what I want it to be. God is using no "carrot" on me... just for the record

[christy]

Mod Hat on: As this is the discussion thread for athiesm/agnosticism, can we please keep the discussion there? I can understand wanting to explain why you believe something, but this is not the place for that Thanks

[RubyQuick]

Agreed. The bible does not provide a moral compass for me - in fact the old testament scares the daylights out of me - and neither does a religion or church. Morality existed before god did.

Roryrory, isn't 'The God Delusion' great? Have you checked out Hitchens?

[Bathsheba]

Apologies if I over stepped the line Christy. I was just responding to:

I think it is worth stating that striving to be a good human being while we are alive is far more noble than striving to be a good human being for when we are dead.

and references that Heaven isn't worth being moral for. I wasn't offended though... hope I also didn't offend.

It's a tricky (but interesting!) thread. Like Cailin said: Agnosticism is a belief in a greater power but not a specific God as per any particular religion... Maybe I am partially Agnostic... still trying to work it out!

[Aimz]

This is a thread where I assume I can express my beliefs without offending anyone as it is a thread for people who do not believe in god or any particular god. So I will not apologise for expressing my beliefs and I shouldn't have to worry about offending. Am I right?

And for the record, my references stating that heaven is not worth being moral for is MY OPINION and my belief system as I do not believe that there is heaven and I find it a much better use of my time being moral because it is simply the right thing to do. I in no way singled out any one person so please don't feel like I did. If I wanted to express my views to a particular religious group on this subject and put myself out there then I would gate crash that thread - which I have absolutely no intention of doing as I have mentioned that I deeply respect ALL religions, their core values and the people that follow those beliefs. I am simply expressing my own.

This thread should not be a debate about whether one person is right or wrong.

[paradise lost]

See Bath i don't have a God that challenges, i challenge myself. It is ME who expects better of me, and when life throws it's numerous challenges it is ME i hold responsible for how they come out and MY OWN good i work hard at resolving them for.

SJ i did not choose my belief it is just how i am. I do not see evidence of God, but i know if i believed i would only need to open my eyes to see evidence as if one believes in God then mere reality is rich proof enough that He exists. I was not Christened and was encouraged to explore/find my own spirituality. I would say that though i find things to admire in all the major religions i know about, i probably identify most with buddhism. I have "tried out" as a child Catholicism, CofE, CofS, Islam and Judaism. None fit or rang true to enough convince me.

Religion is interesting to me, but i can't say i believe in it. Do i pray? Absolutely, if someone who is a follower of a religion asks me to, i pray for them, i appeal to their god on their behalf. If their God exists He will see what is in my heart and know it is love and not a double standard which drives me, and if He does not exist i am doing no-one any harm.

I pretty much see God in a black and white way. Either he exists or he doesn't. I might not believe in cars, but that doesn't protect me if i walk casually into the road. I try to do what i know is right because i know i should, many many people religious or not live that way, and i don't delineate. I am deeply religious in my actions, i just don't aim my gratitude or wonder or love at a God.

Hope that makes sense.

Bx

[Heaven]

Makes perfect sense.

Do i pray? Absolutely, if someone who is a follower of a religion asks me to, i pray for them, i appeal to their god on their behalf. If their God exists He will see what is in my heart and know it is love and not a double standard which drives me, and if He does not exist i am doing no-one any harm.

I think that's really nice

[Aimz]

... i don't have a God that challenges, i challenge myself. It is ME who expects better of me, and when life throws it's numerous challenges it is ME i hold responsible for how they come out and MY OWN good i work hard at resolving them for.

I completely agree Hoobley - this reinforces my point of humanity taking credit/responsibility for our own actions without thanking/blaming a particular entity for it.

I am with Niliac in that I wouldn't enter a forum on christianity or hinduism and state my belief system and then ask these members why they believe in god - sparking a debate on religion. I respect others belief systems and I would like my beliefs to also be respected - not questioned or judged - but openly discussed by people who share similar beliefs.