Do you find this insulting?

[NaeNae]

IVF in healthy couples for the sole purpose of twins - do you find it insulting?

Based on what the ACTUAL question is I voted Not insulted. I think for people struggling with conception this is a lovely way to get an instant family particularly for those on their last try IYKWIM

Regardless of what Brad and Ange do - THIS is what the question was and NOT - DO YOU FIND INSULTING IF BRAD & ANGE CONCEIVEDTWINS USING IVF.

C'mon its an easy question - read it properly

[SunnyRain]

I acknowledge that my response to this poll seems heartless and inappropriate when positioned within the TTC forum, and I never would have entered this conversation without an invitation in my email.

I realise I seem to have diminished what you're going through, but actually that was not my intention ...I was merely responding to the question of whether it is insulting or not, as an opinion poll and as a question raised for discussion.

As it happens I don't have that "biological imperative" to procreate. I looked into adoption long before I ever considered having my own biological child. It's irrelevant what my situation is, but it's not the same as most women which puts me not just in the minority but quite possibly out on a limb all by myself. BUT I'm willing to stand by my opinions because they are coming from years and years of consideration which resulted in my knowing that IVF would never be the right choice for me.

That does not mean I am against IVF.

I KNOW adoption is not an easy option so I wasn't being flippant about that. I also know that IVF is incredibly difficult, which is why I said I couldn't do it myself because I couldn't handle it. I could not handle it at all.

BTW: I am nearly 32, married for 5 years and our baby is completely planned.

[Batcoat]

Perhaps if "elective" IVF couples were required to pay for their treatment themselves (no medicare support), the increased revenue could be spent on increasing resources, as well as put towards further study in the field, which could potentially benefit those that have a genuine need of IVF...

That's a very good suggestion Krystie.

[butterfly_warrior]

None of us NEED to be a mother. But that biological urge is there for a reason. If it weren't there, where would the human race be?

Kuraiza, it comes across as an immense judgement on those who have been through or are going through IVF. We don't NEED to be parents, so why the hell do we bother? We bother for the same reason that most people have children.

There are a number of us that are completely ruled out from being able to adopt before we even start. Does this mean we also shouldn't do IVF? Does the fact that I suffer from arthritis and anxiety mean I'm less fit to be a mother than the drug addict who sleeps around but is blessed with the ability to conceive naturally? By the time we wait the years and years that are needed for approval, we'll be too old anyway.

My history and heritage means that intercountry adoption is not for us. I won't go into why that is, as it could easily come across as a judgement on those who pursue that path, and that's something I certainly do not want to do. We sponsor a child in India - but it's simply not enough to satisfy that biological urge to have my own child.

What you have said is as insulting to those of us doing IVF as it would be for us to tell you that you have no need of being a mother so you should give up your own child for adoption. There's no way in hell any of us would dream of doing that, but perhaps that can help you understand why your comments are so hurtful to those on the other side of the fence.

BW

[Rouge]

Can we keep it on track please people. Keep in mind you are talking to real people here, you may be talking about the actions of celebrities, but right here, right now we are talking amongst REAL people. So please lets not enter into a debate (that is only going to end badly I might add) about whether or not IVF is a necessity for those infertile. The question clearly states: IVF in healthy couples for the sole purpose of twins - do you find it insulting?

So lets answer that question, and move on from any further debate that could be even more insulting than the original question.

[lmbmcb]

Hi

I would find this insulting if there were no extenuating circumstances.

For instance if the person just wanted to get double the baby bonus so they could buy a new car or a plasma TV, or thought it would be 'cute' to have twins, this would be very insulting.

However if the circumstances were such as the mother or father had a medical reason that may exclude them from having a second pregnancy, and they really wanted their child to have a sibling, then I wouldn't feel insulted by that.

Just my thoughts
L.B.

[APMC]

Hey I voted I need assisted conception and DO NOT find it insulting

It is none of anyones business what someone else does, really!

I would roll my eyes at these people though, like I do with a lot of parents because I don't agree with what they are doing but I would not find it insulting as that is their choice/right IMO

[Ca Plane Pour Moi]

I have had, thank God, no fertility problems to date, but would not have IVF for twins, despite the fact I would love to have twins.

Why? Because it's a dangerous procedure, what with OHSS and things like that which can occur. Because, so far, I haven't needed it. Because I know if I did need it and was sat next to someone with no problems who just wanted twins for a fashion statement I'd be hurt and upset.

Because once it becomes the norm for healthy women to have IVF to get what they want wrt number of children, maybe it will become the norm for people to have IVF for screening for genetic illness. Then "undesirable" genes, such as those for specific looks (I'd hate to have a daughter who looked like me but not to the extent I'd do genetic screening... but if it were the norm would I still think like that? I'd hope so but how do I know?)

I just think it can be a slippery slope. IVF shouldn't be denied to people, but I believe it should be VERY restricted and made difficult if you don't have fertility problems - as I believe it currently is.

[Diamond75]

I do find it insulting only based on the fact that time/resources are taken away from couples who need it.

I have never had any troubles conceiving nor do I have any desire to have twins so perhaps my opinion would change if this was the case.

To all those going down the IVF path I pray for success.

[dianeandross]

I voted: I need assisted conception and DO find it insulting

I kept changing my mind a little bit reading each different post and yes while I agree with some things said, this is what I personally think:

People who are not infertile and who have not had to undergo IVF do not know what we go through in order to conceive - and could never understand. It is hard emotionally, psychically and financially.

I would think being fertile and doing IVF simply to have twins - would seem like an easy process - what do you care if it doesn't work - you can always go and fall pregnant naturally next month.

For us, infertile people, this isn't the case. Another failed cycle means thousands of dollars down the drain - and no baby to show for it. You don't know if you are going to be one of the lucky 60 odd % that IVF works for - you don't know if it is going to take, 1, 2, 5 or 10 cycles. There is so much unknown.

So I find it insulting because, people look at IVF as an easy way out of achieving a twin pregnancy - I had 2 embryos implanted - and no not a twin pregnancy. There is a higher chance, but it isn't a given - nothing to do with IVF is a given.

[KrissyLee85]

I need assistance with trying to conceive.
I DONT find it INSULTING that healthy couples use IVF to soley have twins, i think its STUPID, would you rather explain to your kids "mummy and daddy love each other very much and you were made in love" or "mummy and daddy love each other very much and you were made in a test tube" i would give anything to be able to have a baby naturally, besides its not even 100% to eggs will take!!

[MumofLewis]

I find it insulting that people think they can buy themselves twins by using IVF when they don't need it. If this was something that was allowed regularly, where would it end? In America when you have IVF they can test the embryos to see the sex. So what would happen to the embryos that are the unwanted sex? it could just spiral out of control.

I did have IVF and think that the resources should be used for those that genuinely need it. Those clinics are busy enough as it is without couples wanting designer babies joining the queues.

[nanananny]

I have double ET's and I will tick I don't find it insulting.

Awesome post, post #58 hollybolly.. says it all for me really

[meow]

Has anyone considered asking or actually asked their fertility specialist for twins?

I know someone who is pregnant with twins at her request after multiple failed attempts at IVF. I think her doctor took some convincing though.

I don't find the idea of fertile people using IVF to have twins insulting- but I wonder why on earth you would want to go through that!

[griffibo]

I feel that the precious lives that are risked and lost through IVF is hard enough to bear for mums, dads, and embies without healthy couples turning the technology into a commercial enterprise akin to Gucci.

Let's be honest though - this is the kind of world we are living in. People are more and more interested in getting what they want, rather than learning to be content with what they've already got.

Bonnie

[dianeandross]

Has anyone considered asking or actually asked their fertility specialist for twins

Its actually a bit harder than asking for it - I know quite a few IVF women who have had 2 embryos transfered - this does not guarantee a twin pregnancy, it doesn't even guarantee a pregnancy. Nothing with IVF is guaranteed.

Yes we had two embryos transfered - not because we specifically wanted twins - although this would obviously be a dream outcome, but because we wanted to achieve a pregnancy. This was our goal. We are lucky enough that our FS doesn't restrict us to only 1 transfered at a time, because our success of a singleton pregnancy, come from a transfer of 2 embryos.

[Rouge]

Great post griffibo!

[kaddie]

I do find it insulting, i have been undergoing IVF treatment for a number of years. I firstly dont understand why someone would choose to under go ivf when they are perfectly fertile.