My 12w Appointment...

[Rouge]

I don't necessarily think its country vs. country (although the british do have a great FREE system as far as I am aware, even free dental for pregnant women and new mums). Moreso hospital vs Dr. With Paris I got a 6 week U/S then another one in two weeks then one at 11 weeks then 18 and 22 weeks. I got pics from the last 3 u/s and videos to take home with commentry & measurements etc. I could see my share care Dr whenever I wanted, I could go into the hospital whenever I wanted (I was public). I would have prefered to see the same dr but that was because I was going public. Next time I will be going private with famous Dr Nick

And I have heard in Aus you can check to see if your private OB has an u/s machine on site (like the ones they use in emergency) and they can do a little check for you at every appt.

I think you can get a high level of care here in Aus you just have to know who to go to and to ask for it.

As Debbie said I think there are definitely pro's and con's for both. For example I know in the US you do not need a referral to see a specialist/ob/gyn/paed etc which I think in some instances is a good thing ie. when you have a screaming baby and you know your dr is being a pain in the butt

Don't get me wrong I think the US has a great medical system but I also think Aus is pretty good too!

*hugs*
Cailin

[Snowgirl]

Interesting discussion, having lived in Oz, UK and US I have to say, Australia has a great system, but when it comes to pregnancies and births they seem a little bit lax.

The UK I would rate as the worst. Sure, they pay, but it takes FOREVER to get to see a doctor. If I ever got sick in the UK I would get on a plane or train and head over to continental Europe.
I had a bladder infection over in the UK and they wouldn't give me an appointment with a specialist for 12 weeks... hello?? I passed out from the pain in the end and was taken to the emergency ward, where the doc on duty asked me after looking at my urine sample, whether I was sure, that I didn't have my period .... (I guess the upside was that, yes, it was paid for, but ... )
My friend from NZ got sick over there and was severly dehydrated and couldn't even walk anymore. No doctor would see her for 3 days, because she wasn't registered. When she kept drifting in and out of consciousness, her friend called me in tears (I was in a skilift in Austria at the time) From my own experience I told her to go to the emergency ward. They did help her there, but why won't a doc see you, when you are in that state is beyond me!
Last but not least a very good friend had really bad headaches. His UK doc told him he was just stressed. He persisted and asked to have a scan when it didn't go away. He kept ringing the hospital over and over and over but no one knew anything. Finally after 6 months he found someone who would have a look at the scan. The specialist called him back and said that he is very sorry but that it turns out he has Hodgkins and if someone had looked at it 6 months ago, he would have a 90% chance of survival (like Delta Goodrem), but that now, unfortunately, he only has 6 months to live. This friend died in February this year.
So, I'm sorry, I can't agree that the UK has a very good system at all. A lot of patience in the UK actually go to Germany and France to have their operations, because the hospitals over there have not enough beds, doctors and theatres to treat everyone. Chances are you die before you get treated if you have something serious.
I personally feel a lot safer in Australia and better taken care of.

Sorry this has turned into such a huge rant but it's a very personal issue for me. I think the Australian system is really quite good. Some public hospitals are in a bit of a sad state, but the doctors are excellent. Sure, it could be improved, but that would cost money and I don't think people are willing to pay more for their medicare. And I like it that if your GP sucks, you can still go to a specialist and pay for him out of your own pocket - but at least someone will see you. - unlike in the UK (though it's usually not that hard to get a referral)

Snowy

[Rouge]

Wow snowy, I had never heard that. Thanks for the info It just goes to show that everyone has a different experience no matter where you are.

*hugs*
Cailin

[Antheia]

Sorry to hear your appointment didn't go as planned Sarah. What a horrible midwife!

I do shared care with my GP and my local hospital and i can't even see the midwife only doctors coz the midwifes don't do shared care at all!

I am lucky though that all my tests (blood, u/s etc) were covered by medicare. But i didn't get them done at the hospital. We have a seperate pathology and u/s place.

Except last time i had a blood test i did get it done at the hospital because before that at the pathology the woman was such a b!tch, she just shoved the needle in me and then moved it around til she found my vein! It hurt like hell.

Anyways, sorry to take up your post, got a little passionate with my winge.

Take care,

[{sarah}]

Must be something about people taking blood at hospitals cos that's exactly what the guy did to me!

[Debbie Lee]

God, I hope I don't need a blood test at the hospital!
Whenever I have got one done at Pathcare or Melbourne Pathology they have always been really gentle and careful. My veins are hard to find in my arm (I am guessing it's cos I have a lot of insulation, lol) so I better not get some rough freak doing one at the hospital! They may end up with a black eye, lol.

[mouse_9_2001]

hey snowy, you must of been at a bad part of UK then because whenever i went to my doctor i didnt even have to make an appointment, and they always saw me then and there and when joshua had to go see his peadatrician (however thats spelt) they had made an appointment to go see one the next week ( this was in manchester) even though hed never been to one before..i thought it was great with my type of care i recieved,and while i was pregnant i got my next appointments at every appointment even for the hospital ones to go see the ob i think it was..

guess it goes to show tthat some people can have bad experiences and some people good, some might be bad here in australia but some could be great too

[Tanya]

Wow this topic has come a long way!!! LOL.
(Onyu Sarah!! LOL)
Tanya

[Debbie Lee]

It sure has Tanya!
I personally think it is so great that we can discuss these issues be it country vs. country, state vs. state or hospital vs. hospital. Either way, we are getting to view a whole bunch of different perspectives. We are informing ourselves so that we know what to expect and what our rights are.
I know that from some of your experiences (esp. yours Sarah) that I can go in armed and at the ready. I hope that when I go in for my first hospital appointment that I can help others aswell.
Whether they like it or not, we have the RIGHT to appropriate and caring hospital and health care. If we don't get that then we have the RIGHT to jump up and down about it. If we know what we should be able to expect from certain visits, we know what we are allowed to question and when to demand respect. Am I making sense?
Knowing me though, I will probably get treated the same way and not say anything because I am too polite 8-[
For example, a friend of mine had a run-in with a very rude Dr. when she was having her daughter. Now, my friend is a very big girl (as am I) and she is under no illusions. Anyway, the Dr. decided to chastize her (while he was doing an internal examination mind you) that she was "Obscenely Obese". Being in a vulnrable position, my friend didn't say anything but was extremely upset about it afterwards. What an arrogant pig! There is such a thing as tact! Honestly! Anyway, from her experience, I know that I have to be brave and if I get some pig say something like that to me, I can demand to see someone else or I can just tell him to shove it!

[Snowgirl]

I was in London (more precisely I lived in Chelsea) ........

btw. statistically the NHS has more people die than any other health system in 1st world countries. I think you were lucky to have such a good experience in England. It's definitely the exception.

sorry, will stop my rant now. it's just been way to personal with the unneccesary death of my friend (who also was in London, not a 'bad part' of England I thought).

[Snowgirl]

Sorry, I said I would let it rest but I just can't. It's been upsetting me all day.

Mouse, I think that's the most insensitive post I have ever read on the BB board. My friend died a horrible death and you suggest that we must have lived in a bad part of England??

I just can't believe that.

[BellyBelly]

snowgirl,

I haven't read the whole thread but I am sorry to read of the death of your friend. It must have been a very difficult time for you, and even now reflecting on that in writing.

I don't think Lesley (Mouse) intended to sound insensitive, she's been a member of BellyBelly for a long time and has been very supportive to all - she has never posted anything nasty or malicious. I think it's a mixture of shock that your friend was treated so badly (when Lesley had only experienced good treatment herself) and also on the internet, things can often come off sounding different or not what they intended.

Maybe it could have been worded better, but I am sure it wasn't intended to upset you at all - just a comment acknowledging that it was bad treatment for your friend, and something you wouldn't normally expect.

I hope this doesn't cause any tension between you girls, you are both great members of BellyBelly and I'm really proud of how well we discuss and deal with issues. It's obviously a sensitive issue and it's always difficult to know what to say when you haven't experienced situations others have been through, particularly death. I know I get totally tongue-tied sometimes when people need support - it's hard to know what to say at times.

We all have different ways of supporting people, often based on our own experiences, and not everyone is always going to word it the right way unfortunately. I know Lesley didn't post that with intention to upset you for the day, or at all.

Snowy - huuuuge :hugs: for you, I do know it must be a difficult thing for you. I hope you are feeling better matey.

[mouse_9_2001]

snowy, i wasnt attrmpting to be insensitive at all, i didt even read past the the first bit so i didnt even know about your friend, yes I should of read the whole thing first I'm very sorry i didnt.

all i was trying to say is that everyone can have different experiences dependign on where they go, in my mind all of england is bad as i cant stand the place and its thanks to that country that i lost my son, which writing that brings me to tears as i fully regret going there if i didnt id still have him here with me..

:hugs: about your friend but as i have tears rolling down my cheeks due to upsetting you and thinking about how much i miss my son im going to end this post now

Lesley

[Snowgirl]

Thanks, Lesley and Kelly for your words. I was just really upset yesterday. And your reply was just .. not what I needed nor expected from such a wonderful group as we have here at BB ... I understand you didn't read the whole post. I think of Jon every day, because he is the reason I'm pregnant now.
Monkey and I had thought of ttc in 2005. But our mind was changed.
When Jon got increasingly worse, he would call us at night from the hospital (cause he knew we're awake trading US stocks at night) when he couldn't sleep and would open up (which was rare for him) and say how much he regretted having postponed having children and that he wished his daugher (1 yr) would know and remember him and that if he had started 5 yrs earlier, she would have.
When we got the call that he had died, Monkey and I hugged and cried and the first thing we said to each other was "Let's have children now". That was February and as you know we fell pregnant in March.
This child will forever be connected with Jon for me, so I might take things quite personal when it comes to the subject.

I can imagine your memories of England aren't the fondest, Lesley, considering they took your child from you and I'm happy for you that at least when it comes to the health care you had a good experience - at least they seem to have good paediatricians (also, no idea how to spell that one). Unfortunately your good experience in that area speaks against the statistics. Aside from the long waiting lists to see a specialist (or have your scan looked at by one), England has the worst cancer survival rate in the westernized world (50% of that of continental Europe or US!!) and the longest waiting lists for radiation therapy. If Jon had been back home in Australia at that time, he would most likely still be alive.

I hope you'll be reunited with your son one day.

Big hug back to you.

Snowy