TTC & Taking Clomid &/Or Metformin ~ Jan/Feb 2008

[TwoMums]

MrsB26 - I'm so sorry AF showed her ugly face!!

If you could imagine that as soon as AF arrives, your brain sends the signal to your ovaries saying that you are not pregnant and to start maturing the next follicle. When you add the clomid earlier it may (or may not) give more than one follicle the signal to grow. So theoretically the sooner you take the clomid (which tricks your brain into producing more FSH which makes the follicles mature) the more likely it is that you will produce more than one follicle.

When you take the clomid later, it only usually has time to signal one follicle to grow big enough to release an egg, and even another follicle might grow, but not big enough to release a mature egg. It normally would start shrinking if the dominant follicle is greedy and takes all the FSH it can to grow to maturity. Survival of the biggest if you like. This happens if you dont take clomid even, that is if you dont have PCOS or any other ovulatory problem

Now if you have PCOS, thats a whole other ball game, which i don't know enough about, but i am gathering that you have alot of little follicles and no dominant follicle, hence no ovulation and the aim of clomid is to mature at least one follicle big enough to release an egg. Maybe in the past, taking it later, the follicle never grew big enough, therefore didn't release a mature egg. So taking the clomid earlier gives it extra time to grow, so that it gets bigger and then releases a mature egg.

Hope that my raving on wasn't too hard to understand.... i confuse my self sometimes....

[MrsB26]

Thanks Twomums. I thought something similar about more follies but i wasnt 100% sure. Yep that definately makes sense. No I dont have PCOS, i am using clomid as a hormone booster and a cycle regulater.

Well something is definatley going on earlier this time, started the bloating and niggles all ready..................time will tell

[TwoMums]

I have edited that last post about 5 times....lol.... might pay to read it again!!

This cycle Kim took 100mg Clomid from day 2-5 and she got two equal sized follicles!

The cycle we got pregnant was 100mg clomid day 2-5 she got three!!! The scan at day 11 showed she had an 18mm follicle and a 12mm on one side and a 18mm one on the other side. So we were freaking out about having triplets!! But it is most likely that by day 14 (Day of Insemination) the 12mm did not continue to grow to maturity, and therefore she probably only released two eggs. That was the cycle she got pregnant (With one baby!)..

Kim has had cycles where she only got one follicle, mainly when she was on 50mg... and because she never got pregnant on the 50mg, and has had cycles where she didn't fall pregnant on 100mg with two follicles, we just take the 100mg and hope to get two each time and pray for the golden egg (and hopefully only get one baby - but if we get two.... oh well, not fussy at this stage!)

We are currently on 8dpo today... creeping closer to testing time!!!

[AJC]

Hi Everyone

You all have such amazing stories and I really hope I see some BFP's next to your names soon.

I'm starting my first cycle of clomid tomorrow - day 2. Am a little nervous about the side effects but I figure a little moodiness etc is nothing compared to holding a healthy bub in my arms (fingers crossed). Not sure what to expect over this first month so I'll probably be full of questions..... hope y'all don't mind.

[MrsB26]

TwoMums Oh the wonders of the tww, sending you ladies some positive vibes

AJC Welcome - another novocastrian!! Ask away, i have only just joined this group also but i have been taking clomid for 5 cycles. I get some side effects but mainly headaches, bloating and mood swings (watch out lol!). Good luck with your journey

[Mel A]

Well i'm back in the game.
AF turned up today, so were back TTC after our M/C. 100mg day 2-6 the DTD every 36hrs day 10-18.

cross fingers we don't have to wait that long...

[DrGirl72]

Hi Everyone, I am CD10 of my first cycle using clomid (took it days 3-7 at 25mg a day). Its been prescribed to try to help with a short luteal phase. I have my first transvaginal uss on tuesday (CD14) which i'm terrified about and had my first accupuncture session yesterday with someone who sepcializes in fertility treatment. Earlier in this thread Hollye9188 said that clomid interferes with opk's. Does anyone know how this works? I use opks as the main way of telling when to do an insemination (my female partner and I are using a known donor) and if they didn't work then not sure how we'd work out the timing. Any thougths greatly appreciaited, thanks

[[M]umma[M]ia]

hey,

yes i have been told by many docs, FS and gynos that clomid can interfere with opk's. Im not to sure why this is but i have always been told while on clomid its a waste of time to do home opk's and to go get the bloodtest done at day 21. This did work for me coz i have done opk's and they never said i was "o". but when i went for my bt, i did "o" and now im 8 weeks pregnant.

Please dont take this as "dont u dare do opk's". Its just wat i have been told and i wanted to share it with you all..

I have a good feeling about Kim.. let us know what happens!!!!

take care all

ps. sorry drgirl, i didnt read ur post propley. Im not too sure how u would work out the actual day for insemination. If you get a positive reading from an opk, the only choice u have is to go with that. I have no idea coz day 21 would be too late for you, unless u have a bt and ur doc can tell you around what day u "o" coz of ur readings or something?? omg im prob not making any sense. hope all goes well

[TwoMums]

Hey DrGirl72, I would say that you need to either a) have a monitored cycle with a trigger injection to pinpoint ovulation or b) inseminate every second day with fresh sperm from days 10-18 if possible...

I would have thought that day CD14 would be cutting it fine if you have a short LP, but i guess if you go in on day 14 and you are fairly close to ovulating you can inseminate then and then 36 hrs later.... but what if you have already ovulated by day 14. i would have thought you would ovulate by day 14 or at least on day 14 if you have a short LP... spose that depends on how long your cycle is..

IMHO...If you are having an ultrasound, that IS pretty much a monitored cycle, ie. Checking for follicle growth etc... and therefore you may as well trigger when you are close to natural ovulation (have a blood test to confirm) with the HCG injection, saves the guess work... It may be ok for hetro couples not to trigger coz they can just keep on having sex with each other until they are sure ovulation has occurred... but it really depends on how many times you want to inseminate, plus how many times your donor wants to donate per cycle....

The reason why Kim and I have monitored cycles with trigger injection is so we can pinpoint exact ovulation because we have an unknown donor and the sperm is cleaned and frozen for IUI.... we need to pinpoint ovulation with frozen sperm because it doesnt last as long as fresh sperm... you guys have the benefit of fresh sperm, but you also want to sort of pinpoint ovulation a little bit i guess because who wants to inseminate every couple of days for a week with a donor...i dont know, you may, but i wouldn't....

Oh and MelA - Bugger, bugger, bugger.... good luck this cycle! We'll be here to egg you on....get it....egg you on!!! LOL

PS... Kim has sore boobs, extremely sore nipples and she felt sick after eating dinner last night (i didn't) and she feel asleep on the couch by 8pm, she had all the same symptoms last time she was pregnant... although those symptoms started around 10dpo last time. Last night she was 8dpo and today is 9dpo and tomorrow she is 10dpo...ok well you get the point...still counting LOL!

[DrGirl72]

Thanks Hollye9188 and TwoMums.
Re OPKs, my understanding is that they detect the LH surge and that clomid block oestrogen therefore increasing fsh. i vaguely know that fsh levels are related to the timing of the LH surge but i cannot work out how the lh surge would be blocked or whatever to stop a +opk. Anyway any more ideas very welcome, otherwise i will ask my dr on tues.

Re insemination timing.... I have a relatively long follicular phase and usually ovulate between CD 17 and CD21, have a 27-30 day cycle with a 9-11 day luteal phase. I don't know (and maybe someone else can tell me) whether having clomid (CD 3-7) is likely to shorten the follicular phase and therefore make ovulation earlier? I make have to chat with our donor re doing more inseminations over a longer time if we are not going to be able to rely on opks. Will also ask dr re trigger shot, thanks twomums for that... Does trigger shot need to come from fs or do general obstetricians prescribe them??? thanks again, girldoc

[TwoMums]

DrGirl72 - Clomid should make your follicle grow faster therefore getting to the size needed to ovulate quicker, but the trigger shot also helps the final maturisation of the egg as well. As far as i know only your FS can give you HCG for the trigger.

[[M]umma[M]ia]

hey

Megan - they are very promising signs because thats how i felt i started getting tired from about 7dpo..but i just assumed i was getting sick or i was just lazy?!? well it turned out i was preggas and now just over 8 weeks..

Gooooooooooooooood LUCK!!!

[AJC]

Thanks for the welcome MrsB26!

Was hoping to see some more BFP's in here by now, hope everyone is going well.

I've just finished my first round of Clomid cd6 today so my fifth & final tablet went down with brekkie. Am ok - not sure if the side effects only come when you are actually taking the tabs or for the whole cycle. Not sure if I'm just really sensitive to it all but have just felt a little dizzy if I get out of bed suddenly or am crouching down and jump up to quickly. Have sort of had a little niggling headache too but again that could be because I'm sensitive to it and am "looking" for symptoms. Not sure what to expect this month. Temp has been higher than usual and all over the place. My follow up appointment with doc is not until 21 April though, which would be cd32 - so if I O earlier than normal (usually cd18) then that appointment might be too late - what if he wants to increase dosage for next cycle??? I think I'll call and address the issue sooner rather than later.

Am going to use OPK's this cycle (don't usually work for me) so will be interesting to see how I go there. Doc actually recommends to use them. Have heard some people say that they don't work when using Clomid so - I guess all of our bodies are so different? Who knows.

Twomums: how is Kim? Hope it's a BFP for you both this month.

DrGirl72 - was interesting what you were saying about opk's. Did you ask your doc?

take care everyone.

[DrGirl72]

Well I survived my first transvaginal ultrasound and as others on this site have said, i agree that it was easier than a pap smear! In fact once it was in we were all so focussed on the screen looking at follicle size that i didn't worry too much about what was happening elsewhere! The left ovary had nothing much in the way of follicles but the right had a clearly dominant good sized one plus about three that were only 8-10cm. Dr thinks i have either just ovulated or am just about to- which is early for me (toaday is CD14 and usually ovulate CD 17-21, guess its the clomid!). So have just messaged the donor and we will do an insemination tonight... but we may have in fact missed the egg. Am trying not to feel bad re. this and see this first clomid cycle as a bit of an experiment.

I did ask dr re opks and clomid... he said they should still work, only thing is if you use them when in the days you took clomid u could get a false positive but that a week after finishing clomid should be ok and as they usually work for me he said to definitely keep using them. So did one straight after the appt , about midday and got a clear positive! so just perhaps we haven't missed that egg (plus my temp was still low this am!) Babydust to you all, Girldoc

[AJC]

Girldoc - thanks for letting me know what doc said. Good luck and I really hope you haven't missed the egg this month. I don't think you've missed it if your temp is still down and you got +OPK.

I was kind of looking at this month as an experimentation month too - I usually O cd18 so am glad you mentioned that you had O'd earlier. Obviously all of our bodies are different but it's just so great to speak to someone who is going through the same thing.

Spoke too soon about side effects, feeling yuk this afternoon. Mild nausea like I've just got off a merry go round or something. I felt a little off yesterday afternoon too but thought I was reading into things too much but today is definite nausea. Hopefully that means its working. If it gets too bad or hangs around I think I will call my doc just to make sure that all is ok.

[Miss K]

Hey Ladies,
I started a thread in conception and was pointed in this direction

I am on my second cycle of clomid now AF arrived last thursday and it has been EXTREMELY heavy up until today it has eased off but I am now feeling really light headed like I am about to pass out... Is this a normal effect of clomid ? Has anyone experienced this before I am only on 50mg just a little concerned atm I also started dry reaching on thursday and was feeling terrible!

I wish you all the best

[DrGirl72]

AJC- I agree that its so great to be able to connect with others going through the same thing.

Re clomid side effects, I didn't notice anything in the days I was taking it (CD 3-7) but by about CD 11 started with hot flushes, sore BBs and now a bit of nausea. Dr said this is all probably from the clomid.. hope they don;t last too much longer
I've also been a bit moody but according to my parnter no different from my normal moodiness!

[DrGirl72]

whoop sorry Miss K forgot to say welcome to this thread, but sorry can't help re. AF being heavy as i'm just on my first cycle of clomid. however, it is my understanding that if you don't ovulate your AF is meant to be lighter than if you do. So if you then taek clomid and start to ovulate then AF can be much heavier.. its not so much related to the dose of clomid but rather at what particular dose you ovulate (thats if you are taking it to induce ovulation!) Hope this makes some sense!