Wow, great thread.

I am concerned about the concept that women have pain in childbirth because of eve's 'fall'. It seems like a patriarchal oppression of women through the physiology of their bodies. The idea that god says women must feel pain seems to deny us the opportunity to experience child birth beyond pain- which I believe I did achieve. To think that birth=pain plays into medical intervention and the paternal model of care we have today.

I would be interested to hear if Muslims also take this view on childbirth.

As for evolution, I am ok with a creationist idea that god created all things, but I do believe evolution has occurred...whether god is responsible for that doesn't matter to me...evolution of animals seems logical to me.

I have rejectEd a lot of my Christian upbringing so I hope not to offend anyone. The discussion so far has been awesome.