Hope - welcome and I am so sorry for the loss of your precious angel boys.
Sweetie, a loss is a loss. You still have to deal with grief, bereavement,and loss of your dreams, irrespective of when a loss occurs. In my view the stage of the loss determines only some different physical aspects to confront but the grief is a common burden, irrespective of timing. Find the courage within yourself not to minimise your losses. A friend of mine whose baby was still born at 39 weeks gave me that advice when my daughter Amelia was born at 22 weeks gestation. I remember saying at the time that my loss could not compare with hers, and she was so generous in the advice she gave. In truth her advice was a gift. I couldn't really understand her advice initially, but now I have come to embrace it, especially as other parents share the experiences of their grief. Whilst each person walks their own grief journey there are some common threads. Ianna has done a really good summary of the possible causes and treatment options of recurrent miscarriage. I will post the link later in this message for you. I found it really helpful. You might too - it might be a springboard to ask your Ob more questions... aspirin is not the only treatment option for concerns about clotting. Some people are prescribed heparin, but it is administered by injection and does result in quite severe bruising. I am not medically trained and there will be other reasons for heparin to be prescribed or not. Asprin is much easier to administer. I discussed the option of another medication for clotting with a Dr that I consulted for a second opinion. I can't remember what it was but it began with "C", I think clexane. I was given reasons why clexane was preferable for me at the time over heparin and asprin, but I didn't end up needing that treatment. I can't offer anything to you in relation to progesterone levels... maybe someone else can?
I hope your TCC journey now is relatively quick...... I have a friend who has been diagnosed with an enzyme imbalance which affects her ability to conceive. I can't remember what its called. I will have to ask her. It was discovered inadvertently, but confirmed via blood tests at specific days of her cycle. She has seen an endocrinologist about it. Apparently there is treatment that might assist with her conception chances. She has been TCC for 5 years with 2 m/c and has attempted IVF, FET, traditional chinese medicine, changing her work. Her DH also has some sperm health issues. I only share my friends experiences as it might give you something else to ask about. Knowledge is power.
Teni - glad you have come to some sort of happy resolution.
Susie - no offence taken! And, thankyou for your kind words.
Angelic, Chez, Blessed, Gigi - hiya - thinking of you. Congrats to the escapees - cmegelles, charli and crumpet.
Dory: Thankyou for your condolences and a huge thankyou for all that you said. You have no idea how lovely it was to read your post. It is so hard as sometimes you do feel like you have no one to turn to, especially when it isn't a known happening. The link that you posted for me to look at was great. I actually copied and printed it so I can take some notes to know what other things I can ask OB when I see him.
Your right, it is called Clexane. I had to take this once before when I had a DVT. It is also administered by injection into the abdomen. I did not know you could take this while pregnant, maybe that is something I need to look into a little further.
Thankyou also for the info on your friend. There are so many possibilities. I think that sometimes you just take what the OB tells you and leave it at that. These forums are such a great idea for people in similar situations to be able to bounce off of each other. that the TTC journey isn't too long and has a great outcome, not only for me but for anyone else TTC.
I am new to this thread, although I have been reading along for a few weeks. I thought it was probably time for me to take the plunge and introduce myself.
DH and I have been TTC since June ’06. We have been pregnant 6 times, but unfortunately we have lost them all at 5 weeks (the last one was April 20th). We started a little late in life (38 in ’06). Unfortunately this has become a catch-all answer for our doctors (with no scientific investigation mind you) . Thankfully, we have been able to find (on our own) an RE that is willing to look for a medical cause beyond my ‘advanced maternal age’.
Dory – the link you provided to Hope was extremely helpful to me as well. My RE poo-poo’d the immune causes as being unsubstantiated/controversial, however he did agree that if the ‘traditional’ testing came back clean, then he would be willing to investigate the less conventional causes. In the meantime, I’m using transdermal progesterone 2 DPO through to AF since my mid-cycle progesterone is on the low side of normal. This may not be the cause, but it certainly can’t hurt. I am a little hesitant, however, about the aspirin for possible clotting issues since I tend to bruise/bleed fairly easily. The RE did a thrombophillia panel, as well as karyotyping on me and DH, so we’ll see what that says when the results come back.
Hope – You may want to check out the book ‘From Hormone Hell to Hormone Well’. I found it to be extremely helpful and they talk about supplemental progesterone use (among other things).
Although I wouldn’t wish this on my worst enemy, I’m so glad to have found a group of women who understand what DH and I are going through. Many well-meaning family and friends have inadvertently said some hurtful things. “At least it happened early” is one I particularly hate, as though I had no right to grieve. These children were real to us. They are not interchangeable. They are not disposable. If we are ever lucky enough to have a living child, it will not erase or replace the children we have lost.
I’m so happy to have found this group. I really look forward to getting to know all of you better and to support each other through this stressful time.
Hope - you are most welcome. In a way for me, when I help someone it's as if the legacy of my angels lives on and that I honour them in doing so. For me in my journey, I have no answers, and a lot of possibilities crossed off the list! So it's good that nothing is "wrong" but it also means there is nothing to "fix". Just a wing and a prayer for me.... until I find something else to chase down a rabbit hole.
We each have to find our own way, and that also includes finding a way to navigate the plethora of information out there and whether and how it relates to our own circumstances. It takes courage to research and find information and then ask questions of your Dr's. It doesn't mean you respect them any less, just means you are trying to inform yourself and find your way through. Talking about books, I also read " Is your body baby friendly" by Dr A Beer. Mostly about reproductive immunology. I am going to try and hunt down the book that Chris suggested. I am sure it was clexane because I remember asking why not heparin or asprin and hadn't really heard of it being used in pregnancy either. Wish I could remember better.
How did you BT's come back?
Chris - welcome. I agree with you totally. Each of your babies was unique and deserving of your love and grief. I am also coming to believe that for most people, there is no such thing as a replacement baby. It mght apply in circumstances where there is diagnosed or undiagnosed mental illness, such that cognition and perceptions are distorted. It might have been a hot topic for the social science for a while, but it doesn't seem to feature that prominently in the literature anymore from what I see when I scan through it. It seems though "pop psychologists" ie every day people, have picked it up and run with it. They just don't realise how demeaning the concept is.
People, whilst well intentioned, can just be so insightless and insensitive at times. But I was probably once one of those fortunate insightless ones. It takes a very special person who hasn't experienced loss of a baby to have an inkling of what its like. It's why groups like BB, in my mind are so important. The women here are so wise, hard earnt sadly, and understanding. I hope you find the support you need during your stay here - hopefully it's a short one. ( We can all but hope and dream huh?)
Your journey sounds harrowing. Whilst I think "advanced maternal age" can be a factor, I think it is also used as an excuse not to pursue other investigations, I suppose as you have found out. A friend of mine has had both of her babies now aged 3 and 1 and at least one of her miscarriages over the age of 40. I was seeing a gyno/ob/FS who used to quite often raise "advancing maternal age" with me, even when I was in my late 20's!. I understand why, but it used to bug me. My current ob/fs has never once raised it. Wise man this new ob.
Glad you found a reproductive endocrinologist to help you out. The field of reproductive immunology is controversial to say the least! But at least there is some "acceptance" of it, even if as a last resort. I am going to read that book you suggested. Thanks.
I know this is left field, but if you bruise easily, have you thought about having your platelet level tested? It can contribute to bruising easily, if low apparently. I do know what you mean about being hesitant about asprin.
Anyway, I had best better go. I have promised myself ( well cajouled mainly) to venture to the "outside" today. I am going to treat myself to a hot drink. I know I promised myself I would do it on Monday, and every day since.... but today I know I can do it!
Oh some other left field news from me - yesterday I decided to take the plunge and call Adoption Services. I have been thinking about it for a while and have "almost called a few times" this past 2 or 3 weeks. Anyway, I did yesterday. Of course the person wasn't available and I then got cold feet, really worried about what I had done. Anyway, she called back today. I need to fill out an application form and send it back. After that it might take 22 ( YES 22!!) weeks for them to get back to me. In their defence I suppose they do have to check records and get records from archives and then pour over them. Anyway, what I am really interested in is, not my biological family, but my care from the time I was born 9 weeks prem to when I was adopted 3 months later. I would have been in NICU and had a host of nurses and doctors caring for me, and then I was transferred to a home for babies. I have been to the home, but it was inadvertent. I went there for a conference for work (it's not a home for wards of the state anymore obviously) and ended up getting trapped in the toilet for about 20 mins.... LOL, me and toilets. It's weird to think that people who had so much to do with my survival for the first 3 months of my life on the outside are complete strangers to me. I suppose I realise now just how lucky I am to have had the care I did at that time. When I spoke about getting cold feet? I panicked thinking that maybe my biol family had put in a request for contact..... and I hadn't considered that. Still haven't really but at least now I can think about it and prepare, if it's there.
Dory – Thanks so much for the welcome and your support. It’s good to know that people really are having children past 40. DH and I were prepared for the probability that it would take us longer to conceive because of our age, but we never once thought about miscarriage until it began happening. Strangely enough, the only year we didn’t conceive since starting our journey was the year we sought ‘medical assistance’ (clomid and IVF). Go figure...
I am interested in the Beer book you mentioned. I read several of his articles online and checked out his website. I’ll have to make sure I read it before the ‘traditional’ test results come back so I’ll be prepared to talk to the RE if they come back ‘normal’. Also, good point about the low platelets. I never really thought about what might be causing my extreme bruising. I’ll mention it to the RE when I see him next.
Good luck with your information search (here’s hoping you find only what you’re looking for). I also hope you got out the other day for that hot drink! I had to laugh when I read that initially - we are sweltering here in Raleigh. I think we skipped spring and shot straight into summer. Had to remind myself that you’re moving on towards winter where you are.
Chris - funny you should mention that (a) the impact of medical intervention and (b) hot drinks. My GF has had the least amount of success in her tcc journey with clomid, IVF. Her 2 pregnancies have been spontaneous. Poor blossom hasn't had a BFP for 2 years. Not sure where she's at in her head space at the moment re more IVF etc. She also told me about teh condition she has chronic adrenal hyperplasia (CAH). I am yet to hear how her followup appointment went, but am waiting with baited breath and just praying that for her there is a plan that will give some hope. About the hot drinks - I drink them in any weather, cold or hot. They have long been my treat to myself. I am off the caffeine at the moment though, and boy do I miss it. My DH told me this morning he didn't know how I drank my drinks so hot, because when he tried, he scalded his mouth and it hurrt For sunny Queensland, Aust, it has been quite cool overnight. Got to 7 celcius (about 44 farenheight) - I suppose it might be warmer in the house if we actually shut some windows and turned on a heater ( no central heating here).... I remember being in Detroit when it was snowing, and wanting to have the windows open. We tried but they were painted shut! LOL. Crazy Queenslander thing, or maybe it's just us. I didn't realise you were from Raleigh NC, and when I did, I just imagined that lovely accent. Hope it's not too hot for you today.
cTenibear - how are you doing? You've been quiet-ish for you. Hope that means you are feeling strong and postive and not in need of as much support or company at the mo.
SuSie Q- thinking of you
Chez - thinking of you too. We took my aunt "Big Chez" out of dinner on the weekend to Japanese. She was a bit outside her comfort zone but I think she might go again. She seemed to really like the look of the Shabu Shabu banquet ( is that the one where you cook your own at the table in a hot pot?)
Aries, Angelic and Hope - thinking of you. Hoping you're doing ok.
Sending lots of love to the divine "C" escapees - cmeggles, Charli and Crumpet.
Sending Gigi my love.
And sending lots of love and "sleep" to the women who give us hope - Beata.
Sorry if I have missed anyone.
Last edited by dory; May 14th, 2010 at 10:05 AM.
: addition
Chris, just to give you hope I have had 2 children past the age of 40. Mind you I have had 8 miscarriages between the two of them and then another 1 since. I am now 46 and still hopeful of just one more sticky baby. I have had every m/c test they could think of and a lap/hysteroscopy/HSG and everything came back clear. I treid clomid 2 yrs ago and it did nothing. So we went back to TTC au naturel.
Hope, welcome to the group and I hope you find support and information here as well.
Hope and ChrisW - welcome to our thread. I am sorry for your losses. No matter what the time, any loss is hard. I have found the most supportive group of ladies in this thread and hope you find the same experience.
Hi to Aries, SuzieQ, angelic, blessed, samcougar and everyone else.
Well I dearly wanted to post that I was #4 of the Cs but AF arrived on Thursday morning. The day after we had seen the FS so it was off to the clinic for a b/t for me for Day 1. It did catch me a bit by surprise and was thinking I would have another 5 to 7 days before AF would arrive (and secretly I was hoping that we were pg anyway).
The FS was enthusiastic about doing some monitored/supported natural cycles before moving onto IVF. Last time we saw her - 2 years ago - there was no discussion about that as an option. It seems Ryan's pg has at least given her some hope that we can fall pg naturally as well. I was relieved as I wasn't prepared mentally to start with the injections although it looks like I will be doing some progesterone support post O with these monitored cycles. I had a really bad headache on Day 1 and day 2, bordering on migraine like because of nausea. It's still hanging around today but not as bad. I think this is oestrogen withdrawal as I used to get it occasionally when I was on the pill, but usually from about day 3 or 4. Along with that I have had a huge emotional reaction to going back to the FS that has caught me by surprise. I feel a bit like we have gone backwards and really have very little hope that we can fall pg using IVF but I also know the stats show that we have 2 to 3 times better odds of an IVF conception than natural. Anyway, I am going to move forward as this is what we decided we are going to do. The difference this time around I keep telling myself is that the FS is going to be working with my TCM therapist so we will have a collaborative approach - hopefully the best of eastern and western medicine.
Anyway, that's enough rambling from me. I hope everybody is well. Sending everyone lots of
Cheryl, Sorry AF arrived hun.
Hope the FS's new attitude and change in circumstance due to Ryan's existance is all that is needed hun. Good Luck and thinking of you xoxo
Still lurking everyone. love to all, new and oldies!
Angelic - wow girl! You have my wholehearted CONGRATULATIONS. My theory is to take the good whilst we can and when we have it!
I know it's hard to get excited with your journey being so hard and heartbreaking up to this date. Hoping this is the turnaround BFP for you. Hoping this bub is well and truly sticky... Sending you all my love and strength. You can do it. Lots of positive belly rubs..... you know when I first read your post, I thought you meant OPK's lines... LOL. I am really really happy for you and have to say I have a good feeling today.
Chez - bugger ole AF.
Sam - I am loving the addition of a feline fur baby to your household! What did you call your little cat warmer? Winter is the best time for cats - they are so snuggly, if only because they want to use us as heaters.
Teni - Oh sweetie. Is it usual for SD ( Scotty Duck) to be turning you down? I know he's having his own internal struggles at the moment based on what you've posted previously. I know on the rare occassions I have been turned down, it's usually for a pretty good reason, like illness or tiredness. It's always been a big shock to the system to get turned down as my DH always seems to be keen.... I don't know how to help.... I suppose the candles leading up to a luscious you didn't do the trick? What about a racy stint in the great outdoors? Just be careful, don't want you guys getting caught for lewd behaviour... or caught on some cctv and uploaded to utube or something. That would be a real downer.
Chris W - how are you doing?
Hope - you've been quiet since your post - are you ok? How are you doing. Sending you some cyber hugs.
Aries - wotcha up to?
The big news for me today, is yesterday I taught myself how to cast off and cast on in knitting. I did have DH read the instructions just to make sure I was on the right track... can't believe he sat down with me and genuinely read a knitting book. I wonder what my pay back will be? My next goal is to do a particular stitch. I have tried it but really muffed it up. Will just have to keep trying. I think I know what I am doing wrong - just have to see. I know it doesn't sound like much, but it represents something I have achieved for myself. Apart from that, have been feeling a bit glum because I can't otherwise do too much for myself or around the house. Have a few strategies to get myself over the hump. Will see how they pan out.
Blessed - you're welcome.... I wanted you to know we were still thought of and loved, even if you weren't posting. No fairweather friends here girl. Same for you Gigi. It always lights up my day when I see your green coloured font on a post.
Last edited by dory; May 18th, 2010 at 01:25 PM.
: Addition
Angellic... big Congratulations to you. Hope you keep going good and strong. Goodluck and all hope is with you. I have no doubt you will make it through. xoxo H&H preg for you.
Angelic - WOOHOO Congratulations to you! I know those two lines are just one step in your journey but they are such a huge, momentous step. STICKY STICKY VIBES to you.
ChrisW and Hope - welcome to you both. I really really hope your stay is short - maybe really short for you ChrisW if AF stays away this week!!
Dory - well done on the knitting front! When I was preg with DS I had a bit of time on my hands after taking early mat leave and managed to knit a very cute hat for him. I then started a lovely cardi but never got round to finishing it - definitely a step up in difficultly from the hat! Knitting is very on trend Dory!!!
Samcougar - would love to hear what you call your cat. When I was a kid - we lived on a property and ended up looking after so many dumped cats who then had kittens etc etc that I think all up we probably had over 30 cats over 10 years. Most of them were called after rock groups or football stars when named by us in our teens....poor things! After 25 years mum is on her last cat - or so she says. She is 17!!
Chez - sorry your AF arrived. She seriously sucks when she arrives....fingers crossed for this month
Tenibear - good luck with getting DH to BD....a few candles, sexy lingerie....couldn't possibly say no!!
Hello to everyone else. Good luck TTC'ing.
Now its time for my own pity party. At this point I would love to actually just BD at all!!! I kid you not that with all the problems I had with my preg and since then with all my bleeding etc I think I can count the number of times this year on two hands. How depressing is that!!! Arrgghhh. I am so sick of this. I am seeing my gyno again on Fri but I just feel as though there is something wrong. After D&C, bleed for 5 days and was nearly finished when I started bleeding heavily again. Spoke to my gyno who said he thought it was my period! I didn't even know you could get your period so soon after D&C since they scrape the lining (will talk to him about that again). However, my temps actually agree with that - go figure. So now 6 days later it has nearly stopped again but I am getting lots of mucousy discharge (Sorry TMI). Also feel very tender. So no BD'ing at the moment as I am worried something is wrong. Of course I google and make myself feel worse with all sorts of complications that could happen. At this stage not feeling very positive about ever getting UTD.
TO top it all off there were so many heavily preg ladies down the shopping centre this morning - obviously all just on mat leave - that I barely managed to hold it together before I got home. I should be about ready to pop....it just hurts so much some days.
Hopefully I will be more positive my next post....just needed a vent.
that the TTC journey isn't too long and has a great outcome, not only for me but for anyone else TTC.
. Thankfully, we have been able to find (on our own) an RE that is willing to look for a medical cause beyond my ‘advanced maternal age’.
For sunny Queensland, Aust, it has been quite cool overnight. Got to 7 celcius (about 44 farenheight) - I suppose it might be warmer in the house if we actually shut some windows and turned on a heater ( no central heating here).... I remember being in Detroit when it was snowing, and wanting to have the windows open. We tried but they were painted shut! LOL. Crazy Queenslander thing, or maybe it's just us. I didn't realise you were from Raleigh NC, and when I did, I just imagined that lovely accent. Hope it's not too hot for you today. 
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