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Thread: Baby Lost - Heart Broken (Factor V Leiden responsible)

  1. #91
    Melinda Guest

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    Hey Sarah,

    After my first m/c, I too found it too hard to interact with people - it felt too hard. It was upsetting to see people with babies or who were PG, but I just felt that I didn't have the strength to have an 'ordinary' conversation with people at the time. I really put it down to being in the thick of grief. Grief does a variety of things to people and I think that a lot of the time it's a natural thing to retreat into your own world for a while - kind of like an animal licking it's own wounds IYKWIM? Sometimes you need to spend a bit of time on your own in order to come to terms with what you have been through. In the long term, it's not good if you still feel that you can't interact with people though.

    I can tell you that I have been a long term sufferer of depression and it is positively awful. Can I ask what your gut feel is on the situation? What is your heart telling you? If you really feel deep within yourself that you simply aren't coping, then of course you should seek help. If you feel that you are coping and can find some enjoyment and happiness in things (like going to the movies with Rowan as you said) but of course are still feeling an immense sense of loss, then perhaps it is grief as opposed to depression. It's always best to err on the side of caution with depression however and I think it's fantastic that you have people around you who are aware of this issue. You will probably be the best judge as to how you really feel about this issue at the end of the day, but I think at this stage you are handling yourself incredibly well - you're getting out of the house and exercising (which is particularly great as it helps clear the mind and it's definitely something that is good for you if you suffer depression) as opposed to locking yourself away from the world entirely.



    Don't worry that you aren't handling yourself in the best possible way - if you feel that you need some space and time to yourself or just with Rowan right now, then that's exactly what you should do. Getting out of the house however as you say to go for walks is fantastic and I highly recommend that you keep it up. I guess what I'm suggesting is that in the long term it's not good if you feel that you can't converse with people, but right now, you need to look after yourself and it's only natural when you're grieving to retreat a little bit. If you start to find yourself not wanting to leave the house at all - not to go for a walk, not to do the grocery shopping or you just find yourself feeling lower and lower, then you really should seek help as it may well be depression. There can be a very fine line and I can't emphasise enough that if you feel within yourself that you are depressed, that you should talk to somebody about it as it's better to address it now rather than let it progress to a point where it's even harder IYKWIM? I'm not sure if any of this has helped at all - at the end of the day yes, it could be that you are depressed, or it could be part of your grieving process and perhaps sitting down and thinking about how you really feel within yourself, and perhaps talking to Rowan a bit about it may help you figure out the best step to take next.

  2. #92

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    Hi Tootie,

    Thanks for that. I am sorry that you have had a long stuggle with depression. So has my mum which makes it scary for me i think.

    Until yesterday and Jacki said that she thought she should keep an eye on me i thought i was doing ok. Like i said i am enjoying some things about my life. I still love my husband and enjoy his company. We do talk about things other than Katelyn but its just that i dont have much else to talk about at the moment because this is my whole world. We do talk about work and other things though.

    The way i looked at it before yesterday was that i knew that it wasnt good that i didnt want to see people but to be honest i didnt really focus on it because i am happy to be at home or go out with Rowan, it is more relaxing for me in this environment. I think it is more of a safety issue and i dont want to deal with other peoples grief reactions to what has happened. If i dont let other people in they cant hurt me IYKWIM so i have created a barrier without realising or wanting that to happen. People can be cruel and i have had enough bad remarks to not want to experience anymore.

    I really feel "ok" most of the time. I do feel like i am coping pretty well considering what i have been through. Katelyn's birth was extremely traumatic. I also think that one day soon i will kind of give myself permission to be fully happy again a little bit at a time. I guess i have lost Katelyn who was so important that i kind of feel like i should be grieving for her. She shouldnt even be born yet. I also feel that when i get pregnant with a new baby i will have something happy to focus on in my future which will help me to interact with people again. I am ok at work, i say hello and goodbye to the other staff and i can discuss work things quite well when the need is there. I can talk to clients as if nothing has happened. Even yesterday we had a tradesman come over to our house and he asked me when i was going to give my dad some grandkids and i managed to tell him very briefly that we had just lost Katelyn but i didnt cry or anything, i thought i handled it pretty well i acknowledged her existence but managed to keep it all together. Im not on the verge of tears all the time, i can think about Katelyn and not feel absolute despair over whats happened to her, i think that i am starting to accept that this has happened and i will feel this way about her for the rest of my life. I can cry at the drop of a hat if i need or want to but im not that way all day everyday. But i feel that it is very hard to concentrate on work when i have access to this site etc.

    I do smile and laugh but there is a sadness in my heart for Katelyn but i think that will always be there.

    It scares me that other people think that i am depressed though, it kind of makes you doubt yourself.

    I dont know if i am describing myself very well here but i just think that i miss my daughter but i am ok.

  3. #93
    Melinda Guest

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    Hey Sarah,

    You have described yourself very well indeed. That's always a very positive sign as well as things can often become rather hazy when you're feeling a bit depressed and it can be very hard to accurately describe how you truly feel. You sound as though you are very in touch with your feelings and emotions which is great.

    You are right, people can be cruel. I understand the need to try and protect yourself a little bit right now and that's fine. I think where you do that in the longer term it can be detrimental however because it can be an indication that you're perhaps not doing quite so well. Quite often other people notice things about the way that you react and respond to situations and you didn't realise yourself how you were behaving, that's why I suggested perhaps talking to Rowan about it as he can perhaps shed some light on it for you. Sometimes other people can sense things aren't right, but you yourself continue to plug away and ignore the issues. It doesn't sound to me like you are ignoring anything though as I can tell that you are doing what you can to continue on your grieving journey and to do what you need to do IYKWIM.

    Try not to doubt yourself despite the suggestion being made to you about depression - it's great that there are people out there looking out for you and raising this issue as it's just so important and there can be a very fine line between grief and depression sometimes as I said in my last post. I can see what you mean however that it has made you doubt yourself and that you feel that perhaps you're not coping as you should, but try not to look at it that way, i.e. try to look at it as Jacki looking out for you and opening the door for discussion on the issue with her further if you feel that you are progressing down that path. In any event, it's good to know that you can speak to her about this if you need to because it can be a pretty big step to admit to feeling depressed, but it can be made a bit easier if someone else has already approached you about it IYKWIM?

  4. #94

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    Thanks Tootie

    I think i just need to trust my own instinct.

    I definately feel that i want to see everyone again soon just not yet.

    Hopefully we will get pregnant again this month. I would be very excitied and happy if that happened. Well im going to be happy either way (just disappointed) because i have a wonderful husband and lots to be thankful for in my life.

    I will not rely on a new baby to make me happy but at least it will give me a brighter future. Im sure you understand what i mean.

    Love Sarah

  5. #95
    Melinda Guest

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    Hey Sarah,

    Yeah, trust your own instincts for now and see how you go. You can always come in here and have a bit more of a chat about things whenever you feel like it as you know. As I said before, it sounds like you're very in touch with your emotions and that's a really great thing.

    I'll keep all digits crossed that a wonderful new life comes to you and Rowan very soon and brings you the happiness you both long for and deserve!!

  6. #96

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    Hey Tootie,

    Thanks for the whole finger crossing thing!!!

    I had a talk to Rowan last night about all this. We had talked about it the night before but anyway. So he just says that firstly i need to take ALL of my behaviour into account - not just the thing that i know i am not doing too well at, he said that i also need to think about the things that i am doing well with - like going to the movies and keeping the house running well with dinners etc. He says that i have been through such a lot of trauma in the last couple of months and i kind of need to give myself a break. I guess after people started saying i was depressed i got even more down on myself.

    Also i was listening to Katelyn's song last night (the one that we played at her funeral) and i was crying and my mobile rang. It was one of Rowan's mates and i was able to switch off from Katelyn and talk to him pretty well. So i guess that is a good sign. Im more than happy to talk to people if they ring me its just hard to pick up the phone.

    So i am feeling alot happier today. I know in my heart that i am going to get through this and be alright. I just have to work on a few things more thats all. Sounds very positive (well i hope it does because thats how i feel today).

    Rowan also told me that i shouldnt rule out this cycle for a new baby because i dont really know what is going on. It could have been last cycle that was stuffed and this one could be normal......who knows all i can do is keep bd'ing and wait and see!!

    Hope you are doing well and not getting too uncomfortable. Not long for you now!

    Love Sarah

  7. #97

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    Last edited by Bec77; December 21st, 2007 at 08:02 PM.

  8. #98

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    Hey Becc,

    Thanks for your thoughts and no you are not too late. I am always willing to listen to whatever advice others can offer.

    Even though it is so sad and you never want another person to feel like this it is so nice to know that you are not abnormal. I think that is how i cope with things. I just think well i feel that way and that is how hundreds of other people have felt so it is ok i just try to accept my feelings for what they are at that particular time.

    Going back to work was extremely difficult. Can i share with you my experience of it?

    Well let me set the scene - i work in a small office with 11 staff. I am pretty close with most of the girls and they had been asking me quite alot about what it was like to be pregnant etc. They were always asking after me which is nice. A couple of days before we found out that Katelyn had died a few of us were looking at the pregnancy photos that i had taken (you know the same time every couple of weeks so i could see how much my belly had grown). There was one photo of Rowan and i that we took on the day we found out we were expecting. We just look so happy. Anyway that is slightly off track. Just trying to let you know what sort of relationship that we have. So because i also work with my mum and dad they had told everyone at the monday meeting after i Katelyn was born on the Sunday. I really didnt want anyone to know because it hurt too much but they had to know why i wasnt at work as i had left suddenly on friday (to go to the doctors for my appointment and not come back that day). Mum and Dad said that they just had their heads down but most of the girls had a tear etc. Well it took me 3 weeks to go in. I couldnt face everyone individually but one of the girls was leaving so i wanted to say goodbye to her. On the day that she left they had drinks after work so i just went in said hi to everyone and plonked myself down on the chair. That was honestly the hardest part and i took a deep breath before i did it. They could all see me sitting in the car anyway so i couldnt wimp out! The girl who was leaving, we talked about Katelyn a bit, i used to sit next to her so she was very upset. And another said that it will get easier (she has no kids by the way!!). I felt upset afterwards but at least i had done it - it was another thing out the way. Anyway i went back to work part time for a week (i just went in when i wanted to). I was there at starting time but left about 2 in the arvo when it just got too much. Then the next two weeks i was in canberra for a conference with my dad and then on holidays in Sydney and Melbourne for a week after that (DH flew over). We had already had that planned so we just continued but god it was so hard to leave her ashes behind for so long. Anyway going back to work again (6 weeks since Katelyn was born) was still hard but it has got much easier and i am definately back into the swing of things now. It is easy at work now. That is far too long sorry. All i was trying to say is that it was really hard at first but before you know it a few weeks have gone by and it is much better. Although i am on this site all the time to get me through the day!

    Probably the only tips that helped me was greating everyone at the same time so you dont have to make the small talk (keeping in mind it was only 3 weeks after she had died) and getting in early so people have to greet you not the other way around.

    The way that everyone dealt with it i found hard though. They basically didnt talk to me and kind of acted like i wasnt there. I know that they care i think they just thought that i looked so sad (and was on the verge of tears most of the time) that they didnt want to upset me anymore and they didnt know what to say anyway. It hurt that they reacted that way because i really wanted to talk about Katelyn at that point but i understand why they did it. They have all kind of relaxed now and treating me normally but i did feel like i had the plague for awhile.

    Well i hope that you are going well, do you have the sort of job that allows you to be flexible with your hours? The thing that i found hard was writing in my diary and completing dates in spreadsheets after the time that i would have been finishing work and being with Katelyn. I didnt really think about this much before hand, it still gets me but i am getting there.

    Love Sarah

  9. #99
    Melinda Guest

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    Sarah - what Rowan said about paying attention to things you are doing well at as opposed to those you aren't is a good point. It's always good to pinpoint those things that you are succeeding at as it does make you feel much better. It's nice to hear you sounding positive - I know times right now are very up and down, but when you have a good day and are feeling more positive about things, it really does make a difference! I am glad that you are feeling better about work too. It's hard when people around you don't know what to say and even worse can't look you in the eye (I found that really hard) because you feel the need to talk about your loss, but at the same time I used to struggle to find the words if someone did say something to me....probably more because they would just say 'oh well, it was natures way' - very silly comments! If they thought about it, I'm sure they'd realise and I know that most of them really didn't mean anything by it. It certainly doesn't make your loss any less to hear these kind of comments!

    Becc - you made a very important point when you said 'how could the world go on as normal' - that's how I felt too. I just couldn't understand and I'd literally shake my head as if to say 'it's just all wrong' - people going to work, going about their business and there I was feeling totally shattered. And you are right when you say that everybody grieves differently - there is no right way or wrong way, the most important thing is that you DO grieve. I'm glad you came in to share your thoughts on this because it's really imporant to reinforce these very important issues.

  10. #100

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    Hi Guys

    I have been thinking about the "whole world goes on" concept.

    I think that is why i dont really want to talk much to other people. The stuff that they have to say and the things that they ***** about just seem so petty and unimportant now. I dont mean to say that i dont care how my friends and family are feeling but my world collapsed the day that we found out that Katelyn had died and they continue to be like "im so tired or so and so said this and it got back to me" sometimes i just feel like saying - Do you think in a years time these things that you are going on about are going to matter. That sounds a bit cruel i guess.

    Becc - I definately know what the us against the world feeling is. Rowan and i had that too, that is a good way of describing it. He took a week and a half off work (which is huge because he is self employed with his dad as a partner that doesnt believe in taking a day off for anything) and we just did what we had to do for that time. It was great to have the support of each other to face whatever it was that came our way - like doctors appointments and friends coming over etc. Also when you said you have nothing to say to other people. That is exactly how i feel. The only thing that matters to me at the moment is still Katelyn and i find it a little difficult sometimes to make normal (ie non meaningful) conversation but i am getting better. I hope that when i talked about my experience of going back to work before didnt add to your fears i just wanted to let you know that for me it wasnt all smooth sailing but i got there and everything is very back to normal.

    Tootie - Thanks again for your excellent support and great advice as always. By the way whoever invented the "its natures way" comment should be shot. I get really angry when insensitive people say this because Katelyn was a healthy baby it was something wrong with me that meant she couldnt continue to grow. It wasnt her at all.

    Love Sarah

  11. #101

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    Last edited by Bec77; December 21st, 2007 at 08:02 PM.

  12. #102

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    Honesty Becc sometimes it feels as though you are reading my mind!!!

    A police officer hey - good job but sounds like you cant just take a couple of hours off if you need it. Im sure that the thinking about going back to worse is actually doing it. I can say that because i have done it. You seem very strong so im sure you will get through it too. Let me know when you decide a date and i will send you all my positive thoughts on that day. The first day will be the worst and the rest will slowly get better.

    Can i just say that Georgia has an identity to me. I know how much you loved her and im sure she was a beautiful child. I know what you saying about nobody askes what they look like. The only thing people ask me about Katelyn was how big was she. They are just being nosey about that though i think because she was so early.....I want to tell everyone about Katelyn too she was an individual person that deserves to be remembered in her own right just like Georgia does. Thats were naming your child helps i think.

    Thanks for the advice about the photo i am going to try and look at it that way from now on - i will think we will feel this way again very soon when we are blessed to conceive another baby.

    Love Sarah

  13. #103

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    Thanks Sarah O

    It really does take another mother (who has lost a baby) to understand doesn't it? I guess that's why the girls here are able to support each other so much. It's an unfortunate bond to share, but one all the same.

    I have a date for my return to work - 5 July. You will probably hear more freaking out from me as the day gets closer!

    I almost forgot...I have a little woohoo. We got a date for settlement for our new house today. We will soon have our own home!

    Anyway, have a great weekend. Chat again soon.

  14. #104

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    Becc,

    5th of July - I am going to write that in my diary. Not to far away. Well done on taking the step to go back to work. Im sure it was very difficult for you. But i know you will make it. You can talk to me about it anytime you want. I totally understand and am there for you.

    Excellent about the new house, Congratulations. When does it all happen?

    Hope you have a good weekend too talk to you next week.

    Sarah

  15. #105
    Melinda Guest

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    Sarah - yep, the ol' "natures way" comment is pretty ridiculous isn't it. I know most people didn't mean anything by it, but it certainly doesn't make your loss any less significant! Would I have loved my babies any less had there been something wrong? The answer is no!!

    Becc - yes I'm totally petrified 24/7. It's sad that I feel that way. I'm naturally a very anxious person by nature, but my experiences with PG obviously don't help how I feel and I continously worry that something will go wrong. It would be nice to wake up one day and feel good IYKWIM, as opposed to just downright scared. But yes, I am somewhat excited at the same time. I can't wait to meet our little tiger and hold him in my arms. It's less than 8w now which is just around the corner!

    I just wanted to add something to what you said about people avoiding talking about Georgia. A lot of people avoided the issue with us too and I too can understand that most people really don't know what to say - I mean, let's face it, it's not a situation that most of us are confronted with on a regular basis so how on earth would they really know what to say?! But I think not saying anything is really awful IYKWIM....a simple "I'm really sorry for your loss" or sending you a card to this effect is WAAAY better than nothing at all. And at least then you know that they are feeling for you IYKWIM? It makes it a little less awkward for you too because you don't feel like you need to try and avoid the issue then as they have at least mentioned it....am I making sense? LOL That's how I felt anyway. I sometimes felt like screaming at people when they avoided the issue because it felt like they couldn't accept that I had lost a BABY - a life.....just because they couldn't see it didn't mean it wasn't real.

  16. #106

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    Last edited by Bec77; December 21st, 2007 at 08:03 PM.

  17. #107

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    Hi Sarah

    I will keep my fingers croosed for you with TTC this month.

    Sorry i have not been in to say hello but things have been a bit bad this last week.

    Hope that you are doing alright i have been trying to keep up with what has been going on.

  18. #108
    Melinda Guest

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    Hey Becc,

    No you didn't come across as being too negative at all. It's fantastic to hear the wonderful things that people did for you both too. You are right when you say that there are some amazing people out there who do some wonderful things!! Some people can really surprise you too - people you least expect to do things for you or the people you least expect to hear from do really touching and thoughtful things - and they're the things that you never forget! So yeah, IKWYM about there being people who avoid the issue, but people out there who are simply incredibly kind and thoughtful!

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